4 Year Old Boy killed New Year's Eve by Rifle Shot in Air

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

Then perhaps you and Natty need to take issue with him, because it has nothing to do with what Kathryn was getting at.

The kid was shot by some stupid dickhead who shot his gun into the air. Who honestly gives a flying ** whether the bullet came from an AK-47, a black powder musket, or Zeus's #######!?

it's not about what kathryn was "getting at" - it was about the media hysteria in the op about the speculation it's an ak-47!

i'm surprised you didn't pick up on that. natty was trying to lead you down the path to it.

I'm still waiting for the answer to the question about why the "AK47 angle" is important.

Edited January 4, 2010 by charles!

[nowhereman 1]

For freedom of expression?

Firing a weapon into the air is hardly "freedom of expression" & what happened to the 4 year old boy is tragic and at the very least would constitute criminally negligent homicide if the person who shot the round into the air is ever caught (highely unlikely but possible). With that being said there are always knee-jerk reactions after a senseless tragedy & banning firearms because of one reckless individual is a knee-jerk reaction.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If you can't understand how news stories are written, then you will see "hysteria" under every rock.

I'm still waiting for the answer to the question about why the "AK47 angle" is important.

Indeed. Why should I care what gun the bullet came out of?

Edited January 4, 2010 by Gene Hunt

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

If you can't understand how news stories are written, then you will see "hysteria" under every rock.

it's not surprising you'd downplay that.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

What's being downplayed?

There could be any number of reasons why the information about the ballistics isn't available - perhaps the investigating officer couldn't be reached for comment, perhaps the story was written last minute.

Again - I really don't see why the experts "opinion" makes any difference whatsoever to the facts of the story.

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

What's being downplayed?

There could be any number of reasons why the information about the ballistics isn't available - perhaps the investigating officer couldn't be reached for comment, perhaps the story was written last minute.

Again - I really don't see why the experts "opinion" makes any difference whatsoever to the facts of the story.

so now expert opinions don't matter to you? nice!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Feel free to rejoin the conversation when you're prepared to take it seriously.

While this article does reference a speculative opinion, there is nothing about it that is hysterical. There is no loaded language, there are no calls to "ban" guns as a result. All it does is reference the death of one boy and a list of similar incidents that suggest that this isn't uncommon over the new year.

Edited January 4, 2010 by Gene Hunt

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

Feel free to rejoin the conversation when you're prepared to take it seriously.

you be sure to let me know when you'll take an expert's opinion as valid

[nowhereman 1]

Although its true that an AK-47 fires a 7.62 round and many other firearms also fire a 7.62 round I fail to see why half of the conversations in this thread revolve around this particular issue. A 4 yr old boy is dead due to the recklessness and (IMO) criminal negligence of the person who fired the round into the air... whether or not the round came from an AK-47 is probably of no significance to the boy's family (he's dead either way).

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

you be sure to let me know when you'll take an expert's opinion as valid

Now why would you want to bait me, Mr Moderator?

Although its true that an AK-47 fires a 7.62 round and many other firearms also fire a 7.62 round I fail to see why half of the conversations in this thread revolve around this particular issue. A 4 yr old boy is dead due to the recklessness and (IMO) criminal negligence of the person who fired the round into the air... whether or not the round came from an AK-47 is probably of no significance to the boy's family (he's dead either way).

Thanks - that's what I'm trying to figure out.

Apparently there's "media hysteria" in here somewhere

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

Now why would you want to bait me, Mr Moderator?

if i was baiting you, you'd be in the live well already.

do remember that you were the one ruling out an expert's opinion, not i

[justashooter 430]

1.) My personal opinon: People with the 'stupid ' gene shouldn't be allowed access to firearms.

2.) The 4-year-old boy shot and killed while in church, apparently by New Year’s Eve revelers, most likely was

hit by a bullet fired from a rifle, said a firearms expert Saturday.

3.) Four-year-old Marquel Peters was killed by a stray bullet during a New Year’s Eve service at his DeKalb church.

