56% of all Americans and 58% of those 18-29 yrs old say abortion immoral

[Peikko 1,575]

No, you do it in other ways, we all do, some just pretend.

DO you believe it is moral to insure every person has healthcare, would you vote to impose this system on those who don't want to?

I could throw a hundred such questions.

Bottom line; we as citizens have a right and perhaps obligation to "collectively" impose our morals on others.

Danno, health care is not a moral question. What you seem to be doing is confusing morality and social responsibilty. I agree that there is a relationship, but they are not interchangable.

Edited January 23, 2010 by Madame Cleo

[DEDixon 39]

Dixon, I can safely say you know absolutely nothing about giving birth. Using pain killers can be dangerous for both mother and baby, so it's not simply a question of mother feeling a bit sore and the Dr swooping in and administering anaesthetic and zap, no pain. How silly.

i'm talking about the injection they give in the spin... what's that? you are right, i don't know much, but my friends have told me with that spinal injection, they were good to go after that.

[_Simpson_ 250]

As for abortion being the 'easy' road, I would say that's only the case when it's the morning after pill type scenario, for the rest, it's not an easy road by any stretch of the imagination.

I didnt say it was a easy road and you took what was said out of context.

of course its not a easy road but to a desperate teenager looking at having to raise a child it surely begins to look like it. Often I dont think the girls are really prepared for the emotional damage a abortion causes, besides a tougher and more rewarding road would be to give it up for adoption. We need to to take a tough stand on this and quit it with that silly notion that abortion might be the better option.

[Peikko 1,575]

i'm talking about the injection they give in the spin... what's that? you are right, i don't know much, but my friends have told me with that spinal injection, they were good to go after that.

They are potentially dangerous. I don't know how freely they are administered in the US, but in the UK you only get one if you are getting a caesarian, it's not used to manage pain.

[DEDixon 39]

There are many things worse than death - hence why people seek suicide and euthanasia. It seems that you lead a sheltered life Dixon. Mind you, you are equating a fetus with a baby which is also rather ridiculous but I know you don't understand the difference because this discussion has happened before.

i know the difference but just thinking people are smart enough to know what i mean... fetus.. baby.. all the same to me but yeah, some people do need to be precise. i just don't have time to be precise.. exact... i just get it out any way i can. LOL!

They are potentially dangerous. I don't know how freely they are administered in the US, but in the UK you only get one if you are getting a caesarian, it's not used to manage pain.

wow, i was under the impression that those things were used frequently. i'm going to ask around... be right back!

[Peikko 1,575]

I didnt say it was a easy road and you took what was said out of context.

of course its not a easy road but to a desperate teenager looking at having to raise a child it surely begins to look like it. Often I dont think the girls are really prepared for the emotional damage a abortion causes, besides a tougher and more rewarding road would be to give it up for adoption. We need to to take a tough stand on this and quit it with that silly notion that abortion might be the better option.

I don't think anyone can be fully prepared for the emotional damage of a medical abortion (as apposed to the 'chemical morning after type of abortion which is by far the most common type) but to say that giving a child up for adoption is a more rewarding solution? It's anything but. Feelings for children do not disappear just because the baby is no longer in ones care, nor does the adopted child have an easy path through life. Abortion can be the better option, all be it a troubling one as well. The best solution is prevention and if any tough stand should be taken it is the one on ensuring that all children are given sound advice on preventative measures not simply told to abstain, get married or face the consequences.

Edited January 23, 2010 by Madame Cleo

[Marilyn. 340]

I am pretty sure epidurals are used quite often for pain management during labour here in the US...

Edited January 23, 2010 by Marilyn.

[DEDixon 39]

There are many things worse than death - hence why people seek suicide and euthanasia. It seems that you lead a sheltered life Dixon. Mind you, you are equating a fetus with a baby which is also rather ridiculous but I know you don't understand the difference because this discussion has happened before.

haha, in some ways yes, in other ways no. lol, people on forums often try to portray themselves as experts on everything... i do not and it is why i stick to the simple sheet, on a lot of the sheet we talk about on this forum, we are all dumb asses really. the real experts would be LOL!

I am pretty sure epidurals are used quite often for pain management during labour here in the US...

that is the word i was looking for (thanks!).

