Obama signs one-year extension of Patriot Act

[Ban Hammer 13,643]

I got lazy after reading about the outrage about the Patriot Act during the Bush years so I didn't post all the dates and links. Now there's little fuss because presumably they enjoy having their rights taken if it's Obama doing the taking. Look at the names and yes you'll see some the same morons who were quite strong in their now muted opinions.

~Flower~

Sep 6 2007

7 pages

Personally the "Patriot Act" is unconstitutional and a violation to our civil liberties.

Caladan

This law was ridiculous. We can tap your phones, if you ask if we're tapping them we're not allowed to tell you, and we don't need any judicial oversight. Sorry. Chase all the terrorists you want but that's what check and balances are FOR.

Gene Hunt

That may well be the case, but given that we've had Watergate and similar scandals in the past - which have involved the abuse of power by our elected representatives, it would seem foolish to do away with our civil protections.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...;hl=Patriot+Act

Dan + Gemvita

Sep 26 2007

They should save time, and repeal the whole law.

wife_of_mahmoud Feb 18 2006

But curtailment of individual rights and freedoms as a way to "protect us from evil," a la the Patriot Act or making "Holocaust denial" a crime, is even more dangerous to a free society.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...atriot+act+bush

Gene Hunt

Patriot Act..... I won't even get into that one. It's BS and should be repealed.

While Clinton is hardly spotless - the main reason GWB is criticised as much as he is has something to do with the way in which he has consistently sought to extend the power and influence of the executive, at the expense of other branches of government.

Essentially, this government have demonstrated via legislation like the Patriot Act, like the Iraq war etc that they want to exercise that increased power without any responsibility or accountability - which is something that people should be rightly suspicious of.

Similarly, Bush has displayed an odd penchant for digging in his heels on issues that seem to matter only to him. This shows how out of step he is with much of America - Republican, Democrat, Independent, or apolitical. As well as how little involvement he seems to have in setting an administrative agenda. In every decision that has been left (mostly) to him, his choices always seem to cause friction.

rclouse

The "Patriot" Act is for anything but patriots. It subverts what this country and the Constitution stand for.

yogib37

They push the patriot act thru without reading it and thus had many of my civil rights taken away.

Bush did illegal wire taps and even the federal court judge ruled agaist him. when the appleal court upheld the lower court. Bush commiet 36 plus crimes and he is a criminal. He should be strip of his Presendental rights in Jan. 2009 when he is out of office.

Gene Hunt

Swap "competent laywer" for an "unscrupulous lawyer" and I'll agree to that. The problem with the Patriot Act is that it is highly ambiguous and does not clearly define what constitutes 'reasonable cause'. Hence as I said, 'reasonable cause' could be turned around, if the political climate is right, to include anyone who says anything even remotely critical of the government.

Just because it isn't that way now, does not mean it may not become so in the future - and you have the very mechanism to subvert the foundation of your democracy. Paranoid. Its happened before - but those comparisons are 'insulting' apparently

Gene Hunt

So yes, post 9/11 when everyone is so security concious that we are now signing into law things that would have been unthinkable for a western democracy prior to "the incident", as it were - and seeing as how you consider security enough of a priority to wholeheartedly applaud the Patriot Act, it might seem strange then that you do not consider that having our ports operated by a country with direct ties to a middle-eastern country (not to mention that country's Monarch/CEO/Prime Minister), a country which has connections to 9/11 to be particularly bothersome.

Coincidentally, this is another one of those issues that would likely have not been a problem under any other president were it not for the fact that GWB has squandered and abused the public trust. When we're talking lame ducks here - its really no surprise, and you and the public at large have no-one to blame but GWB.

yogib37

Yes we are almost there. This Admin is screwing up the Constitution so bad. It is called the patriot act. That has taken a lot of my civil rights away. If I want to open a bank account I have to show I am not a threat. If I check out books from the libary and they can get the records.

they can bust into your home with out a warrent now and arrest you and put you in jail and not tell you why..and can leave you as long as they feel like. They just say he was a terriost and keep him in jail.

So a lot of civil rights been taken away. they are tapping people phones, putting people on the 'no fly list' and they wont let you know why you on it.. the Homeland dept is the Bush admin. SS Nazi's

Gene Hunt

Moreover, due process is a fundamental part of the democratic system. Lose that and you're on the first step back towards totalitarianism. It's not Bush we need to worry about abusing these new powers - it's the people who come after him, because laws like the Patriot Act seriously undermine the founding values of the country. Mess with those and it becomes easier to repeal the constitution and bill of rights in its entirety. There is a historical precedent for this - pre-Hitler Germany...

HAL 9000

Unfortunately, the Patriot Act is part OF the Sh!t storm. Perhaps that's why the overwhelming majority of Americans think Bush and Co have done such a wonderful job on task.

Mr. Big Dog

But I'm not the one running around pretending that the Patriot Act or the fanning of the flames in the Middle East is making anyone safer. It simply doesn't and I believe it's best to acknowledge that. It's also worth acknowledging that our allowing them to dictate what freedoms and liberties we maintain and which we are willing to sacrifice at this supposed altar of security actually hands them a win. I don't like this defeatist attitude that Bush and Co have been shoving down Americas throat.

