Overseas Visits

[chaishai 1]

I need some opinions please...

I try to be a good wife and respect my husband to the fullest, just as he respects me. However, we are having a horrible disagreement as of late. We have two kids together, the oldest has been to his home country (when a baby) and met all his family...however I was with the child at the time when we went for a visit. But now we have another child, 7 months old, and he wants this child to go visit his family as well. Without me. I've said to him not without me because the child is still a baby, needs mommy, I will miss all the firsts! He says I am being selfish and his family deserves to see the child and spend time with it. I agree they do...but only if I come too, and money right now is very tight, there's no way we can afford for all 4 of us to go. He is insisting I make the passport and I am refusing.

I know it is killing his mom to not see our newest addition, but I can't bear the thought of parting with my baby for a month or more! He thinks I am refusing because I think they are going to try to keep the kids there. I know his mother would never do that to me, so this isn't even an issue, I just really and truthfully don't want to be apart from my baby.

Does anyone have suggestions for me? I really need some advice, should I let the baby go? Should I stand my ground and refuse? Have any of you let your husbands take the kids overseas without you?

I appreciate any advice, but please be gentle (but firm) with me, this is really a sensitive matter for me.

Hope you all have a good day!

I have been with my husband for 12 years, he is a great dad, I know his family well, all 8 of his brothers and sisters plus parents live in Israel, my kids are not babies anymore and I still would absolutely never let my kids travel without me anywhere out of the country, or probably anywhere else for that matter. Because G-d forbid something happened to them while I was not there to protect them, I would never live with myself. I cant imagine taking a baby. I cant imagine a middle eastern family expecting a baby to come without their mother.

As an aside, once I did let my husband travel to Israel with my son before I arrived a few days later, as I took a different flight because of business. He traveled alone with my oldest son on the flight. The plane ride with the then 9mo old was so horrific he said he would never do it again! So maybe you should tell him the horror stories of traveling alone with babies!

[KittyPollitt 284]

No No No and HELL NO. There is so much to consider when traveling with a baby in the first place.. everything from vaccines to carseats to packing formula and baby food.. I'm planning a trip to Morocco now with my (will be) 3 month old to meet her father, and I'm worried about anything that would happen to her with me BEING there, I can't begin to imagine my daughter taking a weeks long trip overseas without me. I would lose my mind. Putting that kind of stress on yourself and the baby is no good for either of you- your in laws will just have to be patient. Good gracious. My blood pressure rises just thinking about it.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Last time I checked, planes fly both ways. Let them come to you if they really want to spend time with your children at this age.

[AlHayatZween 2]

Last time I checked, planes fly both ways. Let them come to you if they really want to spend time with your children at this age.

Word

[one love 0]

I agree with Jeanne. I could not let my 7 month old go without me. How old is your oldest child? I know a lot of airlines don't make you purchase tickets for children two and under I think. Could you afford to go if the baby and possibly the oldest didn't have to have a ticket?

My husband's family still hasn't met our son. His father gives him hell over it all the time. I told them that they can just wait until next year when the new baby is old enough to travel so they can meet them both at the same time. There's no way that I'd let them go and miss that experience without me!

No to The hell no

[MrsAmera 41]

Hi - Zaidsmom mentioned me so I'm chiming in I traveled with our oldest son to Morocco when he was 16 months old. My husband took our youngest son when he was about 14 months old, and I went for the 2nd half of the trip. That being said, I traveled all over the US via air with him (more than 10 times) before the big trip to Morocco. He went to Morocco again this past summer, when he was 2 1/2. His dad took him, and stayed for a month. He came back to the US, and our son came back 2 months later with a very close family friend (more like a sister to me and 2nd mom to him). He didn't have any problems and while it was hard to be away from him it was really good for him to spend time with my husbands family.

Having said all that, do I think 7 months is too young, yes. Although they would like to see him I think it wouldn't be worth it unless it were a family trip and you were all going to visit. He's too young to really do anything or be interested or even remember his dad's family at that age. If you are comfortable with your husband taking him at an older age, I would try to work on a compromise, but know air travel with little dudes is stressful as all get out and your husband should be prepared for that.

PM if you want more details or anything.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I need some opinions please...