[Peikko 1,575]

I am pretty sure epidurals are used quite often for pain management during labour here in the US...

My experience is with the UK system. They are dangerous (as are all anesthetics) and are not used for pain management. The fetus heart rate can be seriously affected by them so I would be surprised if this is a condoned medical practice but then again, I am often surprised by the US health care system

[natty bumppo 297]

My experience is with the UK system. They are dangerous (as are all anesthetics) and are not used for pain management. The fetus heart rate can be seriously affected by them so I would be surprised if this is a condoned medical practice but then again, I am often surprised by the US health care system

my experience ... my wife was not natural cb

is there a difference in drugs between c-section and ncb?

Edited January 23, 2010 by Natty Bumppo

[rika60607 215]

time and effort for 8 months.... lol, seems an easy choice, kill or let live, take care of yourself for 8 months out of a life time.... huge sacrifice, in deed.

It is no sacrifice if you have no goal in life, for sure... but while some of us do nothing, others try to get somewhere before we die

painful birth process.. from what i hear, it isn't painful these days, the minute the pain starts, they can inject her.

Have a baby first, then tell me how easy and painless it was, and then I will tell you that you just got lucky.

could kill the mother.... if this were a high risk, no woman would get pregnant so why mention it. this one makes you seem desperate to make your case (sorry... just sayin)

I would and I will. Guess I am no woman then

health complication... no doubt, pregnancy can be easy for some and darn difficult and miserable for others.

how can one require it... some fathers have tried the courts, but i'm too lazy to look for any successful cases. i don't think men have pressed that hard to establish their rights in this matter so aren't that many cases out there. if there were a lot of cases, i'm betting fathers would have more rights, because with more cases, it then becomes a political issue rather than just a few men trying to fight the system.

how can one require it and yet not lose one's high moral ground? that was the question.

All that to bring a child into the world to be raised with no mother... lol again... no mother, no father, so what, when did both parents suddenly become a priority in america?

think joint custody, father's rights etc. But this is not about America, this is about every woman who wants to have that choice. America took away enough personal freedoms already

[Marilyn. 340]

my experience ... my wife was not natural cb

is there a difference in drugs between c-section and ncb?

i was just reading about all this and they say you can get a light epidural where you are still able to walk around and stuff...

it also said this...

Medication given by epidural is unlikely to affect your baby. However, fetal heart monitoring is often used along with epidural anesthesia to make sure that the baby is doing well during the labor.

http://www.revolutionhealth.com/healthy-li...idural-decision

[rika60607 215]

Danno, if you truly believe so and we the citizens impose something on you, will you oblige?

I am hoping for a yes here

Bottom line; we as citizens have a right and perhaps obligation to "collectively" impose our morals on others.

[_Simpson_ 250]

I don't think anyone can be fully prepared for the emotional damage of a medical abortion (as apposed to the 'chemical morning after type of abortion which is by far the most common type) but to say that giving a child up for adoption is a more rewarding solution? It's anything but. Feelings for children do not disappear just because the baby is no longer in ones care, nor does the adopted child have an easy path through life. Abortion can be the better option, all be it a troubling one as well. The best solution is prevention and if any tough stand should be taken it is the one on ensuring that all children are given sound advice on preventative measures not simply told to abstain, get married or face the consequences.

It is a more rewarding choice because 20 years down the road your going to be proud of the fact you did what was best for the child and didnt make decisions based on what was best for you. Lets face it adopting a child (newborn) isnt easy and there is a long list of well screened people. No need to base a conclusion on the exception to the rule.

You talked about the feelings that a mother might have for a child and how they dont go away, I agree. Do you think that the feeling they had about the abortion goes away? My mom had a abortion and she still gets choked up until this day. She is pro-life and I find that most who have had a abortion tend to be pro-life.

[Peikko 1,575]

my experience ... my wife was not natural cb

is there a difference in drugs between c-section and ncb?

I don't think I understand the question. A C-section is when the baby is removed from the womb by means of an incision into the abdoman bipassing the birth canal. I am not quite sure how one could perform one without anaesthetic, either general or epidural, the shock would probably kill the mother. A natural child birth is via the birth canal and anasthetic would in fact render the birth impossible as the mother would no longer be able to use the muscles required for birth.

Edited January 23, 2010 by Madame Cleo