Are you using me for a greencard?

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

So what you're saying here is love is supposed to be blind? Men should look past anything because of love. You and I both know many of these men don't have a true concept of what love is when they meet and marry a woman. At first it's infatuation and lust then it either becomes love or it fizzles. If there is no compatibility then real love can't develop. How can it? Also, you have to see what's good for you. You can love someone deeply but they are no good for you. Look at what has happened to many of the women on this board. Same with the men. They can love their wife but in the long run the situation isn't good for them or their family so they must part ways. Love does not conquer all. Love only goes so far. Maybe I'm jaded but that's how I see it. I couldn't stay with someone simply because I "love" them. There has to be more.

Then I guess if their family could push them out of the relationship or the situation wasnt good for them, it wasnt love. Love would not allow that to happen.. Not real love anyway.

[Chica Yeyé 41]

I give up. If Kat wants to live in a world where her husband spits on her while pregnant and that's ok because of some warped conception of what love is, so be it.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

In before the lock!

Sometimes the outside parties have a bigger problem with the couple than the people involved.

Although I see both sides, and often wonder about some of the couples that are represented here, I also know this to be true because I know some folks wonder about my hubby and me because of our age difference. If someone comes on and asks for advice about fishy stuff that raises red flags, responders should be able to be honest with them, and sometimes that honesty is hurtful but correct. Sometimes, also, the advice just plain wrong, and that's up to the requestor to discern. We can only advise and move on. Kat, you need to move on, too. I know it's hard, but life is too short for repeatedly reliving the past.

I think talking about love and how it affects these relations is a very valid thing to discuss.

Is this advice or a question? Do you think that love is what has made your relationship endure?

I give up. If Kat wants to live in a world where her husband spits on her while pregnant and that's ok because of some warped conception of what love is, so be it.

I never said I thought I was loved. I questioned whether it was vital to others

[Sofiyya 1,687]

So what you're saying here is love is supposed to be blind? Men should look past anything because of love. You and I both know many of these men don't have a true concept of what love is when they meet and marry a woman. At first it's infatuation and lust then it either becomes love or it fizzles. If there is no compatibility then real love can't develop. How can it? Also, you have to see what's good for you. You can love someone deeply but they are no good for you. Look at what has happened to many of the women on this board. Same with the men. They can love their wife but in the long run the situation isn't good for them or their family so they must part ways. Love does not conquer all. Love only goes so far. Maybe I'm jaded but that's how I see it. I couldn't stay with someone simply because I "love" them. There has to be more.

Then I guess if their family could push them out of the relationship or the situation wasnt good for them, it wasnt love. Love would not allow that to happen.. Not real love anyway.

Kat, with all due respect, we realized a looooong time ago that you have no idea what real love is. Love begins with loving yourself, and that doesn't permit you to do to yourself what you allowed to happen to you. Self-love tells you when to stop loving when it's no longer worth it.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Proverbs 30:18-19 : There are three things that amaze me— no, four things that I don’t understand: how an eagle glides through the sky, how a snake slithers on a rock, how a ship navigates the ocean, how a man loves a woman.

1 Corinthians 13:1-8a and 13 : If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love never fails....And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Proverbs 30:18-19 : There are three things that amaze me— no, four things that I don’t understand: how an eagle glides through the sky, how a snake slithers on a rock, how a ship navigates the ocean, how a man loves a woman.

1 Corinthians 13:1-8a and 13 : If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love never fails....And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

I again think love is the real glue that prevents fraud and abuse. If someone really loves you, they never do these things to you...

I think its more important than age, class or any other reason. I believe in true love and that it does exist and some of the people on the boards have it and thats why things are working out. I think if you dont have it..pretty much hang it up

[Sofiyya 1,687]

But, not everyone loves the same way or sees love the same way. Some people even use love to manipulate. There is no one concept of love. Each of us need to feel loved in our own way. Love is whatever you want it to be, and, because of that, it can fulfilling, or it can be toxic.

