PLEASE! I Need Advice Regarding Fiance's Tourist Visa App. to Visit Me

[Sc0tt28 26]

It's stupid, non-sensical, in short the American Way of the 21st Century where instilled fear dictates everything and creates boundaries instead of reaching out to others. If I had any say in this, I would eliminate the source of the problem, the imperialistic way the US invades foreign and autonomous countries, to be precise, which creates the hatred against the US as a nation. I would spend the billions of Dollars on schools and hospitals instead of bombs, do positive things instead of bombing them and invading their villages and homes, and the people would love the Americans for it, instead of having it the other way around.

What's stupid and non-sensical is to not defend yourself when you are attacked. The "beginning" of modern terrorism started with the 1972 Olympics in Berlin and went down hill from there until September 11, 2001 when we finally said "enough is enough". Let me give you a little history lesson:

1972 - Terrorists attacked the Olympics in Munich, Germany, killed 2 athletes, and took hostages and a helicopter. Police snipers shot the terrorists but didn't kill them. One of the terrorists threw a hand grenade into the helicopter and killed all the hostages.

I don't know what could be more "peaceful" (hence the doves) than the Olympics but according to your logic we should have just let them go.

11/4/79 - 80 Iranian students invaded the US embassy in Tehran, Iran and took 52 US citizens hostage. The abductors demanded that the US extradite the overthrown Shah of Iran, Reza Pahlavi, who was in the US for medical treatment, so that they could execute him. US refused demand. The hostages were held until 1/20/81 (444 days).

How dare we "invade" their country by putting an embassy there!

4/8/80 - On order of President Carter, US ended diplomatic relations with Iran due to failure of negotiations to persuade Iran to release the hostages taken 11/4/79.

Like with the Olympic attack maybe we should just lie on our backs and hope they don't do it again.

4/80 - 6 Islamic terrorists seized the Iranian embassy in London. They announced that they would kill a hostage every half hour, and killed two.

Maybe the Brits should have kicked the Iranians out so that they could build a hospital or a school where the embassy was?

3/82 - Carlos the Jackal attacked public buildings and transportation facilities in France, in retaliation for the 2/82 arrest of his girlfriend in Paris when she was found with explosives in her car.

Maybe she was just going to spruce up her apartment with those explosives. Feel free to point out where the US has become imperialistic.

4/18/83 - Hizballah suicide bomber with the support of Iran and Libya crashed a pickup truck full of explosives into the US embassy in Beirut, Lebanon. 63 people killed, of whom 17 were US citizens.

Gosh we just keep "invading" these poor, misunderstood people by putting embassies in their county. How dare we!

12/12/83 - Shiite suicide truck bomber working for the government of Iran crashed into the US embassy in Kuwait. Additional attacks on the French embassy, apartments of Raytheon Corporation employees, the control tower of the airport, and an oil refinery. Total of 5 people killed and 80 injured.

You do realize that embassies are internationally recognized as being extensions of the country that the embassy belongs to? Meaning: an attack on a US embassy is an attack on the US itself. But maybe we should just let it slide.

11/20/84 - Truck bomb exploded outside the Aukar, Lebanon annex of the US embassy in Beirut. 24 people killed.

Those 24 people must be the imperialists seeking to destroy their homeland. Again...feel free to point out where the US is stepping on peoples toes here.

12/3/84 - Kuwait Airways Flight 221 from Kuwait to Pakistan was hijacked and diverted to Tehran. Hijackers demanded the release of 17 suspects arrested by Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. When the demand was refused, the hijackers killed 2 passengers who were US government employees. Iranian troops entered the plane, arrested the hijackers, released the passengers. Iran later released the hijackers instead of putting them on trial.

OK, let me get this straight, they bomb our embassy, we arrest some of the people responsible and so that is being imperialistic and deserving of the lives of 2 government employees on a plane?

6/14/85 - TWA Flight 847 from Athens to Rome was hijacked and diverted to Beirut, Lebanon. Hijackers demanded the release of 500 Shiites imprisoned by Israel and the the 17 suspects imprisoned in Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. Hijackers killed U.S. Navy Diver Robert Stethem and threw his body out onto the airport tarmac.

