a filipina friend of mind in my area ...who just got married ask help...

[FortLaudy 10]

I love your writing Ziia, really goood !! No I'm not saying what the phillipinas are doing is "Right" of course it's wrong, but my professor did try to make me see things from a different perspective and so some of their actions (as per the VJ threads) makes a whole lot more sense to me when I do look at it from that perspective:

Why they're willing to marry someone that's old enough to be their father.

Marrying someone that's extremely unattractive

Trying to get the USC to help them send money back home or does so as soon as they're able to work etc.

If you see that they equate love with how much they're "taken care of" instead of how we see love: an irresistable attraction to and need for someone's company, it does make more sense... Not that it makes it "right" in any sense of course, it just makes more sense why SOOOO many of these stereotypical old white male/young asian female relationships start up and when they break up when the USC refuses to send money to their families.

[ziia 9]

I love your writing Ziia, really goood !! No I'm not saying what the phillipinas are doing is "Right" of course it's wrong, but my professor did try to make me see things from a different perspective and so some of their actions (as per the VJ threads) makes a whole lot more sense to me when I do look at it from that perspective:

Why they're willing to marry someone that's old enough to be their father.

Marrying someone that's extremely unattractive

Trying to get the USC to help them send money back home or does so as soon as they're able to work etc.

If you see that they equate love with how much they're "taken care of" instead of how we see love: an irresistable attraction to and need for someone's company, it does make more sense... Not that it makes it "right" in any sense of course, it just makes more sense why SOOOO many of these stereotypical old white male/young asian female relationships start up and when they break up when the USC refuses to send money to their families.

Thank you for the kind words Shani682. It does make more sense to think like that in order to explain what you see so often(much older man together with way too young PI girls) . Still, I do think that people fall in love there the same way they fall in love here, but, because some are poor, they tend to act(not feel, not love) differently by marring someone who can take care of them. But that is just the really poor people. Not all PI is poor even if that's the way it looks to an American who is used to big trucks and tall shiny buildings to define richness. As you will see in the cities of PI, where the economic lifestyle is better, the people who marry within the same culture are close to age and are romantic to one another just like we are here in US. Same exact thing. At least that's my opinion after I talked to some PI women.

Marrying a USC because he can take care of you is not necessarily fraud IF and only if it is not just that reason alone. That goes in US and in PI's mentality too! Marrying solely for financial support should not be seen as an excuse to their culture, their lifestyle, their thinking because it's not. Maybe to some extent but not entirely and not to be put as a banner above their heads: love means money. Not entirely true. Love without money and money without love does not work for both: US citizens nor for PI nationals. That is just the way things are and how we roll through life, no matter what culture we're from.

Though we disagree on this point alone, I do agree with you when you say that people should not rush to conclusions, no matter if it's pro or against the immigrant or the USC for that matter. Sill they can have an opinion that matters if they justify it, just like you and I did. Great talking to you too by the way:)

Edited December 19, 2009 by ziia

[chinese_mutt 11]

I love your writing Ziia, really goood !! No I'm not saying what the phillipinas are doing is "Right" of course it's wrong, but my professor did try to make me see things from a different perspective and so some of their actions (as per the VJ threads) makes a whole lot more sense to me when I do look at it from that perspective:

Why they're willing to marry someone that's old enough to be their father.

Marrying someone that's extremely unattractive

Trying to get the USC to help them send money back home or does so as soon as they're able to work etc.

If you see that they equate love with how much they're "taken care of" instead of how we see love: an irresistable attraction to and need for someone's company, it does make more sense... Not that it makes it "right" in any sense of course, it just makes more sense why SOOOO many of these stereotypical old white male/young asian female relationships start up and when they break up when the USC refuses to send money to their families.

I just feel the need to give my opnion here. Not because I married a guy older than me but because this have been way too emphasized here.

