Omitting Place of Birth on a US Passport....

[antda 13]

I don't carry my Colombian passport because I don't have one! (special juvenile immigrant SL6. Long story) I think one should have the option to NOT include the place of birth on the passport. I feel more American than Colombian. Maybe I am! I have been living here more time than what I lived in Colombia.

I like Colombia very nice place don't get me wrong but the U.S is where I belong and I don't feel Colombian I love it there but don't feel from there. It's complicated but that's the way it is.

Same here....I don't have my birth country passport either! As I am not a citizen of that country anymore, since I became a Canadian citizen.....

I agree...I feel more American (and Canadian...where I spent most of my life in) than what my birth country is!

And likewise, you should feel the same way too, especially since you've spent most of your life in the USA.....

I feel the same way too....It's complicated....Glad you understand too, edward toro......

Ant

Edited February 6, 2010 by Ant+D+BabyA

[edward toro 3]

Edward toro- Exactly! This was what I was referring to....

Having problems because of what is listed as the "place of birth" on the passports and other documents...

Believe me, if my US passport had a "blank" on it...it would be so much easier.....

Sorry that you had problems travelling back home to the USA because of this issue...

Hope that you don't have too many problems later on travelling either...

Everyone- By the way, here is an article I just found online.....

PRACTICAL TRAVELER; The Case of the Telltale Passport

http://www.nytimes.com/1990/05/06/travel/p...ml?pagewanted=1

Yet another reason why "place of birth" should not be listed on a passport......

A matter of life and death in this case....lol..

Ant

[NickD 202]

Wife has been traveling back to Colombia with either a Venezuelan or US passport for the last 25 years, both say her place of birth is in Colombia. Maybe we are getting paranoid now, so bringing along all of her Colombian ID's, birth certificate, our marriage certificate, her divorce papers and two passport photos.

In thinking back, last time I was there, just handed over my passport, guy never looked at it, just paged through and hit it with a stamp. We had to put our luggage in an X-ray machine and retrieve it, was watching five people standing around talking to each other, no one even looked at the screen. But coming back, that is a problem, wanted of confiscate my laptop because the battery was dead, good thing I also had the charger, examined all of my underwear, and looked at my passport under an electron microscope. Who's paranoid? Had problems with a 4 oz bottle of something my wife purchased at customs, but talked my way into that, see they changed the regulations on that now for purchased items. You don't even get close to that customs store until you get naked for a complete inspection and it was in a sealed box.

[-B&T- 1]

I will have no problem if my US Passport (Dang, can't wait to apply) says my Birthplace is Philippines. I will be proud of where I came from…just sayin...

[NickD 202]

I will have no problem if my US Passport (Dang, can't wait to apply) says my Birthplace is Philippines. I will be proud of where I came from…just sayin...

Believe the USA passport offers more visa to visit free countries than any other passport, but heard the Euro is also pretty good. That's the advantage, the disadvantage is when visiting your home country with the place of birth on it, they can hit you to buy their passports as well. Wife looks and acts very American, only that place of birth gives her away.

[MoroccanInTexas 24]

My 2 cents according to Wikipedia:

"The standards for the names of places of birth that appear in passports are listed in volume 7 of the Foreign Affairs Manual, published by the Department of State. Place of birth was first added to U.S. passports in 1917. A request to list no place of birth in a passport is never accepted. A citizen born outside the United States may be able to have his city or town of birth entered in his passport, if he or she objects to the standard country name. However, if a foreign country denies a visa or entry due to the place-of-birth designation, the Department of State will issue a replacement passport at normal fees, and will not facilitate entry into the foreign country."

I wish the US passport has "Place of birth or Place of neutralization " After all you are born again American

[NickD 202]

My 2 cents according to Wikipedia:

"The standards for the names of places of birth that appear in passports are listed in volume 7 of the Foreign Affairs Manual, published by the Department of State. Place of birth was first added to U.S. passports in 1917. A request to list no place of birth in a passport is never accepted. A citizen born outside the United States may be able to have his city or town of birth entered in his passport, if he or she objects to the standard country name. However, if a foreign country denies a visa or entry due to the place-of-birth designation, the Department of State will issue a replacement passport at normal fees, and will not facilitate entry into the foreign country."

I wish the US passport has "Place of birth or Place of neutralization " After all you are born again American

Maybe you meant naturalization. Certainly, the way it is, and in complete contradiction to the oath, with the place of birth clearly listed, one is put into a position what is called, "dual citizenship." The USCIS is an independent agency as is the DOS. USCIS is saying, now you only have one country, DOS, says you have to honor the requirements of your home country.

Is far easier to get a US passport, can do that in town, and a dinky town at that. Most foreign countries only have 1-3 consulates in the USA, want to see you in person, so can be a minor inconvenience, definitely, a very expensive procedure.

