A Republican who understands the importance of cities...

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

You clearly fail to grasp the differences in culture and attitude. You also ignore why people of similar socioeconomics in different countries or even different communities, don't share the same attitude. rather, you beat on about environment and circumstances. Once again, they are of the same socioeconomics, so why the totally different attitude and behavior?

Nevertheless, as per usual, you don't give any ideas of your own. You simply try to educate us on the why and leave it at that.

As with AJ you're refuting an argument I haven't made. Why do I "fail to grasp" it? I never denied that it doesn't exist.

What I asked you is whether you think this attitude exists because you believe that those people are irredeemable arseholes (and have been for generations), or if you believe that attitudes can change if the environment and the underlying social conditions change.

PIke, hate to be the bearer of bad news (again) but hip hop gangsta thuggery promoting ####### is not popular in most first world countries. In the countries that it is listened to, it's usually by a small group of wannabes; certainly not mainstream. Yet even something as simple as this you fail to grasp refuse to accept. Thought my like expose to violence, in your opinion you have stated before there is no link with aggressive behavior. Apparently kids who listen to thuggery hip hop end up Harvard scholars.

You're putting all this energy into these posts, but none of it answers the simple question I put to you.

[Heracles 417]

You're putting all this energy into these posts, but none of it answers the simple question I put to you.

Which as Charles pointed out, you demand answers but make none of your own; except broad-brushed statements like it's their environment and circumstances.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

BY, it's really quite simple.

If you don't believe that the attitudes of those people can be changed (by changing the environmental factors - such as dispersing the inner city population, as AJ indicated), then what exactly should be done with them?

Deportation?

Jail?

Execution?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Deportation?

Jail?

Execution?

Slavery?

[Heracles 417]

BY, it's really quite simple.

If you don't believe that the attitudes of those people can be changed (by changing the environmental factors - such as dispersing the inner city population, as AJ indicated), then what exactly should be done with them?

Deportation?

Jail?

Execution?

Dude, quite frankly these games with you are getting old. No matter what anyone posts, you will disagree with them. All while you don't post anything of your own. Well apart from the usual statements like I don't get the circumstances. After nearly five years I still have to ask, why do you even bother engaging in such discussions when you have no interest (even hypothetically) solving something? Much like Cleo, you both seem to get an enjoyment out of telling people they are wrong.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Which for almost three years now I am still waiting for someone to show me stats illustrating the people in similar socioeconomics in other first world countries that should also have similar crime stats. Furthermore, have also destroyed their neighborhoods and turned them into no-go zones. As I have also said before, find me a south Central in Sydney - a city of close to 5 million. They have crime but nowhere near what is gong on here in the US.

To deny that socioeconomic conditions don't play a part in crime and the status of our urban ghettos is just plain ignorant. I don't deny that the ghetto culture plays a part in perpetuating itself to each successive generation. But that is not the only cause of it. I'll not do your homework for you. If you want to read up on it, here is a good start HERE

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Are you for real? How can you deny the US high crime rate when compared to every other first world country?

Dude per capita (per 100,000) Aus has 78% less Homicides than the US. How can you then claim the crime is overblown?

Does the US have no-go zones? Yes or No. Are there places you cannot go at night? Yes or No. Sorry but neither such places exist in any Australian major city.

on the other hand, the odds are better for my wife to be raped, my house to be broken into, and my car to be stolen in Australia.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Dude, quite frankly these games with you are getting old. No matter what anyone posts, you will disagree with them. All while you don't post anything of your own. Well apart from the usual statements like I don't get the circumstances. After nearly five years I still have to ask, why do you even bother engaging in such discussions when you have no interest (even hypothetically) solving something? Much like Cleo, you both seem to get an enjoyment out of telling people they are wrong.

How is this a game?

If you don't believe that the attitudes of those people can be changed (by changing the environmental factors - such as dispersing the inner city population, as AJ indicated), then what exactly should be done with them?

You keep talking about people with bad attitudes, how do you propose that these attitudes be changed?

[Heracles 417]

To deny that socioeconomic conditions don't play a part in crime and the status of our urban ghettos is just plain ignorant. I don't deny that the ghetto culture plays a part in perpetuating itself to each successive generation. But that is not the only cause of it. I'll not do your homework for you. If you want to read up on it, here is a good start HERE

It's you guys who make claim about the poor of other nations behaving the same, yet want to me backup your claims.

Next

Edited May 6, 2010 by Booyah!

[Heracles 417]

on the other hand, the odds are better for my wife to be raped, my house to be broken into, and my car to be stolen in Australia.

The other two are possibly correct but the first assumption is wrong and has already been discredited. In summary, they classify a whole range of sexual crimes together rather than just rape. Actually the US does this with a range of stats, as has been pointed out before. In other words, tries to make itself look better. E.G. Someone earning three times more than the US minimum is considered as living in poverty. Apparently someone earning over $15k here is not in poverty.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Booyah!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It's you guys who make claim about the poor of other nations behaving the same, yet want to me backup your claims.

Next

I believe the claim is actually that similar social problems exist among deprived populations. That isn't untrue.

[Heracles 417]

I believe the claim is actually that similar social problems exist among deprived populations. That isn't untrue.

Actually that was not the claim at all. The claim was that if we looked at various similar socioeconomics in other countries, they too would live in no-go run down areas, with similar per capita levels of crime to that of those here. Whereas, I disagree. I have been safer in various third world countries than I would in a US ghetto.

These people are not doing drive by or shooting up people hourly because they are poor. Considering bullets and guns are not exactly cheap. Though I do enjoy your dodging the question regarding why they cannot buy those tools aforementioned for $50 to renovate or simply take care of their area. Sure as hell have a lot of time on their hands, thus the chilling at inner-city street corners.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Booyah!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Actually that was not the claim at all. The claim was that if we looked at various similar socioeconomics in other countries, they too would live in no-go run down areas, with similar per capita levels of crime to that of those here. Whereas, I disagree. I have been safer in various third world countries than I would in a US ghetto.

There are a lot of interrelated factors at work - one of which is poverty. But it is not the only one.

I can point you to some pretty bad areas in London, Birmingham, Manchester or Paris - if you're game to have a look.

Paris in particular has a very similar situation to what goes on in many US inner cities.

[Heracles 417]

There are a lot of interrelated factors at work - one of which is poverty. But it is not the only one.

I can point you to some pretty bad areas in London, Birmingham, Manchester or Paris - if you're game to have a look.

Paris in particular has a very similar situation to what goes on in many US inner cities.

Are the areas in France predominantly immigrant in nature?

France's homicide rate is actually lower than the UK, almost as low as Australia's.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Booyah!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Are these immigrant areas?

France's homicide rate is actually lower than the UK, almost as low as Australia's.

I'm talking about Paris, not the whole country.

In Paris the suburbs are the ghetto - tourists only visit the city center. The French government is actually trying to address the problem by building up public transport out to those regions in the hope of ensuring better integration.