1. Age : In Asia AGE is equivalent to maturity, wisdom, and capability to handle/raise a family. Now of course, not everybody wants/thinks about marrying some crazy old man out of the blue! But think about the people here in VJ. I've seen a lot of single mother applying for k1, cr1 or k3... where is the fathers? I bet you if you ask them most of the fathers of their kids are right around their age. These women know by experience that '"LOVE" alone does not make up a commitment much less marriage. Let's go back to our fore fathers... whether here in US or anywhere else in the world, history almost always tells us that young girls marry older guys. Why? Because older guys are perceived to be more established financially as well as emotionally.

2. Attractiveness is a matter of perception. What is attractive to one can be unattractive to another. Looking back in history, we also know that the term beautiful has taken on different sizes and shapes. I don't see why you should be so critical of other people's looks.

Books don't tell you everything, go travel to Asia... nobody here can ever really describe the huge difference in culture and way of thinking and doing things unless you've travelled. Books can only tell you so much, mostly the perception of the author/s, go save up and travel there before you start thinking that you finally 'understand' what life in Asia is all about. You don't know what poor is until you've seen the poor in third world country.

Edited December 19, 2009 by chinese_mutt

[FortLaudy 10]

I love your writing Ziia, really goood !! No I'm not saying what the phillipinas are doing is "Right" of course it's wrong, but my professor did try to make me see things from a different perspective and so some of their actions (as per the VJ threads) makes a whole lot more sense to me when I do look at it from that perspective:

Why they're willing to marry someone that's old enough to be their father.

Marrying someone that's extremely unattractive

Trying to get the USC to help them send money back home or does so as soon as they're able to work etc.

If you see that they equate love with how much they're "taken care of" instead of how we see love: an irresistable attraction to and need for someone's company, it does make more sense... Not that it makes it "right" in any sense of course, it just makes more sense why SOOOO many of these stereotypical old white male/young asian female relationships start up and when they break up when the USC refuses to send money to their families.

I just feel the need to give my opnion here. Not because I married a guy older than me but because this have been way too emphasized here.

1. Age : In Asia AGE is equivalent to maturity, wisdom, and capability to handle/raise a family. Now of course, not everybody wants/thinks about marrying some crazy old man out of the blue! But think about the people here in VJ. I've seen a lot of single mother applying for k1, cr1 or k3... where is the fathers? I bet you if you ask them most of the fathers of their kids are right around their age. These women know by experience that '"LOVE" alone does not make up a commitment much less marriage. Let's go back to our fore fathers... whether here in US or anywhere else in the world, history almost always tells us that young girls marry older guys. Why? Because older guys are perceived to be more established financially as well as emotionally.

2. Attractiveness is a matter of perception. What is attractive to one can be unattractive to another. Looking back in history, we also know that the term beautiful has taken on different sizes and shapes. I don't see why you should be so critical of other people's looks.

Books don't tell you everything, go travel to Asia... nobody here can ever really describe the huge difference in culture and way of thinking and doing things unless you've travelled. Books can only tell you so much, mostly the perception of the author/s, go save up and travel there before you start thinking that you finally 'understand' what life in Asia is all about. You don't know what poor is until you've seen the poor in third world country.

Honey, I grew up in Africa, I know poor!!! lol

I have travelled AL OVER THE WORLD and have lived in Bangkok and Singapore, I have travelled to Bangladesh, Nepal, you name it... it was my job for many years, my experiences are only enhanced by my education and the opinion of my professors...

[justashooter 430]

Honey, I grew up in Africa, I know poor!!! lol

I have travelled AL OVER THE WORLD and have lived in Bangkok and Singapore, I have travelled to Bangladesh, Nepal, you name it... it was my job for many years, my experiences are only enhanced by my education and the opinion of my professors...

nothing in africa translates to the phils or any other asian country. africans are nothing like asians, in terms of individual psyche or group dynamic. bangladesh and nepal are often grouped with the asian countries, but are no more asian than india is. bangkok and singapore are the homer simpson version of asia. both are extreme exaggerations of facets of the asian perspective.

you need to live with philipine people to understand them, just like you need to live with chinese to understand them. by live with, i mena live in the same kind of housing, ride the same kind of bus or motorcycle, work in the same kind of job, etc.

as for your professors, well, if you're still quoting them, you haven't yet learned enough to have your own opinion. finish school before you try to become a teacher. (just busting on you. i understand that in portugal and spain and italy il professore has a special place).

lighten up on the men who are old enough to be their wive's fathers. i am 18 years older than my wife.

