Arizonans and The Nation Torn On Immigration Bill

[Heracles 417]

You do know that the border isn't some mysterious no man's land. It actually straddles towns and businesses.

How about 100 feet then? Therefore, anyone with 100 feet of a border can be asked to prove status.

So 100 feet out of 105,773,465,318,400 sq feet - Total Area of the USA

Again, rationality has left this thread. Enjoy.

If we had your rationale we'd remove the border and sing songs holding hands.

Edited April 28, 2010 by Booyah!

[spookyturtle 9,466]

How about 100 feet then? Therefore, anyone with 100 feet of a border can be asked to prove status.

So 100 feet out of 105,773,465,318,400 sq feet - Total Area of the USA

If we had your rationale we'd remove the border and sing songs holding hands.

We could sing Kumbaya.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

If people are here ILLEGALLY no matter how "nice" they may be they are CRIMINALS and should be treated as such.

Actually, no. Illegal presence is not a crime. We've covered that.

[Peikko 1,575]

How about 100 feet then? Therefore, anyone with 100 feet of a border can be asked to prove status.

So 100 feet out of 105,773,465,318,400 sq feet - Total Area of the USA

If we had your rationale we'd remove the border and sing songs holding hands.

And you make that statement based on what? That's right, the voices in your head That's not me BY, that's you.

[Heracles 417]

And you make that statement based on what? That's right, the voices in your head That's not me BY, that's you.

Cleo I know you better than the back of my hand. We're bosom buddies. Alright, 75 feet then.

HeY HeY google maps now covers Mexico. Wow, look at just how close they build up to the border.

Google Site 1

Google Site 2

Google Site 3

Google Site 4

No border at all

Google Site 5

Google Site 6

Google Site 7

Even a 10 year old can get over those borders. Yet once in, some advocate no policing whatsoever. Look at these damn pics and then come tell me there should not be any extra enforcement.

I take my earlier number back. 1,000 feet from the border should warrant a random ID check.

Edited April 28, 2010 by Booyah!

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Cleo I know you better than the back of my hand. We're bosom buddies. Alright, 75 feet then.

HeY HeY google maps now covers Mexico. Wow, look at just how close they build up to the border.

Google Site 1

Google Site 2

Google Site 3

Google Site 4

No border at all

Google Site 5

Google Site 6

Google Site 7

Even a 10 year old can get over those borders. Yet once in, some advocate no policing whatsoever. Look at these damn pics and then come tell me there should not be any extra enforcement.

I take my earlier number back. 1,000 feet from the border should warrant a random ID check.

I think what MC is getting at is that their are homes within a few feet of the border. How would that feel?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

"Undocumented advocates" which must be a new term for racist slavemongering have to sound moronic. they ARE moronic.

They are basically saying they want the minimum wage repealed for brown people. They want to do away with all the laws we have to provide for safe workplaces, fair pay, retirement, health care, life insurance, workman's comp, etc (the list goes on and on)for illegal slaves brought into this country to serve the profit motives of business and the political motives of racists who desire an economic underclass.

We need to protect people from this exploitation by making laws to severly pounish beusiness that employ illegals. Impose draconian taxes for the practice, sieze property in lieu of taxes and make it impractical to employ slaves.

People need to understand that all the laws we pass protecting workers are being usurped by the exploitation and abuse of illegal aliens. who among the "undocumented advocate morons" wants to repeal the minimum wage? Who wants to repeal the family and medical leave act? Who wants to repeal OSHA? Yet that is what they do when the support the employment of slaves.

They protect the 4th amendment rights of an undocumented worker. Where are they when he is sent to work on the roof without a safety harness, no medical insurance, no worklman's comp. or SS disability for his family if he is injured, he is not paid minimum wage. Would you allow this to be the conditions your wife works under? Your husband? Your child? Do we want this to be the condition ANY person works under in this country? THIS is what happens. Why? So a contractor can pocket more money...greed. So you can buy cheaper lettuce or get your lawn mowed cheap...greed. So a politician can garner votes from dependent constituents...greed.

