Danish police stop attack on cartoonist

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

All we ask of you is to condemn the act, and all similar fatwa's issued in the name of Islam, Islamic Extremism, and all who follow that particular path of Islam. All too often Muslim's fail to do so.

You know, all too often the people who call for that kind of condemnation are unaware that muslims do indeed condemn these things or otherwise discount them.

How's about we merely be responsible for our own words.

[sandinista! 1,816]

All we ask of you is to condemn the act, and all similar fatwa's issued in the name of Islam, Islamic Extremism, and all who follow that particular path of Islam. All too often Muslim's fail to do so.

why the f-ing hell should she have to do any of that? it's a matter of course that she would find such things repugnant, given that she is muslim, just as it is a matter of course that 99.9% of all muslims would find those things repugnant.

i think i'm going to start randomly asking all non-rapist men to condemn rape all of the time, given that 78 rapes occur every hour, and the overwhelming majority of those offenders are men. too many men fail to condemn this act that happens over 1800 times a day. their failure to speak out more on it, and condemn it at least 1800 times a day must mean they condone it. anything less than that certainly equals complicity in the act of rape. since they're male, and the overwhelming majority of offenders are male, it must be something to do with their inherent maleness that makes them responsible for the act of rape occurring 1.3 times every minute.

yeah, that makes sense.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

i think i'm going to start randomly asking all non-rapist men to condemn rape all of the time

I will happily condemn all acts of rape committed by men.

I will also happily condemn all acts of theft committed by members of my ethnic group targeting their customers at the local 7-11.

I will also happily condemn all acts of corruption by my fellow garden staters.

And before I forget, I also condemn ripping you suckers off in the name of Y2K remediation

[ready4ONE 5,400]

why the f-ing hell should she have to do any of that? it's a matter of course that she would find such things repugnant, given that she is muslim, just as it is a matter of course that 99.9% of all muslims would find those things repugnant.

i think i'm going to start randomly asking all non-rapist men to condemn rape all of the time, given that 78 rapes occur every hour, and the overwhelming majority of those offenders are men. too many men fail to condemn this act that happens over 1800 times a day. their failure to speak out more on it, and condemn it at least 1800 times a day must mean they condone it. anything less than that certainly equals complicity in the act of rape. since they're male, and the overwhelming majority of offenders are male, it must be something to do with their inherent maleness that makes them responsible for the act of rape occurring 1.3 times every minute.

yeah, that makes sense.

I don't think that moderate Muslims do anything even approaching appropriately condemning these types of Radical Muslim activities. Your reaction is over reaction. Nor do moderate Muslims do enough to help appropriate authorities deter the monsters in their midst from causing so much public relations harm to their religion.

Having said that, I would sort of agree with Mr. Hunt, everyone is responsible for their own words, but my statement above stands.

I would consistently speak out against rape, and am consistently appalled by it. I was not aware that rapists were an organized religion with significant numbers of followers who claimed the act was appropriate due to their beliefs though, that is a new one, or your analogy is off. There appear to be far more than .01 percent of Muslims who believe active Jihad and terrorism are the way to show their faith though.

Edited January 3, 2010 by ready4ONE

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

But that isn't really fair though is it.

A person isn't under any obligation to condemn or issue any kind of public or other statement just because someone who shares their religion (at least on paper) does something insane or crazy.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

But that isn't really fair though is it.

A person isn't under any obligation to condemn or issue any kind of public or other statement just because someone who shares their religion (at least on paper) does something insane or crazy.

No, there isn't any obligation.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

No, there isn't any obligation.

Of course there isn't an obligation to condemn, but is the silence not deafening?

Edited January 3, 2010 by ready4ONE

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Is it?

You say that there's silence - but are you really sure you have your ears open?

What exactly are you expecting to satisfy this strange sense that somehow something is missing?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Of course there isn't an obligation to condemn, but is the silence not deafening?

I wouldn't call it silence.

It's more like a very low-key, non-obtrusive hum of disapproval.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Inherent in the constant demand that Muslims stand ready to condemn every mal act of other Muslims are several erroneous assumptions:

1. That terrorism is about Islam - it's not;

2. That the acts of any Muslim are the burden of all - they aren't;

3. That our every day lives should revolve around ferreting out terrorists - sorry, we have real lives;

4. That we know who the terrorists are coz we're tripping over them all the time - we're not;

5. That anti-Muslim opportunists touted as experts on Islam and terrorists actually know what they are talking about - they don't;

6. That terrorists speak for all Muslims - they don't;

7. That non-Muslims have more to lose in this conflict than Muslims do - they don't;

8. That all Muslims owe you a coherent and detailed explanation of why some Muslims see violence as sanctioned by God because we must know why - we don't;

9. That our loyalty is to Osama bin Laden until proven otherwise - not true;

10. That we owe you anything just because we're Muslim and you're not - we don't.

As far as I'm concerned, ignorant hatred by non-Muslims toward Muslims and Islam is the other side of the same coin as ignorant hatred by Muslims toward non-Muslims. That's not a currency I want to exchange, but some of you do, and expect to guilt me into comforting your prejudices. No thanks, as long as you believe you have authority to demand I answer to you, you see your humanity as superior to mine, and require me to address you from that vantage point. That is a losing proposition.

