Dual Citizenship- Your Opinion

[Robyn-n-Kris 72]

My apologies but I was referring to him living here again. He will come to visit as he will know he can go home

[TracyTN 237]

As we never plan to live in the UK, he's not worried about the having to pay tax thing as a US citizen. I kind of like the idea that our child will have the ability to live in the UK if he/she chooses at some point though.

I'm just bitter that I can't get a UK passport unless we live there one day. Waaaah. LOL

[Rob and Jill 82]

Jill - this is where she said he'd never return to the states.

Hmm I didn't see that. I just saw where she said to live. I need more sleep I think. There now I finally have weekend plans. Sleep. Sleep is good.

And Julez...The avatar is kind of freaking me out a little...LOL.

Edited February 19, 2010 by Rob and Jill

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Hmm I didn't see that. I just saw where she said to live. I need more sleep I think. There now I finally have weekend plans. Sleep. Sleep is good.

And Julez...The avatar is kind of freaking me out a little...LOL.

Sleep is indeed good.

And you'll learn to love the avatar, trust me. It becomes hypnotic after a while.

[*julez* 124]

Hmm I didn't see that. I just saw where she said to live. I need more sleep I think. There now I finally have weekend plans. Sleep. Sleep is good.

And Julez...The avatar is kind of freaking me out a little...LOL.

Yay for sleep! I have to host 2 birthday luncheons this weekend, so there'll be little rest for me.

Yes, the avatar is freaky, but its the cover from a really great album. You'll get used to her.

[Justine+David 218]

Under changes proposed to occur in mid-2011, if an alien moves to the UK and desires to live there, UK citizenship will be mandatory.

etc.

YES! This is wrong; you can just become a permanent resident:

"The status of permanent residence will be available to migrants who do not want to or cannot become British citizens (because of dual nationality issues, for example)."

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/managing...w-will-it-work/ (same link you posted)

Edited February 20, 2010 by Justine+David

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

YES! This is wrong; you can just become a permanent resident:

"The status of permanent residence will be available to migrants who do not want to or cannot become British citizens (because of dual nationality issues, for example)."

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/managing...w-will-it-work/ (same link you posted)

You left out some important bits of the link, Justine.

"Any migrant who has spent five years as a probationary citizen will need to either move on to the final stage or leave the United Kingdom.

Stage 3: British Citizenship or permanent residence

Migrants who become British citizens will have full entitlement to the rights and benefits that this brings.

The status of permanent residence will be available to migrants who do not want to or cannot become British citizens (because of dual nationality issues, for example)."

"Full entitlements" doesn't just mean the brew. It means the NHS and sending your kids to public school.

For a plain language explanation of what is going on across the pond, here's the Beeb.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7254926.stm

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

hmm, just read the BBC article and glad I got mine when I did

withholding NHS benefits? I get this for some kinds of migrants who have never paid in, but surely the UKC of the non-citizen has surely contributed/

I will watch this issue with interest.

[Adam M 0]

Just my few cents:

We've had this debate many times... I am the UK citizen/US PR, my wife is a USC. We have been here in the States for several years (since getting married), but ultimately intend to go and live in the UK.

There is certainly something to be said for the convenience of being able to come and go as one pleases, but as far as I can understand there is little to prevent you becoming a permanent resident again in the future if your status expires due to living elsewhere. (Please correct me if I'm wrong on this!!)

The thing which finally swayed me into NOT becoming a citizen was - as others have mentioned - Uncle Sam's chunk of your income for the rest of your life. My wife will, of course, have to do this regardless of her residency, but "married filing separately" seems like a good option for her tax return once we move back. :-)

I love that people have opened-up the debate, and I look forward to reading more opinions!

[TracyTN 237]

You're right - there's nothing to prevent you from becoming a US perm resident again. But you just have to go through the entire process again to do that. Just seems more logical to me to get citizenship and skip repeating all that if you don't have to. At least if you know you may well want to come back and live here again one day.

[closed-20101014 3]

He will be able to avail himself of NHS coverage if (and only if) he reestablishes residency in the UK. Obtaining dual citizenship would make this a whole lot easier, since he wouldn't need to worry about time spent out of the US as a PR.

My husband is very pro-USA and has had to be talked out of relinquishing his UK citizenship. I stressed to him that he has no idea where life will take him, and that having a British passport along with a US one will open many more opportunities. I agree completely with what Otto says above.

