Students sent home for wearing American flags

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

That's not the point I'm making. Wearing the shirts in solidarity on that particular day was perceived by the school as a taunt and out of concern for the safety of their students, in light of the racial tensions going on this country over immigration, decided they would extinguish the fire even if it was only smoke. Had I been the VP, would I have made those students change their shirts or go home? Probably not. Instead, I would have brought both sides together in room and let them talk it out in a civil manner to ease any tensions. We don't need another school tragedy. I don't agree with VP's decision but I don't blame him either for putting the safety of his school campus first.

Again where is the racial taunt when 50% of the students wearing the American flag were mexican-american?

IE why is a racial taunt if Mexican-Americans where the US flag instead of the mexican flag.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Again where is the racial taunt when 50% of the students wearing the American flag were mexican-american?

IE why is a racial taunt if Mexican-Americans where the US flag instead of the mexican flag.

I heard an interview with several of the kids on the radio today. They were taunting. I think the school acted wrongly myself, but I would also give some benefit of the doubt to the school administrators on the scene.

Given the tone of just certain VJ'rs, let alone many others across the nation, I also believe I understand how this situation appeared more dangerous than the simple wearing of the American flag or flag-like apparel sounds.

Edited May 8, 2010 by ready4ONE

[ScratchIt 12]

You're angry about that, I get it. But you're losing sight of the real issue.

As I see it this is simply a question of whether or not the teacher's decision was correct based on his understanding of the school and the student population. Perhaps it was correct, perhaps it wasn't.

My point is that the teacher shouldn't have been put in the situation where he had to make that decision and put the school at the center of a media circus. Assuming of course that there is a problem in the student population over nationalist imagery...

He wasn't a teacher, he was the school's Assistant Principal, Miguel Rodriguez, and I may be wrong here but that was his job as an administrator at the school to make that call, then the School Board backed it up, firmly cementing policy.

That being said...

What is next? Reciting the following on the 5th of May?

Bandera de México,

Legado de Nuestros Héroes,

Símbolo de la Unidad

de nuestros Padres

y de nuestros Hermanos.

Te prometemos:

Ser siempre fieles

a los principios de

la libertad y la justicia,

que hacen de Nuestra

Patria la Nación

Independiente, humana

y generosa a la que

entregamos nuestra

existencia.

...or this on March 17th? (yes I know it's not the real pledge...)

We are willing to fight for the flag we love,

Be the chances great or small.

We are willing to fight for the flag above,

Be the chances nothing at all.

Then success to bold Saint Patrick's fist.

He was a saint so clever.

He gave the snakes and toads a twist.

And banished them forever.

If our schools are teaching that displaying the American flag is an incitement to riot then we may as well through in the towel now. I can see this leading all sorts of directions. I agree with the idea of school uniforms. Wore them often in my school years. But what comes next? Will schools allow the wearing of "colors" at school sporting events? Will it become the white/black uniform v. black/white uniform teams? I hope not. There is a lot to be said for school pride. I'd hate to see it get taken away by people who think that having an Indian for a mascot is crossing the line. Look at our Pledge of Allegiance - never mind the "One nation under God" line being changed, will we continue to recite the Pledge of Allegiance at all?

If you come to America, expect to need to learn English, it is what we speak, expect to see the American flag for it is our Flag, and expect a rash of ####### if you disrespect the Flag. If you are American, don't burn it or piss on it, for it is the very symbol of what gives you the rights and freedoms you have as an American, find other ways to protest our crazy system. The Flag offers you protection and if you desecrate it, those protections should not be afforded to the violator. Try that trick in Russia and see where it gets you! You can think about it as you recuperate in the hospital.

You do not have to give up your heritage. You do not have to stop being who you were/are. But you are on American soil and you do need to remember that you are in our house and please leave your muddy shoes at the door. Imagine someone coming over to your house as guests to watch the Superbowl (or whatever) and right in the middle of the game they get up and change the channel so they can watch the Fasching Parade live from Munich. You just don't do it. It's called respect, something there is far too little of any more.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Assistant Principals are teachers too.

In any case I think you're getting upset about this unnecessarily, which incidentally is exactly the point of this kind of article.

As far as I am concerned, the rules in place at that school were unfair and need to be addressed to ensure fairness to all the students. I would expect that this incident will cause the school to review its internal procedures and either the teacher will be admonished for making a bad call or any display of nationalist imagery on school property will be prohibited.

I am looking at this from a purely practical point of view, not an idealistic one.

[mawilson 2,133]

All 5 students happened to wear clothing with the same imagery on it, on the same day. Sounds deliberate to me.

So what if it's deliberate? You can't deliberately wear an American flag in America?

[Jenn! 918]

You can't just remove the context from the event though. What about disrupting class to recite the pledge of allegiance? Would we be outraged if a student were reprimanded for their patriotism in that circumstance as well?

You can't just do whatever you want in school as long as it's a patriotic gesture.

[ScratchIt 12]

Assistant Principals are teachers too.

In any case I think you're getting upset about this unnecessarily, which incidentally is exactly the point of this kind of article.

As far as I am concerned, the rules in place at that school were unfair and need to be addressed to ensure fairness to all the students. I would expect that this incident will cause the school to review its internal procedures and either the teacher will be admonished for making a bad call or any display of nationalist imagery on school property will be prohibited.

I am looking at this from a purely practical point of view, not an idealistic one.