I try to be a good wife and respect my husband to the fullest, just as he respects me. However, we are having a horrible disagreement as of late. We have two kids together, the oldest has been to his home country (when a baby) and met all his family...however I was with the child at the time when we went for a visit. But now we have another child, 7 months old, and he wants this child to go visit his family as well. Without me. I've said to him not without me because the child is still a baby, needs mommy, I will miss all the firsts! He says I am being selfish and his family deserves to see the child and spend time with it. I agree they do...but only if I come too, and money right now is very tight, there's no way we can afford for all 4 of us to go. He is insisting I make the passport and I am refusing.

I know it is killing his mom to not see our newest addition, but I can't bear the thought of parting with my baby for a month or more! He thinks I am refusing because I think they are going to try to keep the kids there. I know his mother would never do that to me, so this isn't even an issue, I just really and truthfully don't want to be apart from my baby.

Does anyone have suggestions for me? I really need some advice, should I let the baby go? Should I stand my ground and refuse? Have any of you let your husbands take the kids overseas without you?

I appreciate any advice, but please be gentle (but firm) with me, this is really a sensitive matter for me.

Hope you all have a good day!

I have a friend who took both kids to Tunis for a month 2 years ago. Both are still there.. without her.. Go with your kids... She cant get them home.. I could never recommend leaving your kids in a non hague country....you have no recourse if you cant bring them home........doesnt happen often but sometimes happens...I wouldnt allow unaccompanied travel to a non hague convention country

I have a friend who took both kids to Tunis for a month 2 years ago. Both are still there.. without her.. Go with your kids... She cant get them home.. I could never recommend leaving your kids in a non hague country....you have no recourse if you cant bring them home........doesnt happen often but sometimes happens...I wouldnt allow unaccompanied travel to a non hague convention country

May I add she left without them thinking they were coming home later..

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I have a friend who took both kids to Tunis for a month 2 years ago. Both are still there.. without her.. Go with your kids... She cant get them home.. I could never recommend leaving your kids in a non hague country....you have no recourse if you cant bring them home........doesnt happen often but sometimes happens...I wouldnt allow unaccompanied travel to a non hague convention country

May I add she left without them thinking they were coming home later..

Several cases

One from Morocco

A difficult child custody case involving the kidnapping of two children by their father has created major problems for the staff at Morocco’s Norwegian Embassy. The man has been charged with kidnapping and taking his 13 and 16 year-old kids from Norway to Rabat in Morocco.

The father managed to keep the children in Rabat for two and a half years before they finally managed to escape and make their way to the Norwegian Embassy in Rabat. The embassy housed them for several days while their father issued a flurry of serious death threats against the embassy staff.

Eventually, the two children were met by their mother, who was able to get them safely back into Norway. This child custody case has been a real snafu for embassy staff in Morocco for several years. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs admitted being concerned for their safety but had their hands tied over the legality of separating the kids from their father, according to The Norway Post.

Luckily the kids took the initiative. Foreign Minister Jonas Gahr Stoere commented “The two children went voluntarily to the Norwegian Embassy after threats to their lives. They were allowed to stay there for three days, which is quite out of the ordinary, and indicates the seriousness of the case. They left the Embassy of their own accord, after which the Norwegian authorities had no contact with them, and consequently were not in any way involved with their leaving Morocco.”

According to the English Govts site, Morocco and Iraq had the highest numbers of abductions followed by Egypt and Lebanon

It doesnt mean it is going to happen, but its important to know you have no legal recourse if things go south, especially if you have left a child behind there

Recovery site from Australia for kids abducted to Egypt http://www.hugurkids.com/abduction-media/n....html?Itemid=55

[MrsAmera 41]

I just want to add - of course yes things like that do happen (look at the kid in Brazil who was just re-united with his dad). If your kids have not been registered with the Moroccan courts, they are not Moroccan citizens. My son was not. Therefore should things have gone south, they would be basically holding an American citizen hostage. I used to work with several people from the US State Dept in DC and all American citizens are permitted to leave the country without prior permission. IE if my husband had tried to keep our son there - it would have been a major issue for the Moroccan government because he is not a Moroccan citizen.

Bottomline - I trusted my husband to bring our son home. He did. I had no reason to think he wouldn't. All situations are different but if you think things could go awry then by all means don't do it. I did want to add however that not all foreign husbands are evil and would try to kidnap their children.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I just want to add - of course yes things like that do happen (look at the kid in Brazil who was just re-united with his dad). If your kids have not been registered with the Moroccan courts, they are not Moroccan citizens. My son was not. Therefore should things have gone south, they would be basically holding an American citizen hostage. I used to work with several people from the US State Dept in DC and all American citizens are permitted to leave the country without prior permission. IE if my husband had tried to keep our son there - it would have been a major issue for the Moroccan government because he is not a Moroccan citizen.

