Coffee and Guns

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The need for guns has been equated to Freedom since no one wants to admit that it is indicative of a real social problem.

I would say violence stemming mostly from lack of problem solving skills is a real social problem. Guns can and do exacerbate the problem, but are not the root cause.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Guns can enable diсks, but the diсks remain diсks whether they have a gun or not.

[sly_wolf 199]

Its not actually affecting someone's freedoms though.

One example .... what about the family that wants to attend a public event but can't because of fear of all the crazy gun toters that will be there.

[Kevin and 10]

One example .... what about the family that wants to attend a public event but can't because of fear of all the crazy gun toters that will be there.

Typical of someone with a firearms-phobia to paint anyone that legally carries as crazy.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I would say violence stemming mostly from lack of problem solving skills is a real social problem. Guns can and do exacerbate the problem, but are not the root cause.

Sure.

[sly_wolf 199]

Typical of someone with a firearms-phobia to paint anyone that legally carries as crazy.

Your missing the point. You lose freedom when you live in fear.

Stop making it the fault of the ones who dont have a need to carry a gun.

[Peikko 1,575]

I would say violence stemming mostly from lack of problem solving skills is a real social problem. Guns can and do exacerbate the problem, but are not the root cause.

For the most part, wishing to carry weapons around in cities and modern societies is a self esteem issue not one of safety. I've lived in large cities and conurbations for years and years and never, ever been involved in or witnessed a crime. Crime just isn't that prevalent.

I can totally understand wanting to have a gun around living in wilderness areas, and have no issue at all with people carrying one when dealing with livestock. It makes sense, but there is nothing sensible about having a gun in starbucks.

[Peikko 1,575]

It's funny, in the pioneering days, it was considered a good thing when citizens of a town no longer felt the need to carry guns around but now it's meant to be the mark of enlightenment and progress?

[sly_wolf 199]

For the most part, wishing to carry weapons around in cities and modern societies is a self esteem issue not one of safety. I've lived in large cities and conurbations for years and years and never, ever been involved in or witnessed a crime. Crime just isn't that prevalent.

I can totally understand wanting to have a gun around living in wilderness areas, and have no issue at all with people carrying one when dealing with livestock. It makes sense, but there is nothing sensible about having a gun in starbucks.

Yes, no wild animals there except for the human kind

It's funny, in the pioneering days, it was considered a good thing when citizens of a town no longer felt the need to carry guns around but now it's meant to be the mark of enlightenment and progress?

Agreed. The need to carry a gun is definitely regressive .... but some folks just dont like progress.

[Kevin and 10]

Your missing the point. You lose freedom when you live in fear.

Stop making it the fault of the ones who dont have a need to carry a gun.

Who's blaming who for what? Nobody is forcing you to legally carry. I was pointing out how most people that are against legal carry like to change the argument and call people legally carrying as crazy. Thus making them prove that they are not. Obviously they are not since they are permitted to carry by a LE agency.

Barring someone the means to protect themselves is impeding on their freedom.

You ever think that the reason people legally carry is because they fear the criminal that carries illegally.

[Peikko 1,575]

There are really two issues as regards gun ownership and right to carry wherever you want to. The first is, is carrying a gun everywhere you go a good method of guaranteeing personal safety and a general feeling of security within a neighbourhood? The second is, does the right to bear arms as a protection against government tyranny demand that one prances around displaying it to fulfill its intention?

[sly_wolf 199]

Who's blaming who for what? Nobody is forcing you to legally carry. I was pointing out how most people that are against legal carry like to change the argument and call people legally carrying as crazy. Thus making them prove that they are not. Obviously they are not since they are permitted to carry by a LE agency.

Barring someone the means to protect themselves is impeding on their freedom.

You ever think that the reason people legally carry is because they fear the criminal that carries illegally.

As I said ... with fear you lose freedom. The problem is social. Carrying a gun wont solve the social problem.

[Kevin and 10]

There are really two issues as regards gun ownership and right to carry wherever you want to. The first is, is carrying a gun everywhere you go a good method of guaranteeing personal safety and a general feeling of security within a neighbourhood? The second is, does the right to bear arms as a protection against government tyranny demand that one prances around displaying it to fulfill its intention?

Whether it the street thug or a tyrannical .GOV, both are trying to deny you Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

[Kevin and 10]

As I said ... with fear you lose freedom. The problem is social. Carrying a gun wont solve the social problem.

It is a social problem and it isn't going away soon, even if people are barred from legal carry.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

There are really two issues as regards gun ownership and right to carry wherever you want to. The first is, is carrying a gun everywhere you go a good method of guaranteeing personal safety and a general feeling of security within a neighbourhood? The second is, does the right to bear arms as a protection against government tyranny demand that one prances around displaying it to fulfill its intention?

Arguably the first premise, is more plausible than the second, but still a bit mad.

As you say, crime isn't really that common, unless you live in a very bad area. The media is actually guilty of exacerbating a sense of fear that certain types of crime are more common than they really are.

As to using a gun to free yourself from tyranny, all you can say to that is that the politcal climate in most European countries isn't half as charged as it is here. We do not have totalitarian government and what's more our public debates are not colored by ex-jarhead neo-fascist morons whose sole response to disagreeable opinions is to tell people to get the ** out of their country.