Back to those 17 people responsible for the attack of the embassy in Kuwait (aka US soil). I suppose your justification will be that at least they murdered a sailor and not a civilian.

12/17/85 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed the airports in Vienna and Rome, killing 20 people.

I guess the Italians were being imperialistic too?

4/5/86 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed a disco in West Berlin, killing a Turkish woman and a US soldier, and injuring hundreds.

For the record the US soldier killed in that bombing was there because after WWII, it was decided that Germany needed a babysitter (having started both World Wars). This decision was not made soley by the US.

4/15/86 - In retaliation for the disco bombing of 4/5/86, the US, under orders from President Reagan, bombed Benghazi and Tripoli in Libya. (After the bombing, Libyan militants associated with Abu Nidal retaliated by killing three US citizens employed by the University of Beirut.)

Self defense warrants additional terrorist attacks?

12/23/88 - A bomb onboard 757 airliner Pan Am Flight 103 exploded over Lockerbie, Scotland, killing 270 (259 aboard and 11 town residents).

I remember hearing something about this in the news fairly recently...who was responsible for that? Oh yeah - Libya!

8/2/90 - Iraq invaded Kuwait, a member state of the United Nations.

Make a note "KUWAIT IS A MEMBER OF THE UN!!"

1990-1991 - The Persian Gulf War: United Nations coalition forced Iraq to withdraw from occupied Kuwait.

The UN coalition forced Iraq out...not the US. Maybe you need to read the UN charter if you think the US was being imperialistic by helping to repel the invasion of a sovereign nation.

1991 - Saudia Arabia rejected Osama bin Laden's offer of his help in fighting Iraq, and then permitted US troops to use its military bases. Bin Laden was said to have felt insulted and became more determined to declare both the US and Saudi Arabia to be enemies.

Saudi Arabia is the one that hurt bin Laden's feelings, not the US. Saudi Arabia was gracious enough to allow the US to keep troops in their county, we did not invade them.

2/26/93 Car bomb exploded at 5:12 PM on the second level of parking basement in the World Trade Center, killed 7 and injured hundreds.

We pretty much let this one slide...regrettably.

3/20/95 Japanese terrorists released Sarin nerve gas into Tokyo subway trains. 12 killed and approximately 5,000 to 6,000 injured.

Sarin nerve gas might not be the worst way to die but its probably in the top 5.

11/13/95 - Truck bombing of US National Guard training center in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. 7 people killed, including 5 US military personnel.

Again, Saudi Arabia allowed us to keep troops there in case Iraq decided to invade Kuwait AGAIN!

6/25/96 - Truck bombing of Khobar Towers in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, a residence of US military personnel. 19 US military personnel were killed.

Has the dead horse been beat enough?

8/23/96 - Date on bin Laden's written "declaration" of attack against the US. The document was written and published about two months after the bombing in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. Demands included the removal of US troops from Saudi Arabia, and the overthrow of the government of Saudi Arabia.

It wasn't Saudi Arabia that had a problem with our troops there but bin Laden made it there problem. Maybe we should just do what he says...I'm sure that will work our real well for us.

9/11/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the city of Jalalabad, Afghanistan.

Note the date.

9/27/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the capital city of Kabul, Afghanistan.

Maybe Afghanistan was being too imperialistic?

8/7/98 - A car bomb exploded outside US embassy in Nairobi, Kenya. A few hours later, explosion at US embassy in Dar es Salaam, capital of tanzania. In both attacks, 224 people were killed and almost 5,000 were injured.

The embassy "dead horse" has not been properly flogged and so I'll reiterate. Embassies are used by every country in the world to propagate peace between countries.

9/11/98 The United Nations announced that it had confirmed an accusation by Amnesty International that the Taliban government of Afghanistan had massacred thousands of people near Mazar-i-Sharif in 8/98. The killings were committed because the victims were of the Hazara ethnic group and of the Shiite denomination of Islam.

Akin to Protestant Christians slaughtering thousands of Baptists simply because they have a different opinion about the same religion.

10/12/00 - Suicide bombing of the U.S.S. Cole. The ship was refueling at the port city of Aden in Yemen when attacked. A boat filled with explosives got near the Cole and exploded, producing a large hole in the ship. 17 US sailors were killed and 37 were injured.

