I need gimygirl's aggression

[gimygirl 0]

there is a fine line between abuse and physical discipline but i can assure you with 100% certainty that you don't need to hit your children for them to become great members of society as they age. whether it's a slap across the back of the head, a few spanks on the bottom or a good ole fashion whoopin' ... it's not needed and only breeds contempt, fear and mistrust ... although many mistake that for obedience and respect.

I feel like there is no middle gorund on this one...either you thinks it's just fine and dandy, or it makes you feel sad for kids who are hit, whooped, smacked...

some people do think it's fine and dandy to administer physical punishment as a means for discipline ... and a percentage of those people do AT TIMES cross the line and abuse their children ... even if it's just that one time that they cross the line.

i'm with you, frances ... i always feel bad for children who experience fear at the hand of their parent.

[Traviesa 0]

there is a fine line between abuse and physical discipline but i can assure you with 100% certainty that you don't need to hit your children for them to become great members of society as they age. whether it's a slap across the back of the head, a few spanks on the bottom or a good ole fashion whoopin' ... it's not needed and only breeds contempt, fear and mistrust ... although many mistake that for obedience and respect.

I feel like there is no middle gorund on this one...either you thinks it's just fine and dandy, or it makes you feel sad for kids who are hit, whooped, smacked...

some people do think it's fine and dandy to administer physical punishment as a means for discipline ... and a percentage of those people do AT TIMES cross the line and abuse their children ... even if it's just that one time that they cross the line.

i'm with you, frances ... i always feel bad for children who experience fear at the hand of their parent.

Me too...and I can honestly say that, having come from a childhood of fear. The only memories I have of my childhood are negative...the ones of my dad driving me around with a beer can between his legs and being scared to death, or of him blowing up at my mom in the night while I'm trying to sleep and being scared he'll leave, or of that time when my mom had me go up to him and tell him I didn't want him to leave...these things are vivid, but I have not one single vivid happy memory of childhood. And this anger wasn't even directed at me most of the time. I can only imagine how the kids must feel as the TARGET. The one time I actually stood up to my dad as a child and told him "leave my mother alone" that anger got directed at me and I was told "you get back in the house." That was one of the scariest moments I remember. I can't imagine facing that every day. Breaks my heart to think about it. It's not good or healthy for young children to live in fear-and I can tell you that, because I lived it.

[incanada1234 0]

Me too...and I can honestly say that, having come from a childhood of fear. The only memories I have of my childhood are negative...the ones of my dad driving me around with a beer can between his legs and being scared to death, or of him blowing up at my mom in the night while I'm trying to sleep and being scared he'll leave, or of that time when my mom had me go up to him and tell him I didn't want him to leave...these things are vivid, but I have not one single vivid happy memory of childhood. And this anger wasn't even directed at me most of the time. I can only imagine how the kids must feel as the TARGET. The one time I actually stood up to my dad as a child and told him "leave my mother alone" that anger got directed at me and I was told "you get back in the house." That was one of the scariest moments I remember. I can't imagine facing that every day. Breaks my heart to think about it. It's not good or healthy for young children to live in fear-and I can tell you that, because I lived it.

(sorry, but there's no 'hug' emoticon)

[Ban Hammer 13,337]

Me too...and I can honestly say that, having come from a childhood of fear. The only memories I have of my childhood are negative...the ones of my dad driving me around with a beer can between his legs and being scared to death, or of him blowing up at my mom in the night while I'm trying to sleep and being scared he'll leave, or of that time when my mom had me go up to him and tell him I didn't want him to leave...these things are vivid, but I have not one single vivid happy memory of childhood. And this anger wasn't even directed at me most of the time. I can only imagine how the kids must feel as the TARGET. The one time I actually stood up to my dad as a child and told him "leave my mother alone" that anger got directed at me and I was told "you get back in the house." That was one of the scariest moments I remember. I can't imagine facing that every day. Breaks my heart to think about it. It's not good or healthy for young children to live in fear-and I can tell you that, because I lived it.

now i gotta get used to this being missliss

[Traviesa 0]

Me too...and I can honestly say that, having come from a childhood of fear. The only memories I have of my childhood are negative...the ones of my dad driving me around with a beer can between his legs and being scared to death, or of him blowing up at my mom in the night while I'm trying to sleep and being scared he'll leave, or of that time when my mom had me go up to him and tell him I didn't want him to leave...these things are vivid, but I have not one single vivid happy memory of childhood. And this anger wasn't even directed at me most of the time. I can only imagine how the kids must feel as the TARGET. The one time I actually stood up to my dad as a child and told him "leave my mother alone" that anger got directed at me and I was told "you get back in the house." That was one of the scariest moments I remember. I can't imagine facing that every day. Breaks my heart to think about it. It's not good or healthy for young children to live in fear-and I can tell you that, because I lived it.

now i gotta get used to this being missliss

Was in a name changing kind of mood today and I thought the change would be cute!

Marissa, thanks for the hugs! I used to be really hush about all this stuff and not really think about it or talk about it, but it's easier now to accept it, and keep it in the past where it belongs.

[incanada1234 0]

Was in a name changing kind of mood today and I thought the change would be cute!

Marissa, thanks for the hugs! I used to be really hush about all this stuff and not really think about it or talk about it, but it's easier now to accept it, and keep it in the past where it belongs.

Oh! LOL!! Hahaha, I didn't even notice it's you, MissLiss.

Yeah, no need to be ashamed of what happened when you were a child. My hope is that children grow up and realize it's not their fault. Sadly, I know a lot of them don't, and as a result they themselves abuse THEIR children. Or are just terribly unhappy with life.

[Traviesa 0]

Or are just terribly unhappy with life.

unfortunately, that's the one I "got." I am just recently seeking the treatment for the depression that has been with me for years-literally as long as I can remember-and has caused me lots of problems in life.