ｄｉｄ　ｓｈｅ　ｍａｒｒｙ　ｍｅ　ｆｏｒ　ｍｏｎｅｙ　ｏｒ　ａ　ｇｒｅｅｎ　ｃａｒｄ　ｏｒ ａｌｉｆｅｓｔｙｌｅ？　

ｎｏ．　ｓｈｅ　ｍａｒｒｉｅｄ　ｍｅ　ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ　ｉ　ｔａｌｋ　ｗｉｔｈ　ｈｅｒ　ａｎｄ　ｌｉｓｔｅｎ　ｗｈｅｎ　ｓｈｅ　ｔａｌｋｓ　ｔｏ　ｍｅ．　

[3600rs 24]

All of you'll get a full time job instead of this elaborate mudslinging and stereotyping. You'll are a bunch of global clowns short of a circus, or fries short of a happy meal.

Your global travel and experience has not made you'll any better in your judgments. Better are those Immigration Officers (not very highly educated) who treat every case fairly.

One may like to stereotype Asians including the notable Philippines as fraudsters, but with that comes hard work, education and progress.

Ask a Frenchman about hard working Portuguese workers, and ask a Brazilian about crooked Portuguese fraudsters.

[chinese_mutt 11]

nothing in africa translates to the phils or any other asian country. africans are nothing like asians, in terms of individual psyche or group dynamic. bangladesh and nepal are often grouped with the asian countries, but are no more asian than india is. bangkok and singapore are the homer simpson version of asia. both are extreme exaggerations of facets of the asian perspective.

you need to live with philipine people to understand them, just like you need to live with chinese to understand them. by live with, i mena live in the same kind of housing, ride the same kind of bus or motorcycle, work in the same kind of job, etc.

as for your professors, well, if you're still quoting them, you haven't yet learned enough to have your own opinion. finish school before you try to become a teacher. (just busting on you. i understand that in portugal and spain and italy il professore has a special place).

lighten up on the men who are old enough to be their wive's fathers. i am 18 years older than my wife.

ｄｉｄ　ｓｈｅ　ｍａｒｒｙ　ｍｅ　ｆｏｒ　ｍｏｎｅｙ　ｏｒ　ａ　ｇｒｅｅｎ　ｃａｒｄ　ｏｒ ａｌｉｆｅｓｔｙｌｅ？　

ｎｏ．　ｓｈｅ　ｍａｒｒｉｅｄ　ｍｅ　ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ　ｉ　ｔａｌｋ　ｗｉｔｈ　ｈｅｒ　ａｎｄ　ｌｉｓｔｅｎ　ｗｈｅｎ　ｓｈｅ　ｔａｌｋｓ　ｔｏ　ｍｅ．　

All of you'll get a full time job instead of this elaborate mudslinging and stereotyping. You'll are a bunch of global clowns short of a circus, or fries short of a happy meal.

Your global travel and experience has not made you'll any better in your judgments. Better are those Immigration Officers (not very highly educated) who treat every case fairly.

One may like to stereotype Asians including the notable Philippines as fraudsters, but with that comes hard work, education and progress.

Ask a Frenchman about hard working Portuguese workers, and ask a Brazilian about crooked Portuguese fraudsters.

Wanna hire me? I'd love a full time job that pays high.

If you have a full time job.. go do your job instead of attacking people who are having intellectual conversation about life and different cultures.

Edited December 21, 2009 by chinese_mutt

[FortLaudy 10]

Argh, I'm a little over this whole conversation... I'm just thankful that I have a handsome young husband who is capable of doing all the crazy sporty stuff with me and is an awesome husband all the way around and we'll hopefully live happily ever after grow old together.