An attack on a military ship is considered to be a declaration of war in most countries - including this one.

8/3/01 - Taliban government of Afghanistan arrested 24 international humanitarian aid workers in Kabul. Incarcerated were 16 citizens of Afghanistan, 4 from Germany, 2 from the US and 2 from Australia. Several were accused of trying to propagate Christianity, punishable by long prison terms or execution.

Accused to trying to propagate Christianity...wow. Before you accuse the Christians of being imperialists, a major tenet of the religion is to spread the Gospel to all nations. They are just trying to obey their God in the best way they know how.

And then there was 9/11/2001. We sat on our hands and did nothing (or very little) for years and years and years and years, and 5,000 people paid the price for our passivity. I didn't vote for Bush in either one of the elections but at least he did something instead of sticking his head in the sand and hoping the terrorists would find someone else to pick on.

[Sc0tt28 26]

What's stupid and non-sensical is to not defend yourself when you are attacked. The "beginning" of modern terrorism started with the 1972 Olympics in Berlin and went down hill from there until September 11, 2001 when we finally said "enough is enough". Let me give you a little history lesson:

1972 - Terrorists attacked the Olympics in Munich, Germany, killed 2 athletes, and took hostages and a helicopter. Police snipers shot the terrorists but didn't kill them. One of the terrorists threw a hand grenade into the helicopter and killed all the hostages.

I don't know what could be more "peaceful" (hence the doves) than the Olympics but according to your logic we should have just let them go.

11/4/79 - 80 Iranian students invaded the US embassy in Tehran, Iran and took 52 US citizens hostage. The abductors demanded that the US extradite the overthrown Shah of Iran, Reza Pahlavi, who was in the US for medical treatment, so that they could execute him. US refused demand. The hostages were held until 1/20/81 (444 days).

How dare we "invade" their country by putting an embassy there!

4/8/80 - On order of President Carter, US ended diplomatic relations with Iran due to failure of negotiations to persuade Iran to release the hostages taken 11/4/79.

Like with the Olympic attack maybe we should just lie on our backs and hope they don't do it again.

4/80 - 6 Islamic terrorists seized the Iranian embassy in London. They announced that they would kill a hostage every half hour, and killed two.

Maybe the Brits should have kicked the Iranians out so that they could build a hospital or a school where the embassy was?

3/82 - Carlos the Jackal attacked public buildings and transportation facilities in France, in retaliation for the 2/82 arrest of his girlfriend in Paris when she was found with explosives in her car.

Maybe she was just going to spruce up her apartment with those explosives. Feel free to point out where the US has become imperialistic.

4/18/83 - Hizballah suicide bomber with the support of Iran and Libya crashed a pickup truck full of explosives into the US embassy in Beirut, Lebanon. 63 people killed, of whom 17 were US citizens.

Gosh we just keep "invading" these poor, misunderstood people by putting embassies in their county. How dare we!

12/12/83 - Shiite suicide truck bomber working for the government of Iran crashed into the US embassy in Kuwait. Additional attacks on the French embassy, apartments of Raytheon Corporation employees, the control tower of the airport, and an oil refinery. Total of 5 people killed and 80 injured.

You do realize that embassies are internationally recognized as being extensions of the country that the embassy belongs to? Meaning: an attack on a US embassy is an attack on the US itself. But maybe we should just let it slide.

11/20/84 - Truck bomb exploded outside the Aukar, Lebanon annex of the US embassy in Beirut. 24 people killed.

Those 24 people must be the imperialists seeking to destroy their homeland. Again...feel free to point out where the US is stepping on peoples toes here.

12/3/84 - Kuwait Airways Flight 221 from Kuwait to Pakistan was hijacked and diverted to Tehran. Hijackers demanded the release of 17 suspects arrested by Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. When the demand was refused, the hijackers killed 2 passengers who were US government employees. Iranian troops entered the plane, arrested the hijackers, released the passengers. Iran later released the hijackers instead of putting them on trial.

OK, let me get this straight, they bomb our embassy, we arrest some of the people responsible and so that is being imperialistic and deserving of the lives of 2 government employees on a plane?

