America's No. 1 Killer: Cardiovascular Disease. How Americanized do you really want to become?

[Peikko 1,575]

Sorry, no. It means ...

1. You have no knowledge of how insurance works

2. It means I save the hospital at least 50% in costs by not involving an insurance company in the process and they pass along the savings to me

3. It means insurance companies increase, not reduce, costs (and the government would just be a bigger and less efficient insurance company) Big surprise

4. It means neither I nor the hospital (nor you) contributed to insurance company profits (You have heard they make a lot of money, haven't you?) Skipping the "middle man" means we all get a better deal.

I understand you are jealous and insecure at not being able to live as you preach to others...but you need to get over that and understand that those of us that control our own lives and plan for ourselves are not increasing costs for you, that is being done by your fellow insurance buyers. Paying my own way in no way is an abuse of the "system" It is an avoidance of the "system". The "system" increases your costs.

Your hospital does this too. Get over it. The cash discount is typically 35-50%. Shop around and you get a better deal.

Jealous and insecure? Dream on. You simply can't grasp the simple concept that you could not afford to get the treatments that you have been able to enjoy if it were not for the insurance system that is in place today, no matter that it is flawed and more expensive than it needs to be. You are being subsidized by every responsible citizen in the US and yet you bang your own gong as if you should be applauded. Grow up and stop sponging off of society.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I paid cash and saved 50% They knock off 50% for not being insured. Just doing my part to reduce healthcare costs. Call it Gary's healthcare reform act. I know exactly how insurance works, that is why I avoid it. I am semi-retired. I spend as much time as I can goofing off and having fun doing things I enjoy. I worked for it and planned accordingly to allow me to do this. You can too. I do not wish to pay for people that do not plan and do not handle their lives very well. Not my problem.

I had open heart surgery in December and YOU didn't pay for it. As I have said, I believe in individual responsibility and individual liberty. I am not a hypocrite.

I own ALL the road...stay off it when I need it.

Are you going to collect on Social Security and Medicare?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

It's great that you could afford to pay 50% of the cost of your own treatment - really, but to assume the other 50% is merely 'profit' for the insurance company that you have 'saved' us from is completely niave.

If there was no such thing as health insurance, the cost of your treatment would have been astronomical, it beggers belief that you actually think that everyone could pay their own real cost bills and the health system would be as good as, if not better than it is now, and that you could afford to get such treatments, or even that such treatments would be offered.

It would only be naive to think that a hospital would lose money for taking cash. They do not and cash discounts are universally offered for medical care. YOU do not pay for it. Deal with it.

If I can do it, why can't someone else? Are you saying you are not able to because....why? Until a few years ago there WAS no such thing as health insurance and health care costs were remarkably affordable. Health care insurance didn't even exist until the 1940s and wasn't common until the 1950s and 60s. The further people get from the buying process, the more costs go up. Treatments not covered by insurance...breast augmentation and Lasik eye surgery, have come down in cost remarkably...other types have gone up. even by-pass surgery is far cheaper when paid for without insurance. Insurance costs us all a lot of money, that is why I avoid it. I have only that insurance required by law, never more than that. Liability and propery damage insurance for our cars

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

This kinda goes back to what I was saying the other day about your egotism Gary (Yes, I know that you don't care). Sounds like you are one of those arseholes who believes that if a person doesn't have a few million in cash laying around to pay for healthcare out of pocket for their quadruple bypass, lengthy cancer treatment, organ transplant etc. that they are beneath contempt and deserve to die. Naturally because unless you have the income of Donald Trump, then you are lazy, don't work hard enough and deserve what you get.

Brilliant.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Are you going to collect on Social Security and Medicare?

Neither has any part in my future plans. No. I will retire fully at age 59.5 maybe sooner. I will live very well on my private investments. I am self insured now, why would that need to change? I paid into social security and still do but I do not count on it for income in the future. I do not recommend anyone does. If I do collect on it, I will be secure in the knowledge that I could have collected a LOT more if the same amount of money that was confiscated from my family had been put in my own retirement plan and that the lower return on my "investment" is my contribution to YOUR retirement. You're welcome.