Not upset, confused that someone would claim this guy was "put in the situation where he had to make that decision". It's his job. His position at the school is Assistant Principal, not teacher. There is a vast difference in job description, duties and responsibilities, however it sounds like we may be on the same page about the "rules" as you call them. To me it sounds less like "rules" and more like a judgment call, and a bad one at that. The guy is lucky his reaction to the situation did not spark a riot.

Your comment, "any display of nationalist imagery on school property will be prohibited" is interesting in that it begs the question of how far will they go to remove the American flag from school property on 5/5? Where do you draw the line? Kids wearing shirts? The school flagpole? I hardly see my previous post as idealistic. I am not asking everyone to sing Kumbayah. In an American public school, on American soil, the American flag trumps all others, says so in the US Code (4USC8). Practical, practiced and patriotic - period. Cases like this go to the Supreme Court and when they decide that in an American school on American soil, the American flag takes second place to the Mexican flag or the Irish flag or any other, then I will pack my stuff and move to a country where respect still means something. I think it far more likely that uniforms will be mandated and celebrations like St Patrick's Day and Cinco de Mayo will be proscribed. We are becoming the country of the ridiculously absurd.

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

I havent read anywhere that the American flag that is in every class room pissed anyone off. Seems that a few are itching for a fight!

[ScratchIt 12]

You can't just remove the context from the event though. What about disrupting class to recite the pledge of allegiance? Would we be outraged if a student were reprimanded for their patriotism in that circumstance as well?

You can't just do whatever you want in school as long as it's a patriotic gesture.

That was not the issue in the OP. The issue is why 5 students wearing USA flags were reprimanded and forced to remove the American flag. "You can't just do whatever you want in school as long as it's a patriotic gesture." By the same token, you can't do something just because you feel like it, like ordering 5 students to remove apparel printed with the American flag just because you think it is inciting a riot. Show me the law or school policy they violated and let's take it from there.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

That was not the issue in the OP. The issue is why 5 students wearing USA flags were reprimanded and forced to remove the American flag. "You can't just do whatever you want in school as long as it's a patriotic gesture." By the same token, you can't do something just because you feel like it, like ordering 5 students to remove apparel printed with the American flag just because you think it is inciting a riot. Show me the law or school policy they violated and let's take it from there.

School administration has the authority to tell their students what is or isn't appropriate wear for various reasons. Although I don't agree with the VP's decision here (I think he should have brought students from both sides and had them talk it out), he didn't infringe on the students' civil rights. I'd be interested to hear what the ACLU has said or might say about this case. There have been several similar cases that involved schools telling students what they could or couldn't wear.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

ACLU of San Diego Defends 15-Year-Old High School Honors Student Disciplined for Wearing an American Flag in Her Back Pocket

SAN DIEGO -- Fallbrook Union High School officials violated the First Amendment when they ordered 15-year-old honors student Malia Fontana to remove the small American flag she was carrying in her back pocket, the American Civil Liberties Union of San Diego and Imperial Counties said in a letter delivered to the school today.

"The school had no right to stop Malia from wearing her flag," said ACLU of San Diego and Imperial Counties Executive Director Kevin Keenan. "When schools discipline students for protected First Amendment activity, they not only break the law, they also miss out on a teachable moment."

The ACLU's letter calls on the San Diego County school district to stop its practice of censoring students' wearing of flags and comply with the constitutional protection of student speech laid out in the landmark 1969 U.S. Supreme Court case Tinker v. Des Moines, which affirmed the right of students to wear black armbands in protest of the Vietnam War. The letter also demands that the school clear Malia's school record and provide a written apology to Malia and her mother.

In a statement, Malia Fontana, a sophomore, said she wore her back-pocket flag to protest the censorship of a classmate who last month was forced to remove an American flag headband he was wearing. When Malia questioned a school security guard who told her to remove her own flag, she was escorted to the assistant principal's office and written up in an incident report. The following week, Malia's mother, Nikki Fontana, learned that although the school would not require Malia to serve detention, the report would remain in her daughter's file until six months after graduation. Ms. Fontana, a secretary for a general contracting company, said she was troubled that her daughter - who has never had any discipline problems and maintains top grades - has received this black mark on her record.

http://www.aclu.org/free-speech/aclu-san-diego-defends-15-year-old-high-school-honors-student-disciplined-wearing-americ

......

Very interesting.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

... I think he should have brought students from both sides and had them talk it out ...

*yawn* that sounds boring.

[SMOKE 1,426]

That was not the issue in the OP. The issue is why 5 students wearing USA flags were reprimanded and forced to remove the American flag. "You can't just do whatever you want in school as long as it's a patriotic gesture." By the same token, you can't do something just because you feel like it, like ordering 5 students to remove apparel printed with the American flag just because you think it is inciting a riot. Show me the law or school policy they violated and let's take it from there.

you won't get that. what we did get was Assistant Principal Miguel Rodriguez's racial bias on display.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

you won't get that. what we did get was Assistant Principal Miguel Rodriguez's racial bias on display.

[SMOKE 1,426]

School administration has the authority to tell their students what is or isn't appropriate wear for various reasons. Although I don't agree with the VP's decision here (I think he should have brought students from both sides and had them talk it out), he didn't infringe on the students' civil rights. I'd be interested to hear what the ACLU has said or might say about this case. There have been several similar cases that involved schools telling students what they could or couldn't wear.

do you have an example of this involving an American flag inside the United States of America?