6/14/85 - TWA Flight 847 from Athens to Rome was hijacked and diverted to Beirut, Lebanon. Hijackers demanded the release of 500 Shiites imprisoned by Israel and the the 17 suspects imprisoned in Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. Hijackers killed U.S. Navy Diver Robert Stethem and threw his body out onto the airport tarmac.

Back to those 17 people responsible for the attack of the embassy in Kuwait (aka US soil). I suppose your justification will be that at least they murdered a sailor and not a civilian.

12/17/85 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed the airports in Vienna and Rome, killing 20 people.

I guess the Italians were being imperialistic too?

4/5/86 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed a disco in West Berlin, killing a Turkish woman and a US soldier, and injuring hundreds.

For the record the US soldier killed in that bombing was there because after WWII, it was decided that Germany needed a babysitter (having started both World Wars). This decision was not made soley by the US.

4/15/86 - In retaliation for the disco bombing of 4/5/86, the US, under orders from President Reagan, bombed Benghazi and Tripoli in Libya. (After the bombing, Libyan militants associated with Abu Nidal retaliated by killing three US citizens employed by the University of Beirut.)

Self defense warrants additional terrorist attacks?

12/23/88 - A bomb onboard 757 airliner Pan Am Flight 103 exploded over Lockerbie, Scotland, killing 270 (259 aboard and 11 town residents).

I remember hearing something about this in the news fairly recently...who was responsible for that? Oh yeah - Libya!

8/2/90 - Iraq invaded Kuwait, a member state of the United Nations.

Make a note "KUWAIT IS A MEMBER OF THE UN!!"

1990-1991 - The Persian Gulf War: United Nations coalition forced Iraq to withdraw from occupied Kuwait.

The UN coalition forced Iraq out...not the US. Maybe you need to read the UN charter if you think the US was being imperialistic by helping to repel the invasion of a sovereign nation.

1991 - Saudia Arabia rejected Osama bin Laden's offer of his help in fighting Iraq, and then permitted US troops to use its military bases. Bin Laden was said to have felt insulted and became more determined to declare both the US and Saudi Arabia to be enemies.

Saudi Arabia is the one that hurt bin Laden's feelings, not the US. Saudi Arabia was gracious enough to allow the US to keep troops in their county, we did not invade them.

2/26/93 Car bomb exploded at 5:12 PM on the second level of parking basement in the World Trade Center, killed 7 and injured hundreds.

We pretty much let this one slide...regrettably.

3/20/95 Japanese terrorists released Sarin nerve gas into Tokyo subway trains. 12 killed and approximately 5,000 to 6,000 injured.

Sarin nerve gas might not be the worst way to die but its probably in the top 5.

11/13/95 - Truck bombing of US National Guard training center in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. 7 people killed, including 5 US military personnel.

Again, Saudi Arabia allowed us to keep troops there in case Iraq decided to invade Kuwait AGAIN!

6/25/96 - Truck bombing of Khobar Towers in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, a residence of US military personnel. 19 US military personnel were killed.

Has the dead horse been beat enough?

8/23/96 - Date on bin Laden's written "declaration" of attack against the US. The document was written and published about two months after the bombing in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. Demands included the removal of US troops from Saudi Arabia, and the overthrow of the government of Saudi Arabia.

It wasn't Saudi Arabia that had a problem with our troops there but bin Laden made it there problem. Maybe we should just do what he says...I'm sure that will work our real well for us.

9/11/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the city of Jalalabad, Afghanistan.

Note the date.

9/27/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the capital city of Kabul, Afghanistan.

Maybe Afghanistan was being too imperialistic?

8/7/98 - A car bomb exploded outside US embassy in Nairobi, Kenya. A few hours later, explosion at US embassy in Dar es Salaam, capital of tanzania. In both attacks, 224 people were killed and almost 5,000 were injured.

The embassy "dead horse" has not been properly flogged and so I'll reiterate. Embassies are used by every country in the world to propagate peace between countries.

9/11/98 The United Nations announced that it had confirmed an accusation by Amnesty International that the Taliban government of Afghanistan had massacred thousands of people near Mazar-i-Sharif in 8/98. The killings were committed because the victims were of the Hazara ethnic group and of the Shiite denomination of Islam.