4.) “I would suspect this was a rifle. An AK-47. That’s the most prolific [weapon found] downtown,” said Kelly

Fite, who was the top ballistics expert with the Georgia Bureau of Investigation’s state Crime Lab for almost four decades.

5.) “It’s not impossible at all” for a bullet to travel some distance then pass through a roof and kill someone

inside a building, Fite said.

6.) The shooter could have been as much as two to three miles away, Fite told The Atlanta

Journal-Constitution. But most likely, the shooter was about a half mile away and the gun was tilted at about 30 or 40 degrees, not straight up, he said.

7.) “This bullet that hit this kid was not shot straight up because it would have come down near the shooter,”

Fite said.

1.) people with stupid genes should not be described as "top ballistics experts".

2.) sorry to hear about the loss of a munchkin.

3.) there should be a "home for stray bullets, where bullets could receive the tender love and care they deserve, and be valued as individuals, regardless of their caliber.

4.) i would suspect that kelly is an idiot. there are WAY more revolvers and hunting rifles and shotguns anywhere than AK 47 type rifles. if the bullet that killed the child is examined by a competent forensic technician it can be determined by various measurements whether it was fired from an AK 47 type rifle or not. the combination of bore diameter and twist rate are unique in the application.

5.) it is impossible for a bullet fired upwards at more than 60 degrees angle to penetrate standard roofing upon return to earth. a bullet fired at more than 60 degrees from surface will expend all of it's energy in the air and return to earth with onlly it's terminal dynamic velocity. TDV is what the shape and mass combination will allow it to acheive in free fall from a dead stop. experiments dating back to the 30's indicate that TDV with 30 cal 172 grain bullets are not enough to break skin, but will leave a bruise. 50 cal 750 grain bullets at TDV will knock you down as they have 5X the energy of a 30 cal in free fall.

6.) the shooter was not more than 1/2 mile away and the rifle was fired at less than 30 degree angle if the bullet penetrated the roof and injured someone, and the roof wasn't much, in any case.

7.) experiments done in the 30's indicate that it is impossible to shoot a bullet straight up and have it come down right next to you. wind effect at the top of trajectory will result in a return to earth point within a mile if the bullet is fired exactly perpendicular to the earth, but nothing more is certain. (Gen Julian S Hatcher, Gen Of US Army Ordnance)

[NickD 203]

Some holes in this story, least from NBC news, trying to find a reliable source. God of Prophecy Church, Decatur, IL is the church where the boy was killed, but investigated by the DeKalb police department some 165 miles away.

Probably just me, can't seem to find a church in Decatur named God of Prophecy as curious to the thickness of their roof, a bullet loses a lot of it's velocity on a download arc. Then to penetrate that roof and a skull as well since it was reported this boy was hit in the head. Perhaps someone with more time can find more detailed information on this incident. But certainly yet another topic where people like to argue without knowing any thing about something.

Lot's of sources on this story, but trying to find one that is halfway reliable.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

if i was baiting you, you'd be in the live well already.

do remember that you were the one ruling out an expert's opinion, not i

Not you? You're the one that took issue with the AK-47 claim. I said nothing about the experts opinion one way or the other - other than that it is his opinion.

Yes Charles, you're definitely trying to bait me. Tell you what - you can stop playing silly buggers with my words and have a sensible exchange of ideas. Alternatively, you can continue along this vein and I'll report it so that you can thrash it out in the "Mod" forum.

What would you like to do?

[nowhereman 1]

Some holes in this story, least from NBC news, trying to find a reliable source. God of Prophecy Church, Decatur, IL is the church where the boy was killed, but investigated by the DeKalb police department some 165 miles away.

Probably just me, can't seem to find a church in Decatur named God of Prophecy as curious to the thickness of their roof, a bullet loses a lot of it's velocity on a download arc. Then to penetrate that roof and a skull as well since it was reported this boy was hit in the head. Perhaps someone with more time can find more detailed information on this incident. But certainly yet another topic where people like to argue without knowing any thing about something.

Lot's of sources on this story, but trying to find one that is halfway reliable.

There is a Decatur, GA that is very close to Atlanta (I believe its in Fulton County but I could be wrong).