'Reprehensible': Cantor Condemns Dems for Using Violent Incidents for Political Gain

[Pooky 3,847]

I just think its nice for a change to see America spending money on it's people, to make it a better place to live and not on things that go on outside their own borders, like starting wars for example. On a side note the current health care system was already gulping up 1/6th of your economy and in a few more years increasing to 1/5th. Passing Health Care Legislation was important for the Economy and for the future of your country. What this whole debate has shown me is this the Republican Party are just not interested in improving the lives of the average American out there. They are too busy lining their own pockets in conjunction with big money corporations.

And mandating that people buy private insurance isn't just another way of doing that, but this time backed by the force of "law". I wonder how many Democrats hold health insurance company stocks?

[DukeOfYork 28]

You want to discuss anything material or is hypothetical ####### all you've got left?

The point is, you can't buy what you can't afford. The numbers on this are the best case scenario and since they don't include the "doctor fix", this law (as you like to point out) will put us in the red.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The point is, you can't buy what you can't afford. The numbers on this are the best case scenario and since they don't include the "doctor fix", this law (as you like to point out) will put us in the red.

Insurance works by pooling risk. Private insurance remains profitable because with enough people insured, those who need more medical treatment than what they've paid for will get it, as others essentially pay for their treatment. That is how insurance works.

[DukeOfYork 28]

I know how insurance works. I work for an insurance company (you've probably heard of us).

The costs and "subsidies" and high taxes of this plan will not put us in the black, will not even come close to cutting the deficit. Anyone who tells you differently is lying through their teeth.

In the end though, the big winners may have been the insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies Obama had so much fun demonizing.

As it stands now, insurance companies have very low profit margins. Some of the highest profit margins are around 4%. If Obama wanted to lower costs, he picked on the wrong industry.

[DukeOfYork 28]

I just found a very interesting article that addresses the reason for the high costs of healthcare in this country.

It reinforces my argument that insurance companies were not the right industry to demonize. We (including insurance companies) just flat out pay far too much for our health care. Obama would have done better to go after the reasons why costs are so high and fix them. Instead, he ignored them.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/11/an_insurance_industry_ceo_expl.html

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I know how insurance works. I work for an insurance company (you've probably heard of us).

The costs and "subsidies" and high taxes of this plan will not put us in the black, will not even come close to cutting the deficit. Anyone who tells you differently is lying through their teeth.

In the end though, the big winners may have been the insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies Obama had so much fun demonizing.

As it stands now, insurance companies have very low profit margins. Some of the highest profit margins are around 4%. If Obama wanted to lower costs, he picked on the wrong industry.

It will reduce the deficit by $143 billion over the first ten years. That is an updated CBO estimate. Their first preliminary estimate said it would reduce the deficit by $130 billion over ten years. Would reduce the deficit by $1.2 trillion dollars in the second ten years.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

The point is, you can't buy what you can't afford. The numbers on this are the best case scenario and since they don't include the "doctor fix", this law (as you like to point out) will put us in the red.

We can't is afford to go on pretending that if we just ignore the cancer that our current health care system is to our overall economy long enough it'll somehow cure itself. It won't.

This bill will put us in the red? That statement presumes that we're not in the red already. Newsflash: We are. And we have been ever since the fiscally conservative - or was it fiscally responsible? - GOP put us into it.

[DukeOfYork 28]

This bill will put us in the red? That statement presumes that we're not in the red already. Newsflash: We are. And we have been ever since the fiscally conservative - or was it fiscally responsible? - GOP put us into it.

They promised it would cut the deficit, but the final CBO score said it won't (if you count the doctor fix, which will be added later). It was absolute dishonesty.

I agree with you that the rate at which health care costs are going is unsustainable. I just don't feel that Obama and Congress addressed the reasons behind the high cost in medicine, ie. tort reform, defensive medicine, etc.

[Danno 1,228]

I just found a very interesting article that addresses the reason for the high costs of healthcare in this country.

It reinforces my argument that insurance companies were not the right industry to demonize. We (including insurance companies) just flat out pay far too much for our health care. Obama would have done better to go after the reasons why costs are so high and fix them. Instead, he ignored them.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/11/an_insurance_industry_ceo_expl.html

Obama had two goals concerning HC and the both complimented each other.

1. Bring HC closer to being Run by Government.

2. make sure every person had healthcare.

Nothing is fixed.... it's a simple plan of moving costs from some people to other people and some cost is paid now some will be added to the Ballooning debt.

But nothing was fixed and nothing will be cheaper, can anyone here claim they believe Insurance costs or medical costs will be less in 5- 10 years.... anyone?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

They promised it would cut the deficit, but the final CBO score said it won't (if you count the doctor fix, which will be added later). It was absolute dishonesty.

I agree with you that the rate at which health care costs are going is unsustainable. I just don't feel that Obama and Congress addressed the reasons behind the high cost in medicine, ie. tort reform, defensive medicine, etc.

It's not really an honest approach to take the doc fix into the calculus. That price was to be paid one way or another - i.e. the cost is incurred with or without the health reform measure. By that calculation method, no measure would ever be a cost saver since you can just slap any already existing spending onto the tab.

Drop that tort reform fetish. Medical liability - defensive medicine and all - accounts for a half a percent of health care spending.

Edited March 27, 2010 by Mr. Big Dog

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Drop that tort reform fetish. Medical liability - defensive medicine and all - accounts for a half a percent of health care spending.

Besides, we don't have to worry about malpractice reform anymore. With the formations of the Commission on Best Practices and Procedures, doctors won't have to worry about lawsuits, as long as they just follow the government guidelines. Actually, this part is really nothing new, as the CDC already proscribes treatments for many conditions, and many HMO's, PPO's, and insurance companies already make those determinations. Soon there will be no need for doctors do anything but do what the computer software tells them to do.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

many HMO's, PPO's, and insurance companies already make those determinations...

You mean health care decisions aren't made between the doctor and the patient? Hmmm...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Soon there will be no need for doctors do anything but do what the computer software tells them to do.

Heck, you won't even need a doctor....you'll just Google do-it-yourself medical procedures.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You mean health care decisions aren't made between the doctor and the patient? Hmmm...

Not if you have Kaiser. What the doctor can actually do is limited by what they are allowed to do. I lost a great doctor, because she got frustrated with the HMO's policies. Look for Kaiser to be the model for future healthcare in the US. It's not that bad, really.