Akin to Protestant Christians slaughtering thousands of Baptists simply because they have a different opinion about the same religion.

10/12/00 - Suicide bombing of the U.S.S. Cole. The ship was refueling at the port city of Aden in Yemen when attacked. A boat filled with explosives got near the Cole and exploded, producing a large hole in the ship. 17 US sailors were killed and 37 were injured.

An attack on a military ship is considered to be a declaration of war in most countries - including this one.

8/3/01 - Taliban government of Afghanistan arrested 24 international humanitarian aid workers in Kabul. Incarcerated were 16 citizens of Afghanistan, 4 from Germany, 2 from the US and 2 from Australia. Several were accused of trying to propagate Christianity, punishable by long prison terms or execution.

Accused to trying to propagate Christianity...wow. Before you accuse the Christians of being imperialists, a major tenet of the religion is to spread the Gospel to all nations. They are just trying to obey their God in the best way they know how.

And then there was 9/11/2001. We sat on our hands and did nothing (or very little) for years and years and years and years, and 5,000 people paid the price for our passivity. I didn't vote for Bush in either one of the elections but at least he did something instead of sticking his head in the sand and hoping the terrorists would find someone else to pick on.

Grrr. why won't it let me edit this darn thing.

[Boiler 45,399]

The latest one is Nigerian

[Ellie-and-David 38]

Fast going off topic.

Again.

*OP* - The relevant advice given to you has been good. This journey is long and stressful. You need to be prepared for that if you do file for the K1. As others have mentioned (before the cut and paste history lesson) your partner comes from a very scrutinized part of the world. Your journey will be longer than others.

It's time to utilize visajourney, do some reading and get an idea of what you face if you do embark on this journey.

[Sc0tt28 26]

The latest one is Nigerian

Oh well then everything is fine and we shouldn't worry about it.

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Please do not go off-topic in the Immigration Forums. If you wish to discuss terrorism and the responses to it, then please start a separate thread in Off Topic. Thank you.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

And then there was 9/11/2001. We sat on our hands and did nothing (or very little) for years and years and years and years, and 5,000 people paid the price for our passivity. I didn't vote for Bush in either one of the elections but at least he did something instead of sticking his head in the sand and hoping the terrorists would find someone else to pick on.

Thanks for the history lesson. It's fairly accurate, except that we perhaps should state that the problem of terrorism is based on two main issues:

1) The presence of Israel in-midst what is a predominantly Muslem region of planet Earth

2) The invasion of foreign countries such as Afghanistan by Imperialist nations, first Russia, now the USA.

Regarding "Bush did something" let me tell you this: right after 9/11 he allowed his Bin Laden buddies from Saudia Arabia to leave the US in a private jet, despite the air traffic being shut down. He then used trillions of taxpayers' money to attack Iraq, a nation that had nothing, zero, nada, to do with the terrorist attacks.

Bush did a great job in giving the Muslem world more ammunition to hate the US.

Scott, imagine for a second there were Iranian drones flying over Miami, just to take photos and to take out some bad guys who live in the US, maybe with a small bomb here and there. That's exactly what we, the US, are doing in foreign countries and I'm not surprised that they don't like that a bit.

Edited January 8, 2010 by Just Bob

[sachinky 465]

There's no chance in hell he's going to be approved for a tourist visa. Don't waste your time in getting your hopes high.

Meet in a third country if meeting in Pakistan is too dangerous for you. I hear that USCs are also not being granted tourist visas to Pakistan.

And yes, a U.K refusal does NOT look good.

Edited January 9, 2010 by sachinky

[BRB 6]

You need to think about this carefully. If he is giving you a hard time and getting depressed right from the start you have a very difficult and long road ahead of you and I question his motives. If he is pushing you to get him entry in the US that should be a warning sign. Questioning the relationship? If this is a true relationship then the fact the process is difficult should have no bearing on his decision. Make sure he is not in love with getting a visa more than he is in love with you. If he has been trying for a long time to immigrate somewhere you need to really find out what his motives are. If he is not on the up and up he is talking to other women too so see if you can find out.