The agreements between countries is certainly no bilateral, as a natural born USC, can freely go down and visit them, but near impossible for them to come and visit us due to very strict and even unreasonable visa requirements. Took my mother-in-law over a year to get a visa to come here, impossible for my wife's unmarried son. But my mother-in-law received such severe harassment from our POE, she never wants to come back.

Was suppose to be on a plane this morning, had a freak accident last night and badly slashed my hand, doctor advised strongly to cancel, so we had too. Fingers still work, thank God, but hand is very painful, don't like being doped out on pain killers, but do have that bottle sitting there. Wife insisted on canceling the trip. Wondering if that plane we were scheduled on would crash, with poor maintenance, becoming far more common, if so, that slash could be a good thing.

USCIS also seems to forget the sacrifices one has to make to come here in terms of family, just think about fraud. Make you take an oath to be 100% allegiant to this country while another agency forces you to serve two countries. Can only wonder on what basis these rules are made from. Smoking crack?

[MoroccanInTexas 24]

Maybe you meant naturalization. Certainly, the way it is, and in complete contradiction to the oath, with the place of birth clearly listed, one is put into a position what is called, "dual citizenship." The USCIS is an independent agency as is the DOS. USCIS is saying, now you only have one country, DOS, says you have to honor the requirements of your home country.

Is far easier to get a US passport, can do that in town, and a dinky town at that. Most foreign countries only have 1-3 consulates in the USA, want to see you in person, so can be a minor inconvenience, definitely, a very expensive procedure.

The agreements between countries is certainly no bilateral, as a natural born USC, can freely go down and visit them, but near impossible for them to come and visit us due to very strict and even unreasonable visa requirements. Took my mother-in-law over a year to get a visa to come here, impossible for my wife's unmarried son. But my mother-in-law received such severe harassment from our POE, she never wants to come back.

Was suppose to be on a plane this morning, had a freak accident last night and badly slashed my hand, doctor advised strongly to cancel, so we had too. Fingers still work, thank God, but hand is very painful, don't like being doped out on pain killers, but do have that bottle sitting there. Wife insisted on canceling the trip. Wondering if that plane we were scheduled on would crash, with poor maintenance, becoming far more common, if so, that slash could be a good thing.

USCIS also seems to forget the sacrifices one has to make to come here in terms of family, just think about fraud. Make you take an oath to be 100% allegiant to this country while another agency forces you to serve two countries. Can only wonder on what basis these rules are made from. Smoking crack?

Thanks for the correction I meant indeed naturalization. I just look at it as treating non born US citizens unfairly. for example if I go to Morocco, and show US passport that has Morocco as place of birth on it. I will be asked to use Moroccan passport, or Moroccan ID. My daughter also, is considered Moroccan, eventhough she is born in the states... Morocco does not allow you to give up your citizenship

[v333k 59]

Thanks for the correction I meant indeed naturalization. I just look at it as treating non born US citizens unfairly. for example if I go to Morocco, and show US passport that has Morocco as place of birth on it. I will be asked to use Moroccan passport, or Moroccan ID. My daughter also, is considered Moroccan, eventhough she is born in the states... Morocco does not allow you to give up your citizenship

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat????? Not allowed to give up your citizenship.... that is crazy! I thought my situation is bad.

OK - well, I think Ant and many others deserve a better explanation than I have given (in a different thread that resulted with this one).

I am born in Jerusalem, Israel, but I am Armenian. I am not Israeli, and I am not Palestinian, I am Armenian. Israel does not grant citizenship based on place of birth, so I ended up with no citizenship at all - I do not have citizenship in Israel or any other country as of today. I have a travel document - actually, I HAD a travel document but Israel took it away from me because I was simply in the US for too long. When I filed for AOS, my lawyer placed me under a category "Stateless" and I would really like not to say Israel for country of birth. If and when I visit my family, and like others have mentioned, the first thing they will ask me is where is your Israeli passport/travel document. My answer, you took it away from me. Then they will ask more and more and more and more questions which I would like to avoid. Saying all this, if I don't list Israel on my passport, then I may visit without any problems and leave without any problems....

So, what do you guys think?

[v333k 59]

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat????? Not allowed to give up your citizenship.... that is crazy! I thought my situation is bad.

OK - well, I think Ant and many others deserve a better explanation than I have given (in a different thread that resulted with this one).

