Happy Day after International Women's Day Ladies!

[mox 298]

Heh. You guys call me when you're ready to turn on your brains and actually talk about the merits of the argument instead of spewing Glen Beck/Bill O'Reilly/teabagger talking points. Then we discuss how Charleton Heston (another Hollywood elitist, died in Beverly Hills dontchaknow!) was a Communist sympathizer...

[visaveteran 1]

Heh. You guys call me when you're ready to turn on your brains and actually talk about the merits of the argument instead of spewing Glen Beck/Bill O'Reilly/teabagger talking points. Then we discuss how Charleton Heston (another Hollywood elitist, died in Beverly Hills dontchaknow!) was a Communist sympathizer...

You seem fixated on John Wayne not serving in WWII. Since when did not serving in the military become a negative thing for lefties? Bill Clinton was self-admitted draft dodger...he became the President!

Oh wait...I forgot, that was the Vietnam War. The war it was OK to skip out on. Excuse me.

[visaveteran 1]

Heh. You guys call me when you're ready to turn on your brains and actually talk about the merits of the argument instead of spewing Glen Beck/Bill O'Reilly/teabagger talking points. Then we discuss how Charleton Heston (another Hollywood elitist, died in Beverly Hills dontchaknow!) was a Communist sympathizer...

We can oblige you when you knock off the Keith Olbermann/Rachael Maddox/progressive movement talking points. I mean, "teabagger"...really? Can't help yourself, can you? Just have to lower the conversation with insults and disrespect for the opposition.

[mox 298]

We can oblige you when you knock off the Keith Olbermann/Rachael Maddox/progressive movement talking points. I mean, "teabagger"...really? Can't help yourself, can you? Just have to lower the conversation with insults and disrespect for the opposition.

Keith Olbermann and Rachael Maddox would absolutely HATE my politics, which is quite frankly just fine by me. I'm a critical thinker, not a tool of political spin. I have no time for the O'Reillys, Olbermanns, Malkins, Huffingtons, Hannitys, Moores, or anybody else who spins reality into some kind of "good versus evil" bullsh1t. I don't feel like I have to check with my political party before I believe something. Your politics and my politics are actually a lot closer than you think, with the difference being that I think before I take a position, whereas you've obviously just climbed aboard the bus and are there for the ride, no thinking necessary. (seriously, name a major stand the GOP has taken that you're vehemently opposed to. I've already stated my opposition to gun control, which makes me no friend of Nancy Pelosi.)

I'd give the Tea Party movement a thousand percent more credibility if they'd have launced their movement back when Bush was spending like there was no tomorrow. But suddenly the black librul guy is in office and NOW they're concerned about government waste? Seriously, where were these guys 9 years ago when Clinton handed over a Federal surplus and turned it into the largest deficit this country has ever known? When FOX News personality Sarah Palin was giving the keynote to the Tea Party convention, where was her criticism of Bush's deficit spending habits? Obama's contribution to the deficit is a fraction of what Bush gave us, and his latest budget actually reduces spending even more. These guys aren't the "opposition," they're just a bunch of wannabe Klanners who happened to have stumbled onto a flash-in-the-pan hot button. They managed to catch the GOP flat-footed for now, which is entertaining, but eventually the Republicans will squash them like the bugs they are before they become a real threat to the GOP. These guys are as ridiculous as Moveon.org, and deserve a lot more ridicule than even I can bring to bear.

[visaveteran 1]

I'd give the Tea Party movement a thousand percent more credibility if they'd have launced their movement back when Bush was spending like there was no tomorrow. But suddenly the black librul guy is in office and NOW they're concerned about government waste? Seriously, where were these guys 9 years ago when Clinton handed over a Federal surplus and turned it into the largest deficit this country has ever known? When FOX News personality Sarah Palin was giving the keynote to the Tea Party convention, where was her criticism of Bush's deficit spending habits? Obama's contribution to the deficit is a fraction of what Bush gave us, and his latest budget actually reduces spending even more. These guys aren't the "opposition," they're just a bunch of wannabe Klanners who happened to have stumbled onto a flash-in-the-pan hot button. They managed to catch the GOP flat-footed for now, which is entertaining, but eventually the Republicans will squash them like the bugs they are before they become a real threat to the GOP. These guys are as ridiculous as Moveon.org, and deserve a lot more ridicule than even I can bring to bear.

How far back do you want to go...Jimmy Carter and the days of long gas lines and 19% interest rates? The Tea Party rose from the health care debacle which is unprecedented. Things happen when they happen.

You want to take the role the political independent who aligns with no one...go ahead. But you sure sound like a San Francisco liberal. And I have heard you advocate for some gun control.

[mox 298]

How far back do you want to go...Jimmy Carter and the days of long gas lines and 19% interest rates? The Tea Party rose from the health care debacle which is unprecedented. Things happen when they happen.