[Jennifer1 0]

Thanks to those who have offered advice. I appreciate you taking the time to try to help out.

To BRB - my fiance has never wanted to immigrate here. I know that from other people's perspectives, marriage fraud can always be a possible motive, but I would bet my life and the life of every member of my family that it isn't his motive whatsoever. Thanks for trying to help, though.

To the person who said something about how I can't be this naive - Well, I visited a very successful attorney a month ago and he didn't raise any concerns about applying for a visiting visa, so I guess I assumed we have as good a chance for success as people from other countries.

I am really depressed now. I have depression anyway and this visa situation is killing me inside. I think my fiance and I may meet in a third country to visit and get married, if possible. And then apply for a K3. I have no idea if we'll do it - that's just what I'm thinking right now.

I'm very angry and upset by this stupid visa/immigration #######. If this forum weren't public, I'd go into detail.

Til we meet again.

[merijan 0]

Try Dubai. Pakistanis can get visa more easily I think. If you can meet there maybe that would help. Its very hard to get visitor visa. My hubby was in Pakistan. He got a UK visa and then he was there for several years. I met him there and then filed for fiance visa. He tried for tourist visa from Uk to USA .. it was denied. So I went to UK then we filed for fiance visa after I got back.

[merijan 0]

What's stupid and non-sensical is to not defend yourself when you are attacked. The "beginning" of modern terrorism started with the 1972 Olympics in Berlin and went down hill from there until September 11, 2001 when we finally said "enough is enough". Let me give you a little history lesson:

1972 - Terrorists attacked the Olympics in Munich, Germany, killed 2 athletes, and took hostages and a helicopter. Police snipers shot the terrorists but didn't kill them. One of the terrorists threw a hand grenade into the helicopter and killed all the hostages.

I don't know what could be more "peaceful" (hence the doves) than the Olympics but according to your logic we should have just let them go.

11/4/79 - 80 Iranian students invaded the US embassy in Tehran, Iran and took 52 US citizens hostage. The abductors demanded that the US extradite the overthrown Shah of Iran, Reza Pahlavi, who was in the US for medical treatment, so that they could execute him. US refused demand. The hostages were held until 1/20/81 (444 days).

How dare we "invade" their country by putting an embassy there!

4/8/80 - On order of President Carter, US ended diplomatic relations with Iran due to failure of negotiations to persuade Iran to release the hostages taken 11/4/79.

Like with the Olympic attack maybe we should just lie on our backs and hope they don't do it again.

4/80 - 6 Islamic terrorists seized the Iranian embassy in London. They announced that they would kill a hostage every half hour, and killed two.

Maybe the Brits should have kicked the Iranians out so that they could build a hospital or a school where the embassy was?

3/82 - Carlos the Jackal attacked public buildings and transportation facilities in France, in retaliation for the 2/82 arrest of his girlfriend in Paris when she was found with explosives in her car.

Maybe she was just going to spruce up her apartment with those explosives. Feel free to point out where the US has become imperialistic.

4/18/83 - Hizballah suicide bomber with the support of Iran and Libya crashed a pickup truck full of explosives into the US embassy in Beirut, Lebanon. 63 people killed, of whom 17 were US citizens.

Gosh we just keep "invading" these poor, misunderstood people by putting embassies in their county. How dare we!

12/12/83 - Shiite suicide truck bomber working for the government of Iran crashed into the US embassy in Kuwait. Additional attacks on the French embassy, apartments of Raytheon Corporation employees, the control tower of the airport, and an oil refinery. Total of 5 people killed and 80 injured.

You do realize that embassies are internationally recognized as being extensions of the country that the embassy belongs to? Meaning: an attack on a US embassy is an attack on the US itself. But maybe we should just let it slide.

11/20/84 - Truck bomb exploded outside the Aukar, Lebanon annex of the US embassy in Beirut. 24 people killed.

Those 24 people must be the imperialists seeking to destroy their homeland. Again...feel free to point out where the US is stepping on peoples toes here.

12/3/84 - Kuwait Airways Flight 221 from Kuwait to Pakistan was hijacked and diverted to Tehran. Hijackers demanded the release of 17 suspects arrested by Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. When the demand was refused, the hijackers killed 2 passengers who were US government employees. Iranian troops entered the plane, arrested the hijackers, released the passengers. Iran later released the hijackers instead of putting them on trial.