I've felt like your husband, all my adult life. I feel like a transexual wanting to remove the part of them that they don't feel belongs. I've felt deep misery on coming back to the UK, and I gave up Japan and the hope of permanent resident status/citizenship in order to sort out being with my husband.

The NHS have done me NO favours. Their hugely late divulging of a diagnosis I got in childhood (why did the doctor fail to say it to my parents) has resulted in years of added mental illnesses and it's why the US probably won't have me.

The ONLY reason I'm keeping the UK passport is for Europe. And the british public hate Europe/foreigners in general and want us out of it. The Tories promised the racist bigoted public a referendum on Europe, but they realised we'd definitely be voted out, it would bankrupt Britain which is now heavily reliant on EU. So they've had to remove it from their election promises even at the loss of votes.

It's a shame I can't have dual US/Japanese nationality.

[closed-20101014 3]

"Migration is a journey - and the British government wants to make it a little bit longer and harder to complete. "

Haha oh hey let's make it even more stunningly hard for people in legit marriages to be with their spouse. It's not hard enough already, what with penalising the UKC for claiming any benefits which most the damn nation claims, and insisting they stay at over double the poverty line which is impossible for a large percentage of those in the working classes who can't/couldn't afford university.

It's just spin to pander to the idiots who read the tabloid newspapers. Seriously why don't they ban this hate press. It is NOT easy to gain a UK visa and people who do CAN'T claim benefits for years, nor can their spouse who is legally entitled to - well the spouse can but only if they want the visa to be in jeapordy. Meanwhile we all pay taxes through the nose, we even pay them for a fiance here on a visitor's/fiance visa who can;t even work. I've told my USC husband's parents about how much tax I pay and they were horrified. Get notyhing back either because the NHS is a joke that has ruined my life. I won;t pretend the US healthcare is any better but at least then you get a choice of who you go to if you can pay. Japan just forces people to pay national insurance while still having private healthcare.

God I am SO FURIOUS at this latest development. I'm seething with rage.

[closed-20101014 3]

"Acceptable activities could include voluntary work, involvement in local groups or the school parent-teacher association. Migrants will need to find referees to vouch for these good deeds."

When it's voluntary, it's charitable work.

When it's basically enforced, it's called "slave labour."

I work for a charity but there's no way I'd do it if I wasn't paid. This is not just for economic reasons, but I'm basically forced to stay right up there with the income to potentially get my husband his visa. Most people in my circumstances claim at least some tax credits rather than piling on 12 hour work days on regular occassions. That is because they don't have to sponsor a non british citizen, and they aren't under scrutiny. Tax credits are supposed to be some relief from the high tax here for those on a low income, so they DON'T have to overwork themselves to live. I pay full whack. So do a grand amount of migrants, those on a visa and their spouses. It isn't bloody fair. I suppose the readers of the Daily Express andf other hate press are laughing about this.

[Gemmie 142]

You're right, it's not fair, and I can sense your hatred of the UK and its systems. But to be honest, it's not any easier in the US.

My husband is in a decent job, 40 hours a week, with talks of getting his real estate license, and we still can't afford to live on his salary alone. We barely even leap the poverty limit needed to have me here, and because of instability in this economy, he wasn't given the raise he was promised. Back in the UK, everyone I know is entitled to some kind of benefit or rent reduction. I've heard people discuss how they're getting double their income due to tax credits and child benefits alone. Since moving to the US, they can't believe how difficult it is for me and my husband to get ourselves out on our own because most people aren't entitled to anything, and then there's medical insurance on top of that.

I'm sorry you had a horrible experience with the NHS; personally, I've had family members that were saved using the NHS and had excellent treatment. You say the US is better in that "at least you can choose who to go to if you can pay" but that's the key point. IF you can pay. Unless I'm mistaken, you're not paid back your health insurance payments either and not everyone gets back the health care they put money into. We're both healthy adults with no medical problems but for security reasons, are looking at having to pay something like 25% of our paycheck towards it. God forbid we should get pregnant, because then we'd be up the creek without a paddle - none of this safety net that the UK offers such as maternity grant, lowered living costs, child benefits, and assistance in finding a house (i.e. skipping the line of working couples).