*yawn* more right-wing political spin. It's always Carter, Clinton, Pelosi, and all them other evil Dems, isn't it? Curious, did Reagan ever do anything substantial that you didn't like? Bush Senior? Bush Junior? Tip O'Neill? How about stepping off the bus long enough to form your own thoughts? Maybe read a book. I highly recommend Team of Rivals: The Political Genius of Abraham Lincoln by Doris Kearns Goodwin to start with. Stay away from the ZOMG How Hillary and/or Bush and the Democrats and/or Republicans are destroying America! variety, and instead read some actual scholarly books. I moved past the spin machine presses a long time ago, and I highly recommend it as a happiness generator.

You want to take the role the political independent who aligns with no one...go ahead. But you sure sound like a San Francisco liberal. And I have heard you advocate for some gun control.

You hear what you want to hear. And you do the same things you accuse me of doing, labeling ("San Francisco liberal") and misrepresenting ("gun control.").

San Francisco is a nice city, by the way. I've spent a lot of time there, although never really talked or participated in politics during my stays. It is, however, filled with a lot of good Americans who care deeply about their country, just like you.

[visaveteran 1]

San Francisco is a nice city, by the way. I've spent a lot of time there, although never really talked or participated in politics during my stays. It is, however, filled with a lot of good Americans who care deeply about their country, just like you.

San Francisco used to be a great city but has suffered under radical politics. There are now beggars and street dwellers harassing visitors and locals and a routine basis. It's out of control.

This is now a ping pong match, so I'm done.

[mox 298]

Glad you asked! Over the last decade San Francisco has actually gone from one of the most homeless cities in the US to one of the least. If you haven't been to SF in the last 5-10 years, you should consider it. Nice people, lots to do, and the food is fantastic.

Ok cool so FINALLY!!! now we can start talking about Charleton Heston: Cross-dresser who suspiciously spent a lot longer than most people usually do in mens rooms if you know what I mean and I think that you do. (it's true! I saw/wrote it on Wikipedia!!!)

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Glad you asked! Over the last decade San Francisco has actually gone from one of the most homeless cities in the US to one of the least. If you haven't been to SF in the last 5-10 years, you should consider it. Nice people, lots to do, and the food is fantastic.

Ok cool so FINALLY!!! now we can start talking about Charleton Heston: Cross-dresser who suspiciously spent a lot longer than most people usually do in mens rooms if you know what I mean and I think that you do. (it's true! I saw/wrote it on Wikipedia!!!)

I presume as a liberal that you accept Gay marriage and equality for Gays, lesbians, transgender etc. Why would you make fun of someone for that? Or do you only support the rights of LIBERAL gays, blacks, etc.? Are you a homophobe? Are you overly concerned with what people wear in the privacy of their home?

Charleton Heston was a strong supporter of our rights. As with most true believers in freedom, my guess is he supported more than just firearms rights. And you? I support a womans right to choose...and you? I support her right to choose an abortion...or to choose which school she sends the children she doesn't abort to. And which school to send her tax money for the children she chooses not to abort. You? I support her right to choose to carry a concealed handgun to protect the children she chooses not to abort. You? I support her right to choose if she spends her money for health care insurance...or not. You?

So, go on Mox. Make fun of cross-dressers. Maybe tell us a few gay jokes. We'll understand because you are a liberal it is OK, you can't be racist/sexist/homophobic can you?

As usual the liberals just want to control a different part of my life than the conservatives want to control. I just want you all to mind your own business and I will mind my business. I don't care if you wear lace panties or who you have sex with in your own bedroom or who you marry, please kindly grant me the same consideration in all areas of MY life. LetME have the right to choose, even though I am aman and can't have an abortion. Arguing over whether a silver screen cowboy, dead for 33 years, was racist is kind of stupid. Really stupid actually. We could also point out all the good Democrats, now dead, that were racist. we could start with Wallace, Bull Connor, Nathan Bedford Forrest. Care to? These were REAL people. They may never have made a comment to Playboy magazine...NO, they hosed down black people, they stood on the steps of a state university with armed men to prevent education of black people (something the Republican John Wayne was supporting about the same time). The Democratic party has a disgusting record of fighting against human rights. From supporting slavery, Jim Crow laws, segregation, filibustering voter rights and equal rights, crippling welfare programs that steal people's freedoms and very lives, policies toward native Americans that enslave a once proud people and condemn them to failure and a future of alcoholism.

Concerning oneself with what Charleton Heston wore under his suit when he held up a rifle and said "From my cold dead hands..." is stupid. If he was wearing lace panties...so what? He was effective in preserving and promoting our rights, YOUR rights. Your ability to have a concealed carry permit is directly related to the actions of the NRA during Heston's tenure...unless you live in Washington, Vermont or Alaska. Lace panties or no, he did a LOT for me.