[FortLaudy 10]

Government mandates are not "personal responsibility" Keeping the government out of healthcare and requiring people to apy for their own stupidity is "personal responsibility" You like personal responsibility, but want to legislate what people eat, drink, smoke? You want people to be "free" but have a babysitter? And the best babysitter is the government? But then you have to pay for the babysitter, which you say you don;t want to do.

Just keep the government out.

You're right, I want government out of my biz, but if they're intent on socializing such things such as healthcare, then I hope they'll do so responsibly and penalise stupid people who drive up insurance premiums for everyone else with their stupid behavior.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Shani682

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

This kinda goes back to what I was saying the other day about your egotism Gary (Yes, I know that you don't care). Sounds like you are one of those arseholes who believes that if a person doesn't have a few million in cash laying around to pay for healthcare out of pocket for their quadruple bypass, lengthy cancer treatment, organ transplant etc. that they are beneath contempt and deserve to die. Naturally because unless you have the income of Donald Trump, then you are lazy, don't work hard enough and deserve what you get.

Brilliant.

If the government doesn't have a few million laying around to do the same, then they decide you have no reason to live. Better one decide that for themselves. Why would you be against someone being independent and paying their own way? Makes no sense at all.

One does not need the income of Donald Trump to be independent. One needs only be reasonably well educated and reasonably plan for the future and not throw away all one's money on insurance premiums making insurance companies rich and insurance executives wealthy.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

How do you penalize people for the food that they eat? Are we going to require people to fill out some sort of fast food audit document with their taxes? How does that work?

You do realize that a person's susceptibility to cardiovascular disease has a lot to do with genetics as it does with lifestyle...

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If the government doesn't have a few million laying around to do the same, then they decide you have no reason to live. Better one decide that for themselves. Why would you be against someone being independent and paying their own way? Makes no sense at all.

One does not need the income of Donald Trump to be independent. One needs only be reasonably well educated and reasonably plan for the future and not throw away all one's money on insurance premiums making insurance companies rich and insurance executives wealthy.

If I stopped paying for insurance premiums, It wouldn't come to anywhere close to $200K. So what should a person do when they come up short to pay for their quadruple bypass? Sell their home, car and possessions? What about a kidney?

So what happens when YOU run out of cash, Gary? Will you happily up sticks and go live under a cardboard box? Cause if you can't afford your bypass then you deserve to die, right?

Edited February 21, 2010 by Gene Hunt

[Peikko 1,575]

People that sponge off society and act self rightious are pitiful. As you clearly can't understand how anything works, I can only feel sorry for you, even while I pay for your totally irresponsible behaviour.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Madame Cleo

[Ali G. 37]

What the government basically wants to do is use their bulk buy power to purchase a better policy for less. It's no different from walmart using their bulk buying power to buy things cheaper than others. This hysteria about the government taking control of everything is baseless paranoia.

[Peikko 1,575]

OK Gary, so what happens when you run out of cash? Will you happily up sticks and go live under a cardboard box?

He can't run out of cash, he has planned for every eventuality - the model citizen.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

You're right, I want government out of my biz, but if they're intent on socializing such things such as healthcare, then I hope they'll do so responsibly and penalise stupid people who drive up insurance premiums for everyone else with their stupid behavior.

It is not possible to "socialize things responsibly". Socialization and responsibility are mutually exclusive by design and definition.

Stupidity is its own reward...or punishment. IF we allow stupid people to be stupid, they will punish themselves. Socialization is protecting stupid people at the expense of clever people. The government needs to STAY OUT. Stupid people will live as stupid people do and clever people will live as clever people do. There is, and should be, a reward for being clever, planning, making good decisions, etc.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Neither has any part in my future plans. No. I will retire fully at age 59.5 maybe sooner. I will live very well on my private investments. I am self insured now, why would that need to change?

Good luck with that. When you soon find that no private insurance will cover you or you'll be priced out of it, you'll be welcoming Medicare with open arms.

[Peikko 1,575]

Clever people abort any baby that might be born with an expensive to treat condition