America's No. 1 Killer: Cardiovascular Disease. How Americanized do you really want to become?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

The Founding Fathers of this country were influenced by the French Revolution and from there, there's a long list of examples where one country influenced another towards progress. The fact that we are the only industrialized nation that doesn't have universal health care should make us stand up and take notice. Particularly given that health care costs are an increasing part of our GDP. It stands at 16% of the GDP, second only to East Timor.

So just what countries do we want to aspire to? East Timor or Western Europe when it comes to health care?

You are such a dumb@ss sometimes. The French Revolution was 1789-1799. Ours was 1775-1781. The consititution was adopted, amended and ratified before the French Revolution began. GTFO!!!!!

The FRENCH were influenced by US.

the last time the French had any influence on us was in 1886, the invention of smokeless gunpowder. Since then...Nada, zip, zero. ZED, as they say in French.

Edited February 22, 2010 by Gary and Alla

[Ali G. 37]

libertarian in our beliefs of "live and let live"

What do you think this is? Pandora or something..

The thought that the world would be harmonious without any rules or law and order is honestly lunacy at its best. First thing I would do in such a world would to forcefully conquer Vermont., What are you guys to do about it? Especially, if you did seceded and were not part of the Union anymore. I'd piss out the 670K population for breakfast. Get the point?

Edited February 22, 2010 by Booyah

[Ali G. 37]

I'll give 'em an "A" for my bypass surgery within a few hours of discovering the need for it. They did a damn good job at it too. Painful to be sure but hey, what should I expect? A month later I was back to pretty normal activity and now, nearly 3 months later I feel better than I have in years. I would be zooming down the slopes tomorrow with Pasha but the doctor says not until next year, so I will sit in the lodge and read again or walk some of the trails around the lodge.. School is out this week, so lots of skiing ahead. someone's got to do it.

Even something as small as being able to get to the hospital is due to being a apart of a civilized society, where people pool their taxes together, in order to construct the infrastructure.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

What do you think this is? Pandora or something..

The thought that the world would be harmonious without any rules or law and order is honestly lunacy at its best. First thing I would do in such a world would to forcefully conquer Vermont., What are you guys to do about it? Especially, if you did seceded and were not part of the Union anymore. I'd piss out the 670K population for breakfast. Get the point?

The Green Mountain Boys would be waiting for he invasion and kick #### using guerrilla warfare. Vietnam anyone?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Why is that a bad thing, or even significant?

Given that 40 million Americans have no healthcare, yet the amount we spent per capita is higher than any other industrialized nation, it means we have less of our income to spend on other things.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

What do you think this is? Pandora or something..

The thought that the world would be harmonious without any rules or law and order is honestly lunacy at its best. First thing I would do in such a world would to forcefully conquer Vermont., What are you guys to do about it? Especially, if you did seceded and were not part of the Union anymore. I'd piss out the 670K population for breakfast. Get the point?

what are you talking about? a statement was made by another poster, that a group of people want to seceed and join New Hampshire. This is not correct, that group, which does not include me, wants to be independent. I never said I supported them. I do not. The Green Mountian Boys have served this counrty admirably and I merely pointed out Vermont's contribution to our country. what exactly is your problem?

On the other hand, you let go entirely that Stephan says the French Revolution influenced our founders but that happened after our founding was done...but he agrees with you so let's not let facts get in the way of anything.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

You are such a dumb@ss sometimes. The French Revolution was 1789-1799. Ours was 1775-1781. The consititution was adopted, amended and ratified before the French Revolution began. GTFO!!!!!

The FRENCH were influenced by US.

the last time the French had any influence on us was in 1886, the invention of smokeless gunpowder. Since then...Nada, zip, zero. ZED, as they say in French.

Maybe your dad smacked you every time you made an error, but my statement was an honest mistake and who influenced who doesn't change my argument at all. But I'm sure the thought of any French thinkers having an influence on our Founders gives you chills up your spine, they were in fact influenced by the French Thinkers.

Many of the most distinguished leaders of the American revolution--Jefferson, Washington, Franklin, Paine--were powerfully influenced by English and--to a lesser extent--French Enlightenment thought. The God who underwrites the concept of equality in the Declaration of Independence is the same deist God Rousseau worshipped, not that venerated in the traditional churches which still supported and defended monarchies all over Europe. Jefferson and Franklin both spent time in France--a natural ally because it was a traditional enemy of England--absorbing the influence of the French Enlightenment. The language of natural law, of inherent freedoms, of self-determination which seeped so deeply into the American grain was the language of the Enlightenment, though often coated with a light glaze of traditional religion, what has been called our "civil religion."

link

Edited February 22, 2010 by Galt's gallstones

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Maybe your dad smacked you every time you made an error, but my statement was an honest mistake and who influenced who doesn't change my argument at all. But I'm sure the thought of any French thinkers having an influence on our Founders gives you chills up your spine, they were in fact influenced by the French Thinkers.