[visaveteran 1]

We are engaged in a culture war. The liberal/progressives know that in order to bring about radical change, they must, among many other things, destroy the other side's heroes. Mox, clever lad that he is, understands how the game is played...how the war is waged.

If he/they target someone, consider that person a hero because he has their attention.

[Martyshk 137]

We are engaged in a culture war. The liberal/progressives know that in order to bring about radical change, they must, among many other things, destroy the other side's heroes. Mox, clever lad that he is, understands how the game is played...how the war is waged.

If he/they target someone, consider that person a hero because he has their attention.

Or you can just call everyone commies and leave it at that

[mox 298]

Gary, I can always count on you and visaveteran not getting the joke. Must be my liberal elite sense of humor. Always fun to have a tug at your chains.

Regarding political beliefs Gary, as I've said many times before, your and my politics are a lot closer than you will acknowledge.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

We are engaged in a culture war. The liberal/progressives know that in order to bring about radical change, they must, among many other things, destroy the other side's heroes. Mox, clever lad that he is, understands how the game is played...how the war is waged.

If he/they target someone, consider that person a hero because he has their attention.

A liberal targeting a conservative by calling him a cross-dresser seems a bit disingenuous to me...maybe it is just me. Seems like the liberal/progressive would want to protect that person, not ridicule him. Go figure. I mean why not just call a racist a closet "ni**er lover"

Attacking one sides "heroes" by calling them names associated with the other sides "heroes" makes no sense. For that matter, neither of you seems to be debating an issue, but rather making fun of one sides heroes or the other. There really is no debate to be had here...over what? I mean WHAT are you debating? If jane Fonda is worse than Jahn Wayne or Charleton Heston? Is Barbara Streisand better than Michelle Malkin? What did Sean Penn say about an issue compared to what Mel Gibson said? Who cares? Since when is that even an issue? You guys need to stop watching TMZ so much.

For the record, none of them are my heroes, say what you want. Heston did a great job of as President of the NRA. Regardless of what underwear he likes. John Wayne made some good movies, so did Sean Penn. Elton John is a good singer IMHO. And what?

Hopefully we can debate on more adult terms than "Heston has lace panties" or "Your mother wears army boots". Good grief.

[visaveteran 1]

[quote

Hopefully we can debate on more adult terms than "Heston has lace panties" or "Your mother wears army boots". Good grief.

So...why did you choose to jump into this immature debate? If it's beneath you, stay out.

Maybe you'd prefer to continue boring us with Vermont and Alla stories...now that's a real "Who cares?"

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Gary, I can always count on you and visaveteran not getting the joke. Must be my liberal elite sense of humor. Always fun to have a tug at your chains.

Regarding political beliefs Gary, as I've said many times before, your and my politics are a lot closer than you will acknowledge.

I doubt they are closer than I will acknowledge. I have no problem to acknowledge my beliefs and no doubt many of them are in agreement with you as I have many very "liberal" views. I also have many very "conservative views", though I do not consider my views as either, they just are.

I have a couple very basic credos..."live and Let Live" Don't bother me and I will not bother you. Works perfectly with rattlesnakes, bees, scorpions, tarantulas, and stray dogs... should work for people also.

"your right to swing your arm ends where my nose begins" Do what you want in your own privacy, I couldn't possibly care less. Be gay, lesbian, transgender, transvestite, whatever. I don't care. Worship God or not, I do not care. Smoke pot, drink alcohol, watch porno, drive an SUV, eat fois gras, smoke cigarettes, own a machine gun, pay for prostitutes, wear lace panties...I DON'T CARE! If it doesn't hurt someone else, why would I care? I do not like to see laws banning any personal behavior or restricting rights because of it.

"Individual responsibility, individual liberty". AKA "my success is my own fault" Succeed, fail, win, lose, be rich or be poor. The only thing worse than a minimum wage is a maximum wage. Black, white, brown, red, yellow...I don't care. You should have the SAME opportunity and responsibility as all other people. I believe in EQUALITY. EQUALity. This means I do NOT believe in affirmative action preferences of any type for anyone, nor government restrictions of any type on anyone.

I believe in ALL our rights. That means I beleive in OUR right to free speech. I believe it applies to liberals, conservatives and communists. Porn producers and churches. Tea baggers and Obamanistas. Sean Penn and John Wayne (RIP) Oberman and Beck, Limbaugh and Matthews. It means I believe I should be able to carry a gun and kill someone that threatens my family. It means I am safe from wiretaps by George Bush or Obama. I would rather my children die in the next 9/11 attack than live in a country that taps their telephone or email.

My views are always easy to predict, just follow the above and apply them to any issue, I am always consistent. If that means I agree with liberals sometimes (sometimes I agree for different reasons) then so be it. If it means I agree with conservatives sometimes...so be it. I do not say that I am of one particular persuasion and then follow whatever that persuasion tells me to believe. I simply do not agree with everyone on every thing. Oh well.