Men Are Back

[natty bumppo 297]

Would you trust anyone here to work on a nuclear reactor and build anything of quality?

Half of the manual labor work I see here is quite shoddy.

are your talking about the EQ locations or BoP?

[NickD 203]

the work to start a greenfield nuclear plant in the US is very costly as there is a lot of opposition from NIMBYs and other regs. many facilities are getting extensions on existing permits. there may be a trend to expand existing facilities or rework existing facilities to upgrade reactor equipment. new pwr and epr designs (one is approved already) should make for interesting reading regarding US facilities. meanwhile ... other world areas are building nuclear power plants ....

Since I like to use logic in what some may consider in an illogical way, feel the main objectors to nuclear power are those that benefit the most from not using it. Like the oil and coal companies. They work very indirectly and love to use scare tactics. A recent example was running an extension cord up to the Indians in Canada to obtain cheap and clean hydroelectric power. All kinds of scare tactics were used about magnetic radiation from these lines. Even proved a person operating a vacuum cleaner receives a higher dose of magnetic radiation than standing directly under the lines as the radiation decreases by the cube of the distance. But hey, they are just trying to make more money and the hell with the environment.

[natty bumppo 297]

Since I like to use logic in what some may consider in an illogical way, feel the main objectors to nuclear power are those that benefit the most from not using it. Like the oil and coal companies. They work very indirectly and love to use scare tactics. A recent example was running an extension cord up to the Indians in Canada to obtain cheap and clean hydroelectric power. All kinds of scare tactics were used about magnetic radiation from these lines. Even proved a person operating a vacuum cleaner receives a higher dose of magnetic radiation than standing directly under the lines as the radiation decreases by the cube of the distance. But hey, they are just trying to make more money and the hell with the environment.

that is also part of the equation. why would the fossil people want to see a decrease on their paycheck?

[FortLaudy 10]

Good point. I love my husband for many reasons, but fell in love with him cause he's a down to earth, honest, good, useful man who can fix just about anything around the house or the cars by himself, can build many things from scratch, up for any kind of adventurous fun, and loves me dearly. He's not rich at all, and that's one thing guys get wrong, they think if they make enough money they can get or keep any girl. BS.

About the truck. Trucks are useful, if there was a cheap electrical one we'd probably have on of those, but we need a truck for sure, just like he says, it's for work, not to show off.

[Ali G. 37]

are your talking about the EQ locations or BoP?

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank. I have seen 150 year old houses that are bloody incredible, considering the lack of tools and know-how they had back then.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Booyah

[FortLaudy 10]

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank. I have seen 150 year old houses that are bloody incredible, considering the lack of tools and know-how they had back then.

I agree !!! People start relying on technology and outsourcing too much and forget how to do things properly. That's why I'm so into antiques and would never buy a piece of furniture that's not solid wood, I have no respect for anything contemporary or modernly made, it's all put together cheaply with cheap materials and has no character. The founders of this country and many others built and invented everything from scratch - raw materials, hard work and smart heads working together, if we apply that type of thinking and hard work to solving such things as this energy crisis it would be awesome!

[The_Dude 1,142]

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank. I have seen 150 year old houses that are bloody incredible, considering the lack of tools and know-how they had back then.

I had to go out and look up at the sky to make sure that the apocalypse wasn't upon us. Nope. I agree with BY on this. I however think that it's more a function of the nature of construction these days. If you cut some corners, it can be a huge business. A friend of mine was having a home build about 18 months ago, and the contractor was just unbelievably overburdened. He had 4 jobs going at once and had subcontracted out most of the work and would only show up to each site for a couple of hours each day. There was no overall supervision and the work was poor. My friend ended up in court with the guy over it. I've seen this same scenario play out in other countries though.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I however think that it's more a function of the nature of construction these days. If you cut some corners, it can be a huge business.

That's K Hovnanian's entire business model.

[The_Dude 1,142]

That's K Hovnanian's entire business model.

Haliburton too.

[natty bumppo 297]

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank.

Environmentally Qualified locations or Balance of Plant (non EQ)

don't forget this little wonderful thing called 10 CFR regulations ... and the tomes of documents detailing other regulations. it is quite expensive to qualify a product for use within a nuclear power facility EQ area. safety related material/ products are documented and tracked. there is a long list of IEEE specifications with qualification testing requirements that must be met before a product is used in this type of application. There are also audit/validation procedures that run the gamut from PMI, NUPIC, QA Manuals, QME-1, etc, etc, etc. (the list of acronyms is quite long ...)