Many of the most distinguished leaders of the American revolution--Jefferson, Washington, Franklin, Paine--were powerfully influenced by English and--to a lesser extent--French Enlightenment thought. The God who underwrites the concept of equality in the Declaration of Independence is the same deist God Rousseau worshipped, not that venerated in the traditional churches which still supported and defended monarchies all over Europe. Jefferson and Franklin both spent time in France--a natural ally because it was a traditional enemy of England--absorbing the influence of the French Enlightenment. The language of natural law, of inherent freedoms, of self-determination which seeped so deeply into the American grain was the language of the Enlightenment, though often coated with a light glaze of traditional religion, what has been called our "civil religion."

link

French and British thinkers actually. The bill of rights was actually adapted from a British document dating to the 1600s.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Even something as small as being able to get to the hospital is due to being a apart of a civilized society, where people pool their taxes together, in order to construct the infrastructure.

can ANY of the liberals here argue ANY point with logic and facts? So far you have said 80% of the cost of surgery is because of insurance, Cleo disagrees but finally took her ludricrous "you don't pay your part" argument and left, but she has the record for arguing the dumbest point for the longest time. You attribute anything possible to me to avoid the subject (Vermont secession) and Stephen just flat makes up ####### like our founding fathers were influenced by the French Revolution. Maybe they were influenced by the Louisiana Purchase...yeah that's it! NO, it was the California Gold Rush..yeah, uh-huh, the founding fathers were influenced by the California Gold Rush and that is why we are a capitaltist country. Kruschev tried to talk them out of it, yeah sure, Nikita Sergeyovich met with Washington and tried to get them to join the Sovet Union and give us free health care, but the California Gold Rush struck about then and Washington said "No way Nicky" and never looked back. Almost 200 years later, Kruschev, well preserveed by Russian vodka, gave Kennedy all kinds of fits when Kennedy tore down the Berlin wall and freed the slaves. yeah, that's it. You realize, all of that makes as much sense as what Stephen posted?

MY GOD!!!!!! Is there ANYONE that make a case for government run health care with any relevent facts? Is there ANYONE that realizes it makes no difference? The Democrats, that were supposed to bring us healthcare, so fouled up the job that it will never happen for several years...at least. The Dems will lose control this fall, Obama is a one-termer so we are looking, minimum 2017 for any chance of health care reform for the country. Great job, Obama!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Maybe your dad smacked you every time you made an error, but my statement was an honest mistake and who influenced who doesn't change my argument at all. But I'm sure the thought of any French thinkers having an influence on our Founders gives you chills up your spine, they were in fact influenced by the French Thinkers.

link

You make a lot of honest mistakes. I know, I read them all the time. what IS the argument that isn't changed? Why would it give me chills? I speak, read a write fluent French.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Where are your facts, Gary?

Don't make silly accusations if you can't pony up yourself

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

French and British thinkers actually. The bill of rights was actually adapted from a British document dating to the 1600s.

And how did the French infuence it? Oh yeah, they helped us kick the Brits ####### right the ** out! I guess the whole second amnedment thing is kind of our own influence, eh?

Where are your facts, Gary?

Don't make silly accusations if you can't pony up yourself

For which do you speak? I will provide.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

You make a lot of honest mistakes. I know, I read them all the time. what IS the argument that isn't changed? Why would it give me chills? I speak, read a write fluent French.

That from the beginning of the formation of this country, we've had outside influence. That's how progress has worked throughout history. So saying we shouldn't look to other countries for ideas on how to better ourselves is not only stupidly arrogant, it ignores the history of progress.

As for the French Thinkers influencing our Founders, I provided you with a source.

[Ali G. 37]

can ANY of the liberals here argue ANY point with logic and facts? ........

MY GOD!!!!!! Is there ANYONE that make a case for government run health care with any relevent facts? Is there ANYONE that realizes it makes no difference? .......

Gary Gary Gary, we have made many valid arguments but you are not listening.

You want logic? How is this for logic? Australians live three years longer than Americans yet only spend 43% (per capita) of what we spend here; with every single person covered. How is that working out for them? They are currently ranked second best in world, in terms of quality of life and country to live in.

However, please enlighten me using ex soviet union examples.

Edited February 22, 2010 by Booyah

[spookyturtle 9,466]

You guys don't even know about the Green Mountain Boys. For shame.