It is disgusting. It is racism at its highest peak.

We need to make it impossible, economically impossible, to employ slave labor in this country. This, and ONLY this will end the problem of illegal immigration and human exploitation for greed in this country.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

2000 miles of border to fence... Still have water on both sides of said fence... Untold numbers already here in the USA roaming free... Quite a few caught and in jail, in various stages of deportation... Let's drop everything and get them all out! Damn the cost in time, resources, and individual rights of legal citizens and visitors!!! Forget about the futility unless we become a totalitarian police state, and let's get going!!!

BooYah said it would be so eaaaaaaaaaaaaasy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Heracles 417]

I think what MC is getting at is that their are homes within a few feet of the border. How would that feel?

Those shoots of the US from Mexico are eyebrow raising. It's just way to easy to jump the border. It's absolutely insane to think that at the very least, those points I mentioned earlier have not been implement. Clearly rounding anyone up alone with do nothing, as they can just jump straight back over 10 or 20 miles away.

It's also crazy to assume the any potential terrorist are going to waste time coming in legally when they can literally walk straight into the US from Mexico.

[Heracles 417]

2000 miles of border to fence... Still have water on both sides of said fence... Untold numbers already here in the USA roaming free... Quite a few caught and in jail, in various stages of deportation... Let's drop everything and get them all out! Damn the cost in time, resources, and individual rights of legal citizens and visitors!!! Forget about the futility unless we become a totalitarian police state, and let's get going!!!

BooYah said it would be so eaaaaaaaaaaaaasy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We'd have to setup checkpoints every 50 feet to patrol that sort of border. The reality is that at present, there is a great incentive for then to get their azz to the US. There is little enforcement across the board. Realistically even with AZ's new law, as long as they stay under the raider they are free to move about, work etc. After looking at various shots from within Mexico, AZ's law is as pointless as handgun bans in specific cities; they will simply enter further down the line.

PS No wonder the war on drugs failed.

Edited April 28, 2010 by Booyah!

[Heracles 417]

"Undocumented advocates" which must be a new term for racist slavemongering have to sound moronic. they ARE moronic.

...

We need to make it impossible, economically impossible, to employ slave labor in this country. This, and ONLY this will end the problem of illegal immigration and human exploitation for greed in this country.

The chickens are coming home to roost for the rest: 3,400,000 white collar jobs with $151B in annual wages will leave U.S. for low wage countries by 2015

I am happy that the poor will benefit in these other countries. Surely the folks here who advocate for millions more people don't have a problem with this either right. That is, their jobs going bye bye..

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

The chickens are coming home to roost for the rest: 3,400,000 white collar jobs with $151B in annual wages will leave U.S. for low wage countries by 2015

I am happy that the poor will benefit in these other countries. Surely the folks here who advocate for millions more people don't have a problem with this either right. That is, their jobs going bye bye..

Implement the FAIR TAX and no one will be able to keep jobs out of this country.

Implement a draconian, oppressive tax on the employment of slave laborers (also known as "undocumented workers", but could be known as "underpaid workers" or "unprotected workers" or even "exploited workers") and the problem of illegal immigration will evaporate.

Instead we pass laws increasing the cost of employing Americans and look the other way when employers hire slaves instead, then we raise taxes on business and look the other way as they flee the country and then try to tax the remaining ones MORE. Brilliant. The fact we elect these people puts into serious question the intelligence of over half the population. Do not even ask an American to name a country begining with the letter "U". (hint...74% answered "Yugoslavia") At least if we had a dictatorship we could say it wasn't our fault!

The chickens are coming home to roost for the rest: 3,400,000 white collar jobs with $151B in annual wages will leave U.S. for low wage countries by 2015

I am happy that the poor will benefit in these other countries. Surely the folks here who advocate for millions more people don't have a problem with this either right. That is, their jobs going bye bye..