Bottomline - I trusted my husband to bring our son home. He did. I had no reason to think he wouldn't. All situations are different but if you think things could go awry then by all means don't do it. I did want to add however that not all foreign husbands are evil and would try to kidnap their children.

AGREED

But if things have been rocky, I wouldnt risk it. If things have been perfect, why not. Its just good to know about the hague convention and what it can and cannot do and this kidnapping from Norway just happened and it took 2 years to get the kids out of Morocco..

No matter what, just know whats around you. Doesnt mean it is going to happen but know about law and custody before you leave a kid overseas, ESPECIALLY if there have been problems..

RE US citizens... that doestn hold water in Tunisia ... The kids the mom cant get back are US citizens.. so it depends....she has been able to see them but not get them home. the embassy can do NOTHING about it

[Chica Yeyé 41]

Last time I checked, planes fly both ways. Let them come to you if they really want to spend time with your children at this age.

WORD.

Bottomline - I trusted my husband to bring our son home. He did. I had no reason to think he wouldn't. All situations are different but if you think things could go awry then by all means don't do it. I did want to add however that not all foreign husbands are evil and would try to kidnap their children.

Thanks for saying that.

[sachinky 465]

Try and save diligently for the next 6 months so that you can travel and take a family trip.

I am not a mother and I don't plan on becoming one in the near future, but I can't imagine letting a 7 month old travelling without his mother.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I just want to add - of course yes things like that do happen (look at the kid in Brazil who was just re-united with his dad). If your kids have not been registered with the Moroccan courts, they are not Moroccan citizens. My son was not. Therefore should things have gone south, they would be basically holding an American citizen hostage. I used to work with several people from the US State Dept in DC and all American citizens are permitted to leave the country without prior permission. IE if my husband had tried to keep our son there - it would have been a major issue for the Moroccan government because he is not a Moroccan citizen.

Bottomline - I trusted my husband to bring our son home. He did. I had no reason to think he wouldn't. All situations are different but if you think things could go awry then by all means don't do it. I did want to add however that not all foreign husbands are evil and would try to kidnap their children.

Girl missing in Egypt, 5 years,parental abduction 2009

http://www.youtube.com/user/hugurkids#p/a/u/2/YtoSyA7LaTs

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Girl missing in Egypt, 5 years,parental abduction 2009

http://www.youtube.com/user/hugurkids#p/a/u/2/YtoSyA7LaTs

Many of these happen on so called vacations with no warning to the mom

Elnor Elsaeiti is illegally kept in Libya, away from her mother Laila and her home in Upplands Väsby, Sweden since July 2008. She was on vacation with her father who was supposed to bring her back after her uncle's wedding, but failed to do so. Since october 2008, her father recieved a swedish passport and has been missing ever since. No one knows where he is and Elnor is alone without any parents at his family's house. She can't get home on her own! Read more about this case at www.saknadebarn.org (swedish only) and help us bring her back!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImBlJGSMQQs...feature=related

[TheGoodWife 0]

Hi! Again, I would like to thank you all for the responses. My husband and I have finally come to an understanding since I called his mother and told her what he was saying. She said she expressed that she wanted to see the baby, but she would never want the baby to come without me. Which, honestly, I already knew she wouldn't agree to something like that...she's a mom and she knows how it would feel if someone took your little one on a long trip. Hubby apparently talked with his grandmother and she is the one laying the guilt trip, saying grandpa is dying and all the family is crying because they can't see the kids. Grandma is a bit dramatic. I wish we could afford for everyone to come here, but again, finances aren't exactly the greatest right now and there are a lot of family members. We are going to try to save the money and ALL of us will try to go after the summer (because it's hotter then hell in the summer) for a nice FAMILY vacation.

I also want to say, I trust my family there, I know they would not kidnap the kids no matter if there are problems or not. I know in MENA countries women have no rights and by law they could keep the kids, but I know they wouldn't. I trusted them all the times I went there, I have no reason to not trust them now. I pray that each of you have a very happy new year and may God bless each and every one of you and that He will keep you in His embrace and protection. And may all the babies taken from their mothers (in the states and abroad) be reunited again.

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