OK, let me get this straight, they bomb our embassy, we arrest some of the people responsible and so that is being imperialistic and deserving of the lives of 2 government employees on a plane?

6/14/85 - TWA Flight 847 from Athens to Rome was hijacked and diverted to Beirut, Lebanon. Hijackers demanded the release of 500 Shiites imprisoned by Israel and the the 17 suspects imprisoned in Kuwait for the 12/12/83 bombing of the US embassy in Kuwait. Hijackers killed U.S. Navy Diver Robert Stethem and threw his body out onto the airport tarmac.

Back to those 17 people responsible for the attack of the embassy in Kuwait (aka US soil). I suppose your justification will be that at least they murdered a sailor and not a civilian.

12/17/85 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed the airports in Vienna and Rome, killing 20 people.

I guess the Italians were being imperialistic too?

4/5/86 - Terrorists working for the government of Libya bombed a disco in West Berlin, killing a Turkish woman and a US soldier, and injuring hundreds.

For the record the US soldier killed in that bombing was there because after WWII, it was decided that Germany needed a babysitter (having started both World Wars). This decision was not made soley by the US.

4/15/86 - In retaliation for the disco bombing of 4/5/86, the US, under orders from President Reagan, bombed Benghazi and Tripoli in Libya. (After the bombing, Libyan militants associated with Abu Nidal retaliated by killing three US citizens employed by the University of Beirut.)

Self defense warrants additional terrorist attacks?

12/23/88 - A bomb onboard 757 airliner Pan Am Flight 103 exploded over Lockerbie, Scotland, killing 270 (259 aboard and 11 town residents).

I remember hearing something about this in the news fairly recently...who was responsible for that? Oh yeah - Libya!

8/2/90 - Iraq invaded Kuwait, a member state of the United Nations.

Make a note "KUWAIT IS A MEMBER OF THE UN!!"

1990-1991 - The Persian Gulf War: United Nations coalition forced Iraq to withdraw from occupied Kuwait.

The UN coalition forced Iraq out...not the US. Maybe you need to read the UN charter if you think the US was being imperialistic by helping to repel the invasion of a sovereign nation.

1991 - Saudia Arabia rejected Osama bin Laden's offer of his help in fighting Iraq, and then permitted US troops to use its military bases. Bin Laden was said to have felt insulted and became more determined to declare both the US and Saudi Arabia to be enemies.

Saudi Arabia is the one that hurt bin Laden's feelings, not the US. Saudi Arabia was gracious enough to allow the US to keep troops in their county, we did not invade them.

2/26/93 Car bomb exploded at 5:12 PM on the second level of parking basement in the World Trade Center, killed 7 and injured hundreds.

We pretty much let this one slide...regrettably.

3/20/95 Japanese terrorists released Sarin nerve gas into Tokyo subway trains. 12 killed and approximately 5,000 to 6,000 injured.

Sarin nerve gas might not be the worst way to die but its probably in the top 5.

11/13/95 - Truck bombing of US National Guard training center in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. 7 people killed, including 5 US military personnel.

Again, Saudi Arabia allowed us to keep troops there in case Iraq decided to invade Kuwait AGAIN!

6/25/96 - Truck bombing of Khobar Towers in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, a residence of US military personnel. 19 US military personnel were killed.

Has the dead horse been beat enough?

8/23/96 - Date on bin Laden's written "declaration" of attack against the US. The document was written and published about two months after the bombing in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia. Demands included the removal of US troops from Saudi Arabia, and the overthrow of the government of Saudi Arabia.

It wasn't Saudi Arabia that had a problem with our troops there but bin Laden made it there problem. Maybe we should just do what he says...I'm sure that will work our real well for us.

9/11/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the city of Jalalabad, Afghanistan.

Note the date.

9/27/96 - The Taliban militia conquered the capital city of Kabul, Afghanistan.

Maybe Afghanistan was being too imperialistic?