Implement the FAIR TAX and no one will be able to keep jobs out of this country.

Implement a draconian, oppressive tax on the employment of slave laborers (also known as "undocumented workers", but could be known as "underpaid workers" or "unprotected workers" or even "exploited workers") and the problem of illegal immigration will evaporate.

Instead we pass laws increasing the cost of employing Americans and look the other way when employers hire slaves instead, then we raise taxes on business and look the other way as they flee the country and then try to tax the remaining ones MORE. Brilliant. The fact we elect these people puts into serious question the intelligence of over half the population. Do not even ask an American to name a country begining with the letter "U". (hint...74% answered "Yugoslavia") At least if we had a dictatorship we could say it wasn't our fault!

The chickens are coming home to roost for the rest: 3,400,000 white collar jobs with $151B in annual wages will leave U.S. for low wage countries by 2015

I am happy that the poor will benefit in these other countries. Surely the folks here who advocate for millions more people don't have a problem with this either right. That is, their jobs going bye bye..

Implement the FAIR TAX and no one will be able to keep jobs out of this country.

Implement a draconian, oppressive tax on the employment of slave laborers (also known as "undocumented workers", but could be known as "underpaid workers" or "unprotected workers" or even "exploited workers") and the problem of illegal immigration will evaporate.

Instead we pass laws increasing the cost of employing Americans and look the other way when employers hire slaves instead, then we raise taxes on business and look the other way as they flee the country and then try to tax the remaining ones MORE. Brilliant. The fact we elect these people puts into serious question the intelligence of over half the population. Do not even ask an American to name a country begining with the letter "U". (hint...74% answered "Yugoslavia") At least if we had a dictatorship we could say it wasn't our fault!

Sorry. Don't know what happened. The computer went to "full auto" and it got away from me.

[_Simpson_ 250]

Again Simpson, the laws I referred to in the UK were not drafted with the explicit intent of harassing or otherwise villainising racial minorities, the only time that happens is in a fascist or totalitarian state. Again its the unintended consequences that come out of them and the conditions that they create in a climate where it is politically important that they be seen to be effective.

Illegal immigration is a political issue, this law made big headlines and gave big publicity to the politicians who came up with it.

You're asking questions the answer to which is self-evident. Police forces have always been under pressure from politicians at the local level to deliver results that make elected officials look good - especially when those politicians make bold election promises about cutting the crime rate or to take a stand against illegal immigration.

Arrest quotas already exist. It's why we have creative accounting on crime statistics to make certain crimes appear less frequent than they really are.

All laws have unattended consequences so thats irrelevant unless you can prove that it would be abused on a huge scale. Why do you think it would happen on a huge scale?

Yes arrest quotas already exist but are not directed to specific laws. Your political pressure argument could made for any law that officers enforce. So why single out this one.

[TBoneTX 46,294]

If it occurs that local or state law officers end up detaining people for undue periods of time (not defined, but generally accepted to be a certain duration) while waiting for information from the Feds, we could learn the true power (or lack thereof) of the phrase "Officer, I wish to leave now; am I free to go?"

With luck, tonight I'll post more information about the time frames. I expect to find it.

[_Simpson_ 250]

No, not my problem with it. If only illegal aliens were negatively impacted by this law then fine, but that is far from likely in this case, what is more, as I have also stated, it will also not achieve any significant shift in the proportion of illegal aliens in the state UNLESS the law is abused. Most illegal aliens do not run around acting suspiciously and drawing attention to themselves and that's not going to change with this new law.

That not much of a argument because many laws in place negatively impact people it shouldn't, the degree in which it would becomes the real question.

So lets say there isn't any significant shift in the proportion of illegal aliens, its one thing to say it wouldn't be effective its another thing to say that certain races will be discriminated against.

Edited April 28, 2010 by _Simpson_