Teachers union claims they're worried about the children, but this proves they're not....

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I don't believe in the bailouts of the airlines, auto industry, wall street, etc..

In a good economy things must fail and they must die for the next big thing to grab hold and for others to have a chance at success. Sure, the pain of the failure will be felt, but it also breeds opportunity and at the same time keeps a worn bubble from bursting much worse the next time. You can keep patching it all you want, but eventually you won't be able to stop the inevitible downfall.

Blah, blah, blah. The bailouts worked. The Street is hiring again and making money. You guys were wrong.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Blah, blah, blah. The bailouts worked. The Street is hiring again and making money. You guys were wrong.

lol, as I said. You can only patch something for so long. The inevitable is coming and it will be much worse than before.

There are two scenarios I could think of off the top of my head that would cause a full market collapse, and both are feasible in the near future. Both are dependant on the balls of a nation and the other the greed of a certain bank.

Of course, once the new tax kicks in here in a year as well, that will do some harm to the markets as well. Obama got his capital gains tax increase because the douche doesn't understand that the lower the tax, the more investments there are, and then the more the government makes, but w/e..

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Obama got his capital gains tax increase because the douche doesn't understand that the lower the tax, the more investments there are, and then the more the government makes, but w/e..

This country has been very prosperous in the past with higher tax rates than today. People like you think post-Reagan American economic history is all there is. Tax rates are just one tiny piece of the puzzle. A much bigger, much more systemic, flaw in contemporary America is the poor educational state of our citizenry.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

“Gov. Christie has called on school employees to voluntarily subsidize school district budgets in order to make up for the cuts he has imposed already this year, and those he intends to impose in next year’s budget.

“In New Jersey, school employees’ contracts are negotiated locally, and each local association may decide whether or not to reopen its settled contract. However, NJEA members will not be bullied by this governor into paying for his misguided priorities. Despite his preposterous claim that state funding for education has actually increased, the truth is that the governor has slashed more than $1.3 billion from direct aid to local districts through his executive order last month and the budget he proposed earlier this month. Those are his priorities, and he is responsible for their consequences.

“We are dismayed at this governor’s priorities and tactics. He has rejected out of hand the possibility of extending a surtax on the state’s wealthiest residents; those individuals making more than $400,000 per year. Under the surtax, they were asked to pay an additional tax on any income over $400,000. That tax amounted to well under 1.5 percent of their total income, but generated enough revenue to fill a large portion of the gap in the governor’s education budget.

“Instead, Gov. Christie proposes that all school employees in New Jersey contribute 1.5 percent of their far more modest incomes to fill the education funding gap that his priorities have created. The total impact on income is much greater, since they are also asked to forgo a portion of their contractually negotiated salary. This is a wrong-headed attack on the incomes of middle and working-class New Jersey residents. It is wrong to ask the women and men who work in our schools to take a hit to their incomes while he refuses to ask the same of the wealthiest people in the state.

“In his typical fashion, Gov. Christie is talking at school employees, not with them. He shared his letter with the media well before he shared it with NJEA. If Gov. Christie would ever like to have a genuine discussion, conducted face to face among serious people, rather than through press releases and media stunts, we stand ready to meet with him. But we will not stand by while he attempts to coerce school employees into bearing the full burden of his wrong-headed educational priorities.”

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Gov. Christie proposes that all school employees in New Jersey contribute 1.5 percent of their far more modest incomes...

Their peers in the private schools contribute well over 1.5%. Their fellow citizens in the private sector at large either don't get the benefit at all or contribute much more, at all income levels. What the hell makes them so special?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

This country has been very prosperous in the past with higher tax rates than today. People like you think post-Reagan American economic history is all there is. Tax rates are just one tiny piece of the puzzle. A much bigger, much more systemic, flaw in contemporary America is the poor educational state of our citizenry.

I'll give you that one. Of course we can blame the space race in the 60's and the restructuring of our educational system on that one.

As far as the prosperous markets go, I'm not saying the markets aren't prosperous. All I'm saying is every time the capital gains tax is lowered, the government makes more money, when it's raised, the government loses money.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I'll give you that one. Of course we can blame the space race in the 60's and the restructuring of our educational system on that one.

Yes, public schools are a big part of the problem.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Their peers in the private schools contribute well over 1.5%. Their fellow citizens in the private sector at large either don't get the benefit at all or contribute much more, at all income levels. What the hell makes them so special?