8/7/98 - A car bomb exploded outside US embassy in Nairobi, Kenya. A few hours later, explosion at US embassy in Dar es Salaam, capital of tanzania. In both attacks, 224 people were killed and almost 5,000 were injured.

The embassy "dead horse" has not been properly flogged and so I'll reiterate. Embassies are used by every country in the world to propagate peace between countries.

9/11/98 The United Nations announced that it had confirmed an accusation by Amnesty International that the Taliban government of Afghanistan had massacred thousands of people near Mazar-i-Sharif in 8/98. The killings were committed because the victims were of the Hazara ethnic group and of the Shiite denomination of Islam.

Akin to Protestant Christians slaughtering thousands of Baptists simply because they have a different opinion about the same religion.

10/12/00 - Suicide bombing of the U.S.S. Cole. The ship was refueling at the port city of Aden in Yemen when attacked. A boat filled with explosives got near the Cole and exploded, producing a large hole in the ship. 17 US sailors were killed and 37 were injured.

An attack on a military ship is considered to be a declaration of war in most countries - including this one.

8/3/01 - Taliban government of Afghanistan arrested 24 international humanitarian aid workers in Kabul. Incarcerated were 16 citizens of Afghanistan, 4 from Germany, 2 from the US and 2 from Australia. Several were accused of trying to propagate Christianity, punishable by long prison terms or execution.

Accused to trying to propagate Christianity...wow. Before you accuse the Christians of being imperialists, a major tenet of the religion is to spread the Gospel to all nations. They are just trying to obey their God in the best way they know how.

And then there was 9/11/2001. We sat on our hands and did nothing (or very little) for years and years and years and years, and 5,000 people paid the price for our passivity. I didn't vote for Bush in either one of the elections but at least he did something instead of sticking his head in the sand and hoping the terrorists would find someone else to pick on.

Yes he did do something alright, lie about almost everything, go to a fake war with Iraq, and ohhh by the way where is Osama Bin Laden anyway? wasnt that the reason for Afghanistan???? hmmmmmmm

[Sc0tt28 26]

Thanks for the history lesson. It's fairly accurate, except that we perhaps should state that the problem of terrorism is based on two main issues:

1) The presence of Israel in-midst what is a predominantly Muslem region of planet Earth

2) The invasion of foreign countries such as Afghanistan by Imperialist nations, first Russia, now the USA.

Regarding "Bush did something" let me tell you this: right after 9/11 he allowed his Bin Laden buddies from Saudia Arabia to leave the US in a private jet, despite the air traffic being shut down. He then used trillions of taxpayers' money to attack Iraq, a nation that had nothing, zero, nada, to do with the terrorist attacks.

Bush did a great job in giving the Muslem world more ammunition to hate the US.

Scott, imagine for a second there were Iranian drones flying over Miami, just to take photos and to take out some bad guys who live in the US, maybe with a small bomb here and there. That's exactly what we, the US, are doing in foreign countries and I'm not surprised that they don't like that a bit.

This is exactly my point - the bleeding hearts keep getting the chronology out of order.

1st - We were attacked...repeatedly....THEN....that means "after"

2nd - We "invaded"

[Jennifer1 0]

Yeah we met in Dubai in July actually. We talked earlier and decided that we'll meet again in a couple months. It's been 6 already since we've seen each other and we're both going crazy from it.

So he got the fiance visa and you were married in the US and did he stay and apply for immigration, or did he go back to UK? Well, I suppose I can look at your profile to get an idea of that. I will do that now...

Try Dubai. Pakistanis can get visa more easily I think. If you can meet there maybe that would help. Its very hard to get visitor visa. My hubby was in Pakistan. He got a UK visa and then he was there for several years. I met him there and then filed for fiance visa. He tried for tourist visa from Uk to USA .. it was denied. So I went to UK then we filed for fiance visa after I got back.

[toma1 10]

Well, I visited a very successful attorney a month ago and he didn't raise any concerns about applying for a visiting visa, so I guess I assumed we have as good a chance for success as people from other countries.

I'm sorry to tell you that an attorney will take ANY case, no matter how unlikely it will be to win, because he gets paid either way. In fact, in difficult cases, he gets paid more.

Ask him if he will take your case on contingency... e.g, he only gets paid if a visa is issued...