Galt's galls...

We could start off with at least a reasonable dialogue about national security if we focused on the recommendations and criticisms of the 911 Commission, but instead we've got a few here that have openly accepted the Patriot Act as if an edict from God Himself. The reality is the Patriotic Act was authored by a Vietnamese immigrant (which I think is relevant) and has been thoroughly discredited by many conservative think tanks such as the Cato Institute. It's another example of the Bush Administration completely ignoring expert opinion and advice, replacing it with their brand of what they see fit - "don't confuse them with fact." So be it. The polls have shown time and again that an overwhelming majority of Americans are dissatisfied with the direction this country is in, feel less safe, and less optimistic about the future. This is one more political dagger in the side of McCain - for those who can't imagine some Republicans voting for Obama, by deducing that he is more left, cannot see the forest for the trees - for many true conservatives, their civil liberties are very important to them and if McCain plans to continue Bush's policies on national security, you can bet that many will be voting for Obama in November.

Gene Hunt

Limits on Executive Power - this is a another vague one. The whole problem in Bush's first term was that the Republicans had almost total power - if we get into the same position with Obama of limited opposition, I tend to think you'll see similar things. Though probably not as aggressive as Bush. However - I bet you anything you like that Obama won't repeal the Patriot Act.

PlatyPius

The Patriot Act affects my standard of living.

yogib37

Since when did OBAMA shut down free speech.. Seems like the yahoos in office now mainly some retard namedd BUSH, sign the Patriot Act. That took away so much freedom from us. Cause Bush thinks the Constitution is just a 'god Damm piece of paper.

and all the GOP.

yogib37

I am VOTING for OBAMA, and I know what the Constitution is. and I know who F'ed it up the most also. Dont cry when your husband comes here and he has a hard time getting ssn and getting a bank account cause they need a SSN cause the the patriot act. Dont be surpised that they knock on your door 3 am in the morning and drag him away cause they dont have to have a reason to toss him in jail. and like before Due process, the can make people sit in jail for 2 or 3 or more years before doing the process. The the patriot act at it finest. They wire tap your phones... see before DUMB ** BuSH took office that was all consider unconstitutional but now they can almost do what they want. So the GOP is being the freaking commies.

[ScratchIt 12]

Too much of a good thing???

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Popcorn is appropriate - light, thoroughly bereft of nutritional value and it makes you fart.

[scandal 951]

Please name those "same liberals". ENOUGH of this anonymous character assassination and vague innuendo.

Thanks, Dave.

[Ban Hammer 13,643]

Popcorn is appropriate - light, thoroughly bereft of nutritional value and it makes you fart.

i don't need any help in that department

[alienlovechild 75]

What's more, you clearly aren't interested in my opinion. If you were there would be no reason to seek it out via antagonistic means.

Its a good thing that I don't care what you think, or what you think I think.

Me using your own words are inflamatory? Sad when posters can't defend their opinions while demanding I name names.

Well this exercise pretty much sums up my view that most of of the critics of the Patriot Act were largely partisan who have nothing to say on the Act, the law or Obama. It was all about Bush and now that he's gone the it's pointless to argue anything about it.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

And yet you said you weren't trying to speak for others.

Yeah - I really didn't see that coming

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Still think there's a difference between the Republicans and Democrats?

Yes, the Democrats have a broader vocabulary. The Republicans only know one word anymore - NO.

[alienlovechild 75]

And yet you said you weren't trying to speak for others.

Yeah - I really didn't see that coming

I'd hoped you knew the difference between referring to someone in the first or third person but you're right I was referring to your evil twin.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

Yes, the Democrats have a broader vocabulary. The Republicans only know one word anymore - NO.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Sooooooooooo...did Obama add the safeguards he promised to help protect civil liberties?

[Ban Hammer 13,643]

Yes, the Democrats have a broader vocabulary. The Republicans only know one word anymore - NO.

yeah, that democrat vocabulary "bush's fault!"

Edited March 2, 2010 by charles!

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

there was a lot of bitching about the Patriot Act when GWB was in office and now a liberal president signs on. i don't watch TV, but i'd love to know if the liberals will complain at the same level as when GWB was in office or will they bow their head and whisper to themselves "guess GWB was right."

I won't hold my breath.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

First, I want to congratulate ALC and his wife for their beautiful baby girl!

Second, I want to say that list you have of the quotes is pretty damn good!

I personally have not read much on the current issue, but when I read the headline, I felt another disappointment from Obama and his administration....and I've felt quite a few over his first year. I owe it though to myself to read more as to what this means, but on the surface it looks very disappointing.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I'd hoped you knew the difference between referring to someone in the first or third person but you're right I was referring to your evil twin.

Dave, you waded in here with a comment that people who aren't posting an opinion on the Patriot Act in this thread are avoiding doing so for purely partisan reasons. It doesn't take much thought to realize that you are making a fairly wide assumption here that is just somewhat disingenuous.

What is totally disingenuous however, is that you aren't asking for opinions, you're demanding them on the basis that if they are not provided that it will somehow prove your dubious allegation.

####### on top of #######, Dave. Do you have any more in the jar or are you about done?