They have a negotiating process that is in place, just like other jobs. Christie made a deal to his big financiers and is now paying them back with a tax cut and then pulling from the public sector to pay for it. Backwards social engineering Republican style.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

They have a negotiating process that is in place, just like other jobs.

you are fuсking delusional! their "negotiating process" is give us what you said you'd give us or we shut down the system... never mind the fact that the downturn is more protracted than anyone thought it would be. reality be damned, the kids be damned, we want what's ours!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

you are fuсking delusional! their "negotiating process" is give us what you said you'd give us or we shut down the system... never mind the fact that the downturn is more protracted than anyone thought it would be. reality be damned, the kids be damned, we want what's ours!

You don't honor employee contracts by reneging on them. They either mean something or they don't. Teachers are no exception.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

You don't honor employee contracts by reneging on them. They either mean something or they don't. Teachers are no exception.

Who the hell said anything about reneging? Christie can't renege on them even if he wants to. The contracts are with the municipalities, not the state.

What's being said here is if they agree to these concessions, the layoffs can be avoided. The concessions being asked for are very reasonable and the fact that NJEA is balking at them will drive yet another stake through the public support they've enjoyed. Refusing a 1.5% contribution to healthcare when everyone else pays multiples of that? Refusing a wage freeze for one year when many people have gone years without a raise? Really? This is how NJEA is going to pretend its a good faith actor?

Please. No one's buying it anymore.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Who the hell said anything about reneging? Christie can't renege on them even if he wants to. The contracts are with the municipalities, not the state.

What's being said here is if they agree to these concessions, the layoffs can be avoided. The concessions being asked for are very reasonable and the fact that NJEA is balking at them will drive yet another stake through the public support they've enjoyed. Refusing a 1.5% contribution to healthcare when everyone else pays multiples of that? Refusing a wage freeze for one year when many people have gone years without a raise? Really? This is how NJEA is going to pretend its a good faith actor?

Please. No one's buying it anymore.

Giving tax cuts to those making over $400,000 when the state is in a pinch, is absurd. When income inequality in this country is at its highest level since before the Depression, and on one hand, the Governor is giving tax cuts to the wealthiest, while asking teachers to take make a concession, there is something fundamentally wrong with this picture. The concessions look reasonable by themselves, but not in the context of all the factors at play.

Edited March 25, 2010 by Galt's gallstones

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Giving tax cuts to those making over $400,000 is absurd. When income inequality in this country is at its highest level since before the Depression, and on one hand, the Governor is giving tax cuts to the wealthiest, while asking teachers to take make a concession, there is something fundamentally wrong with this picture. The concessions look reasonable by themselves, but not in the context of all the factors at play.

Another factor at play, since you're looking for a holistic view of things, is that NJ has lost many high-earners since that tax was instituted to New York and Pennsylvania. We can't afford to have them all leave. Fact is, we need to reverse that trend a lot more than we need the NJEA. Who do you think pays for all those schools? Yes, the rich.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Another factor at play, since you're looking for a holistic view of things, is that NJ has lost many high-earners since that tax was instituted to New York and Pennsylvania. We can't afford to have them all leave. Fact is, we need to reverse that trend a lot more than we need the NJEA. Who do you think pays for all those schools? Yes, the rich.

Income inequality is the underlying issue (forgive my BY tangent). I don't know what the overall solution to that is for the state of NJ, but it really looks absurd to be giving a billion dollar tax cut to people making over $400,000 a year and then threaten to lay off teachers. I guess it depends on what the priorities are for NJ. From what I've read, their public schools have out performed private schools. There's got to be other ways to generate state revenue than giving a billion dollar tax cut out of fear wealthy people will leave the state. Price never seems to keep the rich from buying some of the most expensive pieces of real estate so I don't see how property tax is going to scare them away if the real estate itself is prime to them.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Price never seems to keep the rich from buying some of the most expensive pieces of real estate so I don't see how property tax is going to scare them away if the real estate itself is prime to them.

Anecdotally speaking, the "rich" people I know who have moved to PA likely don't make much more 500K (2 incomes). That's basically a household with 2 middle-manager level jobs. The really wealthy aren't the ones buying up subdivisions in the Lehigh Valley (PA), it's these guys.