[natty bumppo 297]

Environmentally Qualified locations or Balance of Plant (non EQ)

don't forget this little wonderful thing called 10 CFR regulations ... and the tomes of documents detailing other regulations. it is quite expensive to qualify a product for use within a nuclear power facility EQ area. safety related material/ products are documented and tracked. there is a long list of IEEE specifications with qualification testing requirements that must be met before a product is used in this type of application. There are also audit/validation procedures that run the gamut from PMI, NUPIC, QA Manuals, QME-1, etc, etc, etc. (the list of acronyms is quite long ...)

forgot to add the nuclear power operators and equipment suppliers promote and support various user groups and conferences that are targeted to keep all plants appraised of any issues that may develop in regards to the operational safety of their facility. these are in addition to the 10 cfr 21 reports.

the nuclear power generation operators do communicate to each other. they want to know about any potential issues before they become issues at their facility. these facilities have very detailed PM programs and are a proactive in maintenance. they want to schedule their outages ... not have it a gov't mandated shutdown due to a safety issue due to a finding at another faciltiy. the last thing these facilities want is a shutdown or an unfavorable audit or the OIG to get involved.

also ... many equipment suppliers have been in the business of providing EQ equipment to the nuclear power industry back to the days of yore ... the constant updating of products to meet new certification standards and the price of admission to be able to supply equipment (qualification testing) is quite high. products do fail this test program and are not permitted at the plants. this does tend to keep out the poorly constructed products.

[Danno 1,228]

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank. I have seen 150 year old houses that are bloody incredible, considering the lack of tools and know-how they had back then.

While your point has some merit one must keep in mind when you look at a 100 yr old house, it was by definition "well built" or you would not be looking at it today, to assume all houses were built that way is flawed logic, if so a lot more would be standing.

Kinda like looking at a hundred year old man and saying.... wow people must have been more healthy back then cuz this guy lived to be a hundred.

Generally speaking older houses (75 years or more).

-often had higher foundations which prolonged life due to termites and moisture rot.

- Exterior woods were milled Older growth trees which are more decay resistant and prolonged life.

-Roofing material was better and longer lasting, once a roof goes on a house the rest follows quickly.

- Houses had much better air circulation with no insulation, this greatly reduced moisture rot inside of walls etc.

If you notice the number one thing all the above have in common is moisture. Keep a house weather tight from moisture and you have eliminated 90% of the things which bring houses down.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Do you know how first hand the efficiencies of nuclear power? Most steam plants have the same efficiency. Litigation + ignorance = fail

Some people here on VJ don't even know the difference between nuclear weapons, commercial nuclear power and nuclear reactors used for nuclear weapons production. The USA does trail the world in science but leads the world in video games. How sad.

I'm not talking about the actual efficiency of the process, I'm talking about the economics. IE the costs of US Nuclear out weighed the benefits.

Now I'm not against Nuclear but it had better make economic sense. The previous generation failed to produce, and I realize that in part it was because a ton of orders were canceled after 1974 which drives up individual costs (much like the F22....with each additional fighter produced the cost is spread out further and further).

[Ali G. 37]

While your point has some merit one must keep in mind when you look at a 100 yr old house, it was by definition "well built" or you would not be looking at it today, to assume all houses were built that way is flawed logic, if so a lot more would be standing.

Kinda like looking at a hundred year old man and saying.... wow people must have been more healthy back then cuz this guy lived to be a hundred.

Generally speaking older houses (75 years or more).

-often had higher foundations which prolonged life due to termites and moisture rot.

- Exterior woods were milled Older growth trees which are more decay resistant and prolonged life.

-Roofing material was better and longer lasting, once a roof goes on a house the rest follows quickly.

- Houses had much better air circulation with no insulation, this greatly reduced moisture rot inside of walls etc.

If you notice the number one thing all the above have in common is moisture. Keep a house weather tight from moisture and you have eliminated 90% of the things which bring houses down.

Most homes built now seem to be cookie cutter homes, with many built in less than a month; in particular, those built in HOA communities. Numerous companies no longer give a ####### about the quality or end product, they're in it for the buck. Without any government regulation, you are at their mercy and will have to battle any problem out in court. The other issue is that generation Y does not seem to care of have the knack for quality. After all, why would they when everything was handed to them? This is a common problem I find mentioned by a number of folks who work in any manual labor industry. Interestingly enough, also a reason why many prefer to hire illegal immigrants.

Now, there are some builders that do build good homes. I know in this area I really like the quality of homes built by brookfield and centex.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Booyah

[NickD 203]

I don't know what those are. I am talking about the quality of workmanship in the US, something that seems to have drastically dived with anything built after the 70s. These new homes up here, for example, have really poor construction quality. Half my family and friends are in construction, so I have been around construction sites and know a thing or two about it.

In contrast, anything built prior to the 70's here was built like a freagin tank. I have seen 150 year old houses that are bloody incredible, considering the lack of tools and know-how they had back then.

What's wrong with glued together saw dust and plastic siding, windows, woodwork, doors, plumbing, and electrical?