[Itsmeitsmeitsree! 0]

No one said anything about anyone having "power" as you've so eloquently written here. However, I do think that manhandling a child is just a bit too much. As small as some children are, it is so easy to bruise or hurt them. I have been teaching for 12 years now. I've seen a lot. I've worked with small children for most of that 12 years...10 of those years to be precise. I'm not saying I am a professional when it comes to making a decision on what is and is not termed abuse. I am saying that I've seen small children bruised, finger marks on their arms, slap marks on tiny legs, and it tore at my heart. I am required by law, however, to report such things to the administration and they report it to Child Services. I can only hope something was done to prevent it from happening again.

I feel this is part of the problem rather than a solution. My mother, and both sets of grandparents disciplined all of us children (aunts, uncles around my age), with nice good swats to the backsides, or legs. I had plenty of welps left over from a nice fresh branch cut off the tree closest to the house. Were they abusive? Hell no, we needed it and there is not one incident I can look back on and claim any of these people were child abusers!

My generation grows up to have children, and are to afraid to discipline our children in a manner that would get the point across, because if you smack your child on the butt and leave a red mark Mrs Smith is going to report you as an abusive parent! Mind you though Mrs Smith is probably the same old hag that used to throw a chalk board eraser at my head when I was in school, or take a huge wooden paddle and burn your butt up. I can count on my ten fingers how many times my three boys have been physically punished, because frankly I am to afraid to do it. I can however tell you it gets the point across, much better than "johnny you can't do this because bla bla bla". Now having a 17 year old down to a 12 year old, I wish I could turn back time and not be their buddy but a parent who had disciplined them in a manner that they would not have forgotten.

Next time you run into some smart alec 16 year old on your shopping outting, ask him/her if they were spanked as a child. Likely not, mommy probably learned parenting from a book.

now that i've worked my way thru all of the responses, i don't know why the mother was so insistent that the child not fall asleep. i do think she could have been much more gentle.

had i seen such i'd have told her such, as who knows what goes on when no one is around eh?

Maybe what goes on is the kid screams all through the night keeping mom up, then wants to take a siesta in the middle of the day.

Amen sister! I was punished this way as well, (but not often) and I'm an upstanding productive member of society. It may not work for everyone, but it sure got my attention and I spent a LOT of time doing things to ensure this didn't happen!

[Sister Fracas 5]

Maybe what goes on is the kid screams all through the night keeping mom up, then wants to take a siesta in the middle of the day.

Amen sister! I was punished this way as well, (but not often) and I'm an upstanding productive member of society. It may not work for everyone, but it sure got my attention and I spent a LOT of time doing things to ensure this didn't happen!

I'm still having a hard time understanding why a child screaming all night keeping the mum up, is the child's fault ...??? Seems the parent isn't doing their job in the first place to ensure that that doesn't happen. Children don't just "decide" to have siestas I don't believe...their bodies get tired and parents need to deal with that, not continuously yank the child awake....

[incanada1234 0]

Or are just terribly unhappy with life.

unfortunately, that's the one I "got." I am just recently seeking the treatment for the depression that has been with me for years-literally as long as I can remember-and has caused me lots of problems in life.

Awww MissLiss, I'm so sorry. I hope you can find happiness somehow. And again,

I'm still having a hard time understanding why a child screaming all night keeping the mum up, is the child's fault ...??? Seems the parent isn't doing their job in the first place to ensure that that doesn't happen. Children don't just "decide" to have siestas I don't believe...their bodies get tired and parents need to deal with that, not continuously yank the child awake....

Yeah really. Most kids don't WANT to take naps or go to sleep at night.

[Tim and Bethanie 1]

AND AS A TEACHER IN THE PUBLIC SCHOOL I THINK WE ARE A LITTLE LOW ON DISCIPLINE.

Haven't read this whole thread, prob won't but I want to add this...Parents are EXTREMELY low on discipline because of stuff like this. I'm not saying what this parent was doing was right...but hoenstly parents are so afraid of abuse and someone saying they are abusing their child that they won't discipline them AT ALL. I had a small chil...5 years old..tiny...who's 300 pound mother was too afraid of him to do anything. The ONE time she spanked him a neighbor turned her in to the state and she was investigated...nothing was found but that is a traumatizing process. To have someone tell you YOU don't know how to parent a child....as a result her child was OUT OF CONTROL....he stabbed another child with a pencil, threw a chair, and was eventually baker acted (forcibly hospitalized..)

honestly, I had the ####### beat out of me as a child and I'm glad. I don't consider it abuse...i mean Iddin't get burned by cigarettes or anything - butI was disciplined....and disciplined properly and I turend out fine. I think we are so quick to scream child abuse that parents are losing the ability to discipline and children are going wild...I work in a public school as well and I see it EVERY day!!!

I think this debate would be more interesting in another twenty years, when all of these children are grown and have had children of their own. Some of the worst children I have seen (as a majority) were in a country, where corporal punishment was illegal, and the kids know it!

I am not arguing the value of anyones opinion here, there are fantastic parents who never physically punish their children, and I have known great parents that do. There is that line that one can cross to where it is definetly abuse. It has been pointed out here already, what one may consider abuse another wont. Just a touchy situation. The best we can do is parent the way we deem fit and hope for the best. I don't however believe anyone else should step in to tell someone else how to parent, fact is we all make mistakes when raising our kiddos. Some of us just choose not to torture them. Still, I would like to step back and do things differently, less talking and the evil eye and a bit more smacks on the bum. Thats just me.

I know all about abuse I spent 3.5 years working in a womens corrections facility. Some stories would make your stomach turn. Nothing more heart wrenching than watching a child who has went through torture in his lifetime, to come sob and embrace the woman that caused it!