I am born in Jerusalem, Israel, but I am Armenian. I am not Israeli, and I am not Palestinian, I am Armenian. Israel does not grant citizenship based on place of birth, so I ended up with no citizenship at all - I do not have citizenship in Israel or any other country as of today. I have a travel document - actually, I HAD a travel document but Israel took it away from me because I was simply in the US for too long. When I filed for AOS, my lawyer placed me under a category "Stateless" and I would really like not to say Israel for country of birth. If and when I visit my family, and like others have mentioned, the first thing they will ask me is where is your Israeli passport/travel document. My answer, you took it away from me. Then they will ask more and more and more and more questions which I would like to avoid. Saying all this, if I don't list Israel on my passport, then I may visit without any problems and leave without any problems....

So, what do you guys think?

Actually - I was reading a link from one of the replies and it clearly states that I need to write in the Place of Birth as Jerusalem and not Israel - so maybe this is the answer to my problem.

[antda 13]

Hi Everyone,

More replies..

I-10West-Glad that you are proud where you are from....Some other people aren't as proud where they came from...just saying.....

I will have no problem if my US Passport (Dang, can't wait to apply) says my Birthplace is Philippines. I will be proud of where I came from…just sayin...

NickD-I agree, there are disadvantages of having place of birth on it...The birth place does give it away.......Sigh....

Believe the USA passport offers more visa to visit free countries than any other passport, but heard the Euro is also pretty good. That's the advantage, the disadvantage is when visiting your home country with the place of birth on it, they can hit you to buy their passports as well. Wife looks and acts very American, only that place of birth gives her away.

MoroccanInTexas-Thanks for the extra info....Sigh...Whoever made that law in 1917 wasn't aware of political/social conflicts between countries affecting immigratns and how many immigrants would be immigrating to the USA nowadays.....Then again....They were too busy with WWI then...lol.....

I agree...I would rather have a "place of naturalization" ....I am a born-again American! Born in Buffalo, NY, USA!

Oh well..I'll take Canada...As I was naturalized there too....lol....I was born again in Canada too!

I have three lives and three births! Uggh.......

Btw..here's an interesting fact...Canadian naturalization certificates and citizenship cards do not contain "place of birth or nautralization" on it...lol....

And neither does a Canadian passport (if one requests to have such not be listed...It's legally acceptable there...)

Wish they can do the same thing about the passports and certificates here in the USA.......

My 2 cents according to Wikipedia:

"The standards for the names of places of birth that appear in passports are listed in volume 7 of the Foreign Affairs Manual, published by the Department of State. Place of birth was first added to U.S. passports in 1917. A request to list no place of birth in a passport is never accepted. A citizen born outside the United States may be able to have his city or town of birth entered in his passport, if he or she objects to the standard country name. However, if a foreign country denies a visa or entry due to the place-of-birth designation, the Department of State will issue a replacement passport at normal fees, and will not facilitate entry into the foreign country."

I wish the US passport has "Place of birth or Place of neutralization " After all you are born again American

NickD-I agree, it is a contradiction to the oath..You are only loyal to the USA...So what is this deal with the birth country being listed?

That's a good point that you brought up about "being loyal to another county through birth"........

When we are only allowed to be loyal to the USA by "being loyal to the USA through a naturalization re-birth..."

Contradictory, indeed!

Again, I think this is a form of discrimination......

Though in ways...It does open the doors to dual citizenship...In an indirect way....

Lol...Actually, it's easier for me to get a Canadian passport in-person than an American passport....

It only takes me 1-2 hours to get in-person to a Canadian passport office and about 5-10 hours to get in-person to an American passport office.....lol.... So yeah...that's odd in ways.....Definitely not conveneint for passport purposes for me to be American...rofl....

I agree too, that the USCIS forgets that we all make sacrifices to be here in the USA.....

And if that means sacrificing a former country, then why put ties to such?......Contradictory, indeed!

Maybe you meant naturalization. Certainly, the way it is, and in complete contradiction to the oath, with the place of birth clearly listed, one is put into a position what is called, "dual citizenship." The USCIS is an independent agency as is the DOS. USCIS is saying, now you only have one country, DOS, says you have to honor the requirements of your home country.

Is far easier to get a US passport, can do that in town, and a dinky town at that. Most foreign countries only have 1-3 consulates in the USA, want to see you in person, so can be a minor inconvenience, definitely, a very expensive procedure.

USCIS also seems to forget the sacrifices one has to make to come here in terms of family, just think about fraud. Make you take an oath to be 100% allegiant to this country while another agency forces you to serve two countries. Can only wonder on what basis these rules are made from. Smoking crack?

V333k-There are ways that you can give up your citizenship to a particular country. Depending on the country and its rules/regulations, can you get that done. I admit, I have tried to do such with my birth country (other country..not Canada). However, I ran into some difficulties along the way, so I gave up on such...But nevertheless, I found out that it can be done..And who knows, maybe I will do it someday...Meanwhile, I'll still be Canadian and American and be "dual", which is fine with me...lol....