There are things that aren't perfect in the US, but I chose to go through this because I chose to marry an American and attempt to live in his country. I accept that there are differences in health care (as much as I dislike them) and that we're looking at more financial scrutiny because we chose to live here, and I think you'll find many people to agree that the US immigration process is much more difficult than the UK one. You are actually very lucky to be a UK citizen and have chosen to marry a foreigner, which is a right - but bringing them to the UK is a privilege.

[closed-20101014 3]

You're right, it's not fair, and I can sense your hatred of the UK and its systems. But to be honest, it's not any easier in the US.

My husband is in a decent job, 40 hours a week, with talks of getting his real estate license, and we still can't afford to live on his salary alone. We barely even leap the poverty limit needed to have me here, and because of instability in this economy, he wasn't given the raise he was promised. Back in the UK, everyone I know is entitled to some kind of benefit or rent reduction. I've heard people discuss how they're getting double their income due to tax credits and child benefits alone. Since moving to the US, they can't believe how difficult it is for me and my husband to get ourselves out on our own because most people aren't entitled to anything, and then there's medical insurance on top of that.

I'm sorry you had a horrible experience with the NHS; personally, I've had family members that were saved using the NHS and had excellent treatment. You say the US is better in that "at least you can choose who to go to if you can pay" but that's the key point. IF you can pay. Unless I'm mistaken, you're not paid back your health insurance payments either and not everyone gets back the health care they put money into. We're both healthy adults with no medical problems but for security reasons, are looking at having to pay something like 25% of our paycheck towards it. God forbid we should get pregnant, because then we'd be up the creek without a paddle - none of this safety net that the UK offers such as maternity grant, lowered living costs, child benefits, and assistance in finding a house (i.e. skipping the line of working couples).

There are things that aren't perfect in the US, but I chose to go through this because I chose to marry an American and attempt to live in his country. I accept that there are differences in health care (as much as I dislike them) and that we're looking at more financial scrutiny because we chose to live here, and I think you'll find many people to agree that the US immigration process is much more difficult than the UK one. You are actually very lucky to be a UK citizen and have chosen to marry a foreigner, which is a right - but bringing them to the UK is a privilege.

I actually dislike the benefit system, it is a lot of the reason for difficult immigration. Trust me if you're on low income it is harder in general to bring somebody to the UK. You have to prove you have a home. You can;t be living with your parents. The house has to be big enough. You must show documentation of bills, taxes. You must show you can live without benefits. You must, overall after all bills, taxes and rent have 109 UKP leftover a week. If you're fully or partly self employed like me, you have to have an accountant and a solicitor to notarise your official business expenses. You can imagine you asre subject to even more scrutiny. You can't have a co-sponsor (though I understand this has recently changed?) Even with a co-sponsor it's going to be hard to find somebody who claims absolutely no benefits and has 109 left over a week.

Ever lived on a council estate among those who know nothing but a life on welfare? It's sheer hell. This is the true cost of welfare. I don't see much reason why a lot of them can't pull themselves out of it bar they are 100% used to it and nothing else. It's put the country in terrible debt and who are the government using as scapegoats? Immigrants.

I don't think it should be a "privilege" to be with the person you marry. I think it should be a right. The way it stands now we have free, open movement and trade with Europe. There is no reason we can't do this for numerous other countries. What exactly is the difference to the Uk between me marrying a french man and an American bar they make it much, much harder fror the American to come here? What I appreciate it's harder for people from poorer countries to be accepted so readily but that's why we need to be helping them build up to our status eventually so we can enjoy greater freedom of movement. We should be offering more help You seem awfully in acceptance of the situation as it is but it is ruining many peoples' lives who are in genuine relationships.

The UK public need educating that immigrants are not the enemy. We need to stop allowing hate speech to circulate in the press. These laws are being brought about because of what the public wants, but the public is seriously wrong and bigoted about this issue. The government needs to stop pandfering to this just for votes and address the core issue. I can admit I can't see that happening. And that's basically why I'm midserable here.

I still don't know if they'll accept the UK visa for my husband and I don't know if the US will accept me either because of mental issues in the past. Imagine sitting in a specialist's office at age 26 and being asked " Why have you been referred for an autism diagnosis when you already have one?" By that point it's too late, way, way too late to save my future immigration to the USA.