But this topic does fascinate me tremendously, lol, so here we go, round 20!! sheeezzz

The only point I was trying to make from my first reply to the original post is don't always scream "fraud" toward the foreigner on VJ, who comes on seeking advice after a failed marriage to a USC... There are things going on beneath the surface that we don't know about and dynamics and possibly silent agreements surrounding this "Old man young asian wife" type relationship that we should take into account before casting judgement and blaming just the one party for the breakdown and commiting fraud. I'm not saying I'm the world authority on cultural differences, just that I have travelled a lot and lived amongst these communities to know a few more things about them than ordinary people do who read these threads and come to biased conclusions. I'm not taking either side and trying to make a villain out of either side, just wanted to share my views.

I just had to point out that the USC cannot possibly be so perfect and faultless if he had to go to the ends of the earth to find a wife. In the entire female US population he could not find anybody?? - even within the huge Asian communities that are already legally here, if he wanted "variety"? I have heard many of these men say how they are forced to go over to Asia to find a wife, blaming the many "faults" of western women... which begs the question: Is there something wrong with this guy instead, rather than the entire US female population? you bet ya!!!

So why is he never blamed for the marriage failure here on VJ but the foreign bride always is and on top of that accused of committing fraud?? Not saying immigration fraud doesn't exist of course it does... but on VJ it seems the norm to call it that when a marriage between USC and foreigner doesn't work out... WRONG!!! The divorce rate is high for everyone, why should it be different when people are from different countries?

Yes, cultural differences do exist, and however disgusting it is for the rest of us to even imagine shacking up with a wrinkly old man that's the age of our fathers, in some cultures it's perfectly normal to marry someone not taking into account their age or looks and focusing mainly on their "wisdom" and "finacial stability" as measurement of good marriage material, so that makes more sense why Asian women tend to marry older men.

When it doesn't work out though, don't always blame the foreigner!

I'm not saying this is true for every case, but in my opinion a great many of these "old man, young Asian wife" stereotypes: They both came into the relationship "gaining" something - understandably, as in general nobody gets married to be worse off. However it seems like some sort of an unusual agreement is made beforehand, so when the other partner doesn't put out - either money or sex or there's emotional and physical abuse, it quickly turns sour. Because in my opinion this marriage is not built on "love" as we know it, but on expectations of what one partner can do for the other. Not saying love doesn't grow out of it and this can be a great marriage for both for many many years, but when it turns bad, it's because the foundation on what this marriage is built fell apart and not only one is at fault here. It takes two to Tango!

The same goes for conventional marriages: If you build your marriage on love, and the love is no longer there, you get divorced... The only difference here is the foundation the marriages are built on, as on the other hand in some of these "arrangement" marriages, if one partner does not provide enough good housekeeping and sex or the other does not give enough money (plus money to the family back home), or whatever else the "arrangement" is, it also falls apart - because the foundation it was built on is different and is now crumbling...

Is this crazy? In my opinion, yes... I would go as far as calling it some form of prostitution... because my views are "western" I believe it's better to marry someone for love, someone closer to your own age whom you can grow old with and have the same interests as, taking into account looks, health, background, religion, education etc. But because I have travelled some I know it's very normal in some cultures to completely ignore looks, age, health and a few other things and just focus on how much the husband can provide. (Hey, this is true for some Western women too - Anna Nicole Smith and that fossil husband for example that shocked everyone)

So in the OP's case we saw that the wife wanted to swiftly move on and find another husband - in my opinion to have the same type of arrangement with - We look at this and it's clear that there was no love in the first place and some say she's a crook just trying to come to the US. However, taking into account the cultural differences and perception on love, it's clear that in her mind it's just the "normal" thing to do plus she's saving face with the family back home... she'll attempt to find this "arrangement" with another man because the first one failed - nothing to do with "love" as we see it. And the USC is typing away at his computer trying to bring the next one over on a K1 visa with a whole lot of promises (maybe false??) because he is still the same loser who has not worked on his own issues yet...

When most people look at this though they understandably see it as immigration fraud through marriage, but mistankenly almost always only point a finger at the foreigner... This is where I have a problem with some VJ'ers who don't know Anything about the foreign culture under discussion, who have not travelled and lived amongst these communities and come on here immediately accusing the foreigner of immigration fraud and the USC is made out to be this faultless duped angel... #######!??