Thanks too, for explaining your situation further. Now I see why as to how you can file "stateless".....

And you're welcome that I helped by posting an article about a similar situation...(lol...I didn't mean to do that...glad it helped anyways)

So in your case..."Jerusalem" is the answer to your problem...

Maybe you can have that on your naturalization certificate and your passport too!

Good luck in getting that to go through, and yes, if you ever get it done, do post about that on vj!

V33k=Jerusalem....Very good idea, indeed!

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat????? Not allowed to give up your citizenship.... that is crazy! I thought my situation is bad.

OK - well, I think Ant and many others deserve a better explanation than I have given (in a different thread that resulted with this one).

I am born in Jerusalem, Israel, but I am Armenian. I am not Israeli, and I am not Palestinian, I am Armenian. Israel does not grant citizenship based on place of birth, so I ended up with no citizenship at all - I do not have citizenship in Israel or any other country as of today. I have a travel document - actually, I HAD a travel document but Israel took it away from me because I was simply in the US for too long. When I filed for AOS, my lawyer placed me under a category "Stateless" and I would really like not to say Israel for country of birth. If and when I visit my family, and like others have mentioned, the first thing they will ask me is where is your Israeli passport/travel document. My answer, you took it away from me. Then they will ask more and more and more and more questions which I would like to avoid. Saying all this, if I don't list Israel on my passport, then I may visit without any problems and leave without any problems....

So, what do you guys think?

Actually - I was reading a link from one of the replies and it clearly states that I need to write in the Place of Birth as Jerusalem and not Israel - so maybe this is the answer to my problem.

Everyone-Thanks for your replies...

Now I have more of an idea on what to do next..

In the meantime.....

I'll just have to make do without a US Passport........

Until I can get this sorted out in-person......

Oh well..I still have my EDL..good enough for now for travel purposes(btw...there is no birthplace stated on an EDL...what a relief...lol...)...

Good luck everyone with your journeys and travels too.

Ant

Edited February 13, 2010 by Ant+D+BabyA

[NickD 202]

Sure wouldn't help a person if they listed Jerusalem instead of Israel, or Bogota instead of Colombia, really quite obvious what country you are from.

[v333k 59]

Hi Ant, and everyone!

I finally got a chance to look into it... basically, if filing stateless means not putting any information under the nationality section.

Thanks for all your replies!

[NickD 202]

Bottom line is that if you question any agency regarding their laws or procedures, they will bounce back and state these laws or procedures were made by congress. So it doesn't do any good to argue with them, have to go to congress. And it does do good to contact your representatives as I see some wording changes in the IRS forms that I objected to that cleared up then nebulous method they used to ask a question.

The place of birth is an excellent example of this in creating a hardship if that home country does require a USC to maintain a passport for that country, where any natural born USC can visit that same country without a visa with their US passport. Leaving the key question, are you really a USC or not. And we certainly do not have bilateral agreements with many countries, as USC's, we are free to visit there, but next to impossible for them to get a visa to visit us.

While we can pull a spouse out of a foreign country, certainly cannot bring their entire family here and they do like to visit occasionally, that place of birth does present a hardship.

Time to write a very short meaningful letter to your congressman to see if this minor procedure can be changed. One think about the USA, we are a nation of all nationalities and our naturalized citizens showing complete allegiance to this country should not be penalized by this place of birth requirement.

I would opt instead for the place where the naturalization took place. You cannot start a new life if hindered by your past.

[MoroccanInTexas 24]

Bottom line is that if you question any agency regarding their laws or procedures, they will bounce back and state these laws or procedures were made by congress. So it doesn't do any good to argue with them, have to go to congress. And it does do good to contact your representatives as I see some wording changes in the IRS forms that I objected to that cleared up then nebulous method they used to ask a question.

The place of birth is an excellent example of this in creating a hardship if that home country does require a USC to maintain a passport for that country, where any natural born USC can visit that same country without a visa with their US passport. Leaving the key question, are you really a USC or not. And we certainly do not have bilateral agreements with many countries, as USC's, we are free to visit there, but next to impossible for them to get a visa to visit us.

While we can pull a spouse out of a foreign country, certainly cannot bring their entire family here and they do like to visit occasionally, that place of birth does present a hardship.

Time to write a very short meaningful letter to your congressman to see if this minor procedure can be changed. One think about the USA, we are a nation of all nationalities and our naturalized citizens showing complete allegiance to this country should not be penalized by this place of birth requirement.

I would opt instead for the place where the naturalization took place. You cannot start a new life if hindered by your past.

Maybe we should start a petition. And try to get some media attention to this issue. Ant D you are good with words, can you please put something together that we can send to our congress members, and maybe share with other VJ members ?

On another note, I think Jerusalem is listed as such, since it is still contested legally between the two countries...