Edited January 3, 2010 by Sofiyya

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Inherent in the constant demand that Muslims stand ready to condemn every mal act of other Muslims are several erroneous assumptions:

1. That terrorism is about Islam - it's not;

"Think not of those, who are slain in the way of Allah, as dead."

(Quoted by Osama bin Laden in his 'letter to America' regarding the 11 September 2001 attacks.) 3:169-171 Quaran verse

"Sanction is given unto those who fight because they have been wronged."

Quoted by Osama bin Laden in his 'letter to America' as a justification for the 11 September 2001 attacks. 4:39 Quaran verse

Those fighting this Jihad clearly believe it is all about Islam, and there appear to be more than a few Imam's, religious leaders and teachers who agree.

2. That the acts of any Muslim are the burden of all - they aren't;

3. That our every day lives should revolve around ferreting out terrorists - sorry, we have real lives;

If you become aware of a terrorist plot, you have a duty beyond your religion to report it and hopefully prevent tragedy, do you not????

4. That we know who the terrorists are coz we're tripping over them all the time - we're not;

And yet when the FBI contacts a New York Imam, he immediately seeks to warn a man he barely knows [allegedly] that the authorities are wise to his bombing plot, potentially [but fortunately not] allowing him to escape capture and/or carry out his plans to kill innocent men, women and children with home made bombs.

Correct me if I am wrong, but does not one need to be deeply schooled in the Quaran and Islamic beliefs to become an Imam? And if so, how were the actions of this Imam peaceful?

5. That anti-Muslim opportunists touted as experts on Islam and terrorists actually know what they are talking about - they don't;

My assertion as that these terrorist acts themselves, and the failure of the 'peaceful' factions of the faith to condemn them is an issue for which I am seeking clarification, no more, no less. And further that these acts, not my opinion of them, lead to the impression that Islam is not a religion of peace.

I don't doubt that there are non-violent Muslim believers. I think there is significant public disagreement within the Muslim population as to whether or not Islam is a religion of peace.

6. That terrorists speak for all Muslims - they don't;

7. That non-Muslims have more to lose in this conflict than Muslims do - they don't;

8. That all Muslims owe you a coherent and detailed explanation of why some Muslims see violence as sanctioned by God because we must know why - we don't;

Perhaps some Muslims believe:

Those who deny the messengers deserve doom. 38:14 Quaran verse, but I am seeking a similar verse regarding tolerance, can you quote me one?

9. That our loyalty is to Osama bin Laden until proven otherwise - not true;

Didn't ever claim that it was true, not at all my point with regards to speaking out against terrorist acts.

10. That we owe you anything just because we're Muslim and you're not - we don't.

As far as I'm concerned, ignorant hatred by non-Muslims toward Muslims and Islam is the other side of the same coin as ignorant hatred by Muslims toward non-Muslims. That's not a currency I want to exchange, but some of you do, and expect to guilt me into comforting your prejudices. No thanks, as long as you believe you have authority to demand I answer to you, you see your humanity as superior to mine, and require me to address you from that vantage point. That is a losing proposition.

Be stern with disbelievers. They are going to Hell anyway. 66:9 Quaran verse

But hey!

Those who disbelieve will abide in the fire of hell. They are the worst of created beings. 98:6 Quaran verse

Right?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Last night, CNN rebroadcast Christiane Amanpour's special report, The War Within. It originally aired in 2007. I'd recommend everyone here to watch it. There are a lot layers to the issues, but one in particular are these adolescent Muslim boys in Britain who are very susceptible to radicalization. One person interviewed is a British gentlemen who is Muslim and has organized outreach events to get the adolescents to interact with the local law enforcement like a tournament of billiards. It's a really well done piece and very informative.

link

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think if you're going to start posting selected verses of the Koran without any kind of context you really better know your stuff, because you're asking to have your ####### handed to you.

There's also a question in my mind as to why you are doing it if you're trying to maintain the opinion that you don't believe that all muslims are terrorists or terrorist sympathisers.

[Jenn! 918]

There's also a question in my mind as to why you are doing it if you're trying to maintain the opinion that you don't believe that all muslims are terrorists or terrorist sympathisers.

The non-violent Muslims apparently aren't doing it right.

I think if you're going to start posting selected verses of the Koran without any kind of context you really better know your stuff, because you're asking to have your ####### handed to you.

No doubt. Copying verses selected by right-wing blogs is not the way to go.

[ready4ONE 5,400]

The non-violent Muslims apparently aren't doing it right.

No doubt. Copying verses selected by right-wing blogs is not the way to go.

It is not merely the quotes, and I don't hang out on right wing blogs, but yes, in my opinion non-violent Muslims are not doing it right. I am attacked for pointed out the clear public relations nightmare terrorist Muslims are causing your faith, but my point goes without response.

An Imam in New York is approached by the FBI about a person who recently came to pray at his mosque whom they suspect is trying to build bombs and set them off amongst the general public in New York. An Imam is a leader, a teacher, an important figure in the Islamic faith. What does he do? Tries to warn his fellow Muslim the jig is up!

Please explain how this is ok? Please explain how this does not show a rift in the faith between sticking together as fellow believers in the faith and doing the right thing to protect innocent lives?

I don't claim to be any sort of expert on Islam, but quotes are quotes, and clearly some believe they are a license for terror.