My humble advice: If you want a perfect 10, BE a perfect 10 !!!! Don't marry way beneath you or way out of your league. Don't look for your "better" half, make yourself a complete and confident person first, and look for that other "whole" person as a partner.

You wanna marry someone from a different culture/religion? educate yourself first and know what you're getting yourself into or you'll be very sorry... And lastly, you want a happy husband? feed him and ** him, very simple, lol ! If he's not getting it at home, he WILL get it somewhere else, it's just their nature!

[FortLaudy 10]

All of you'll get a full time job instead of this elaborate mudslinging and stereotyping. You'll are a bunch of global clowns short of a circus, or fries short of a happy meal.

Your global travel and experience has not made you'll any better in your judgments. Better are those Immigration Officers (not very highly educated) who treat every case fairly.

One may like to stereotype Asians including the notable Philippines as fraudsters, but with that comes hard work, education and progress.

Ask a Frenchman about hard working Portuguese workers, and ask a Brazilian about crooked Portuguese fraudsters.

The only reason I'm on here is because I'M WAITING FOR MY EAD SO I CAN GET A FULL TIME JOB , you however... have no excuse!!!!

[ziia 9]

So why is he never blamed for the marriage failure here on VJ but the foreign bride always is and on top of that accused of committing fraud?? Not saying immigration fraud doesn't exist of course it does... but on VJ it seems the norm to call it that when a marriage between USC and foreigner doesn't work out... WRONG!!! The divorce rate is high for everyone, why should it be different when people are from different countries?

Yes, cultural differences do exist, and however disgusting it is for the rest of us to even imagine shacking up with a wrinkly old man that's the age of our fathers, in some cultures it's perfectly normal to marry someone not taking into account their age or looks and focusing mainly on their "wisdom" and "finacial stability" as measurement of good marriage material, so that makes more sense why Asian women tend to marry older men.

When it doesn't work out though, don't always blame the foreigner!

Shani 682, I've been on this VJ site for many years, reading more than writing indeed because most of times i found everything I needed for my journey. My impression of the VJ posters is that they are not pointing fingers at the immigrant but on the one(immigrant or USC) who comes here and says he/she have been married for a couple of months and suddenly want out(the immigrant asks how to stay, for God knows what reason and the USC asks how to ship the broken puppet back)-THESE are the people who we indirectly accuse of fraud because in most cases, people with common sens KNOW that those people have not done everything in their power to save their marriage and get along. That thing alone is fishy and you'd be a fool to pretend it's not. I understand we all want a big love fest up in here where everyone gets along and we all cry "oh, poor you" but does that help anyone? No, it doesn't help the immigrant nor the USC nor us for that matter. Ignorance to facts is bliss.-so they say. I say that ignorance to facts is the mother of all curses. I think people should have an opinion and they do and they express it, of course in a decent way, without profanity. If you read some more on this site you will discover that both USC and immigrants are pointed the fingers to when they come here and ###### and wine and moan and don't try to work on their marriages but want to foot them. Why do I think VJ people are fair? Because THEY STAY IN LINE TO GET THEIR VISAS APPROVED! and don't like it when some people were ahead of them got approved, while the others are still waiting, and as soon as they got approved come here to ask for ways of staying or in the case of USC, shipping the brides back. People here don't point fingers at immigrants but on these people who are FRAUDS! Maybe they are not frauds in the eyes of cultures or immigration but they are FRAUDS socially. Please read this forum more, you will realize that what i'm saying is correct.

Because in my opinion this marriage is not built on "love" as we know it, but on expectations of what one partner can do for the other.

I want you not to forget that the immigrant chooses to immigrate to the US, not the other way around. Our society has a way to understand love and whether you think it's perceived differently in other countries doesn't matter. Why? because we live here!! they come here!! USC doesn't go there. When the USC goes there he can try to explain to the PIs how he sees love and see if that makes a difference. But until then, the immigrant has to comply with our definition of love. I totally and completely don't agree with you when you say "love" is perceived different in other countries. If the immigrant behaves like this: kisses, hugs, laughs, holds, caresses, holds hands, takes pictures of both, makes love, then they are just like us and "love" is love no matter of culture, habits, expectations. If the immigrant would: not kiss, not hold hands, not caress, then I would have to agree with you that love to them means something else. But it's not!! Fraud here is fraud there, love ere is love there. Immigrants are more motivated to marry someone richer indeed but to marry someone rich without feeling anything else for that person is FRAUD no matter of country. If the USC would have come here and ask how to ship her back you would have seen all VJ screaming and pointing fingers for giving up so soon on his marriage, for dragging the poor girl here then abandoning her. But in this case it's the immigrant who does the same freaking thing and whether you are more condoning of her behavior, it doesn't mean the rest should be too. Fraud doesn't come with citizenship or gender. Fraud comes with facts. And her screaming she wants to stay and find another while still in that guy's house, bed not even cold yet, is wrong to say the least. I don't care how that girl perceives "love" that is her freaking problem, not mine. She is the one immigrating here and she is the one who subjects herself to the laws of the US and our version of what fraud is and what not.

My humble advice: If you want a perfect 10, BE a perfect 10 !!!! Don't marry way beneath you or way out of your league. Don't look for your "better" half, make yourself a complete and confident person first, and look for that other "whole" person as a partner.

You wanna marry someone from a different culture/religion? educate yourself first and know what you're getting yourself into or you'll be very sorry... And lastly, you want a happy husband? feed him and ** him, very simple, lol ! If he's not getting it at home, he WILL get it somewhere else, it's just their nature!

That is a very good advise!

Edited December 21, 2009 by ziia

[FortLaudy 10]

Thanks Ziia, I do believe you misunderstood a few of my points, but it's ok, and just a last mention: however much we would like immigrants to "change" immediately when they move to the US, unfortunately they don't - it takes a few generations to integrate fully... they keep almost all of their original traditions and beliefs...

You have great opinions that I truly value and have definetely changed my point of view a little, and it's been a pleasure having this intellectual conversation with you, however I'm growing very tired of this topic now, and I'm really just hoping that some people will get my point and stop shouting "fraud" at every one of these cases and think a little before they do... that's all folks, over and out! lol

[Marzy 1]

Sometimes, Filipina woman could be real stubborn or irrational or just want "me me me." She needs to talk with her husband, not searching how to get out of her marriage quickly. That is called adjustment and knowing to each other. Dating is different.

Or one of the example.... check it here

Edited December 23, 2009 by S*J

[Ricardo_C 4]

Shani's fixation on looks, age, "culture", and wealth, remind me of Catherine's reasons for marrying Edgar, in Wuthering Heights...

‘First and foremost, do you love Mr. Edgar?’

‘Who can help it? Of course I do,’ she answered.

Then I put her through the following catechism: for a girl of twenty-two it was not injudicious.

‘Why do you love him, Miss Cathy?’

‘Nonsense, I do—that’s sufficient.’

‘By no means; you must say why?’

‘Well, because he is handsome, and pleasant to be with.’

‘Bad!’ was my commentary.

‘And because he is young and cheerful.’

‘Bad, still.’

‘And because he loves me.’

‘Indifferent, coming there.’

‘And he will be rich, and I shall like to be the greatest woman of the neighbourhood, and I shall be proud of having such a husband.’

‘Worst of all. And now, say how you love him?’

‘As everybody loves—You’re silly, Nelly.’

‘Not at all—Answer.’

‘I love the ground under his feet, and the air over his head, and everything he touches, and every word he says. I love all his looks, and all his actions, and him entirely and altogether. There now!’

‘And why?’

‘Nay; you are making a jest of it: it is exceedingly ill-natured! It’s no jest to me!’ said the young lady, scowling, and turning her face to the fire.

‘I’m very far from jesting, Miss Catherine,’ I replied. ‘You love Mr. Edgar because he is handsome, and young, and cheerful, and rich, and loves you. The last, however, goes for nothing: you would love him without that, probably; and with it you wouldn’t, unless he possessed the four former attractions.’

‘No, to be sure not: I should only pity him—hate him, perhaps, if he were ugly, and a clown.’

‘But there are several other handsome, rich young men in the world: handsomer, possibly, and richer than he is. What should hinder you from loving them?’

‘If there be any, they are out of my way: I’ve seen none like Edgar.’

‘You may see some; and he won’t always be handsome, and young, and may not always be rich.’

‘He is now; and I have only to do with the present. I wish you would speak rationally.’

Your stereotypical fat old white man and young Asian girl? Sometimes they're in love.

Sometimes we don't get a chance to make a choice before love takes us. Gotta be a 10 if you wanna get a 10? You should think a bit about what different people regard as a 10.

[Ladylethal 12]

The reason some jump to conclusions when they see these topics are due to the amount of couples we see here everyday asking for information on how to come to the US or how to bring their foreign SO to the US after 1 or 2 months together, after one weekend trip face to face, after 2 months of chats without ever seeing each other, after 2 weeks of meeting online, etc.

We hear enough people talking about using the 90 days for the K-1 visa to get to know each other, to decide whether or not to marry. And then all the fishy cases of people who came and within the month their spouses are suddenly monsters and how can they stay legally. I never see the foreign spouse come here asking if they can go home and divorce from there, or asking how they cancel their own petition and get a divorce to be able to return home without pending issues.

It starts getting hard to see past certain patterns, and easy to jump to conclusions, 'cus so often they are right. Immigrants get GC-itis and USCs get a syndrome called "I'm a God and will deport your sorry ####### 'cus you didn't satisfy me".

I think that's where most people come from when seeing these and why you'll see many of us urging new members starting the process to KNOW their SO. It's hard to give legal advice when you believe that person is just trying to use the system, just as we can't tell a person to come on a visitors visa and get married to skip the K-1 or CR1. So we also try and understand the nature of the relationships.

Some of us would rather be living in our countries and the US but we live here due to circumstances (my husband wanted to be macho and not be supported by his wife so he wanted us to start our lives here where he can support me, we both wanna live in my country in the future) but even then, others will always assume we're here for the GC, we're here 'cus America is supposed to be great.

I try to stay neutral when posting the legalities in certain threads but truth is: we do end up judging by the country the immigrant is from, by their time line and by the way they post. It's impossible not to be biased when we're all going through this.

Edited January 6, 2010 by Ladylethal

[Ricardo_C 4]

I don't disagree, LL. I can certainly think of a few cases that have made me immediately suspicious. Usually when older gentlemen start ranting and raving about women at home not being worth their time, and then go on about "importing" (what are they, cars?) a pretty young foreign wife "with no baggage" (i.e., someone who doesn't realize they have options). And yeah, those people creep me right out.

But the attitude some critics display goes beyond the usual red flags, and into pre-emptive judgement of any person or situation that doesn't conform to what they picture as "the right way". I have heard enough criticism of people for "marrying down" (actual quote) because they found love in a poor country. Or having their fiancees/spouses be deemed suspicious because they were once denied a tourist visa ("why would you consider marrying someone who's not even allowed into the country as a visitor?").

Some people have an easy time with their international marriage: Either they come from "safe" countries, or they were already in the US (as a student, say), and only had to deal with AOS. Great for them. Some people, whether by choice or circumstance, found their soulmate in a distant land that may not offer the "right" setting or conditions. Their personal circumstances may be wholly different. Age, race, class, they may all differ. Sometimes your heart doesn't give you a choice, and you couldn't care less about doing the "sensible" thing and finding yourself a partner locally. It's not an exact science, romance. I can't imagine being happy if I tried to choose a mate based on a checklist.

Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, and endless know-it-all lectures from armchair experts who are not lawyers but like to play one online, don't help anyone, except the wannabe experts themselves, who can pat themselves on the back and move on, secure in their knowledge of having set some poor misguided soul straight.