Proverbs 30:18-19 : There are three things that amaze me— no, four things that I don’t understand: how an eagle glides through the sky, how a snake slithers on a rock, how a ship navigates the ocean, how a man loves a woman.

1 Corinthians 13:1-8a and 13 : If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love never fails....And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

I again think love is the real glue that prevents fraud and abuse. If someone really loves you, they never do these things to you...

I think its more important than age, class or any other reason. I believe in true love and that it does exist and some of the people on the boards have it and thats why things are working out. I think if you dont have it..pretty much hang it up

[Jenn! 918]

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

But, not everyone loves the same way or sees love the same way. Some people even use love to manipulate. There is no one concept of love. Each of us need to feel loved in our own way. Love is whatever you want it to be, and, because of that, it can fulfilling, or it can be toxic.

Proverbs 30:18-19 : There are three things that amaze me— no, four things that I don’t understand: how an eagle glides through the sky, how a snake slithers on a rock, how a ship navigates the ocean, how a man loves a woman.

1 Corinthians 13:1-8a and 13 : If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Love never fails....And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

I again think love is the real glue that prevents fraud and abuse. If someone really loves you, they never do these things to you...

I think its more important than age, class or any other reason. I believe in true love and that it does exist and some of the people on the boards have it and thats why things are working out. I think if you dont have it..pretty much hang it up

Again, I think love is more important than any outside factor. I think if the intending immigrant loves the American, everything else can be worked on.

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

I think love can prevent alot of fraud. I wish there was a test to see if the spouse loves the American truly before they get here...like a lie detector test.hehehehhe

I love that song...

[Sofiyya 1,687]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

[NArocks 13]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

Exactly, I see here in this thread you trying to rationalize your factors and imposing this on others. It did not work out move on. Love is a great factor but there is more to ANY realtionship than love.

If Kat wants to live in a world where her husband spits on her while pregnant

If this truley happened then you must not love yourself very much to allow ANYONE to SPIT on you........

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

No I did not. I did not see alot of things coming and excused alot as culture

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

Exactly, I see here in this thread you trying to rationalize your factors and imposing this on others. It did not work out move on. Love is a great factor but there is more to ANY realtionship than love.

If Kat wants to live in a world where her husband spits on her while pregnant

If this truley happened then you must not love yourself very much to allow ANYONE to SPIT on you........

That happened after he arrived not while we were waiting. I honestly think if love was the biggest litmus test, alot of the problems could be prevented. I think if the love was never there, then thats why people get used. It seems like a very simple thing to say but so much is blamed on age,weight and other things when I think the underlying predictor is love... When you first meet someone thats going to need you for something, they dont start out bad.. that develops. I think love is the biggest indicator of whats going to happen during the process and after they get here.

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

I am not the only one here thats experienced this. There are 2 active posters at the minimum who recently divorced and many more that dont post. Looking back, it makes you wonder if they questioned whether they were ever loved by their spouses

[Sofiyya 1,687]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

No I did not. I did not see alot of things coming and excused alot as culture

Ok, I'm going to remember what you're still in denial about, and as long as you won't own your behavior, you'll do it again. You did see the the bad things coming, and you told us you saw them coming. They were huge, red flags and you waved them in front of you. What we could not understand is why you just wouldn't get out of the way.

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

Exactly, I see here in this thread you trying to rationalize your factors and imposing this on others. It did not work out move on. Love is a great factor but there is more to ANY realtionship than love.

If Kat wants to live in a world where her husband spits on her while pregnant

If this truley happened then you must not love yourself very much to allow ANYONE to SPIT on you........

That happened after he arrived not while we were waiting. I honestly think if love was the biggest litmus test, alot of the problems could be prevented. I think if the love was never there, then thats why people get used. It seems like a very simple thing to say but so much is blamed on age,weight and other things when I think the underlying predictor is love... When you first meet someone thats going to need you for something, they dont start out bad.. that develops. I think love is the biggest indicator of whats going to happen during the process and after they get here.

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

I am not the only one here thats experienced this. There are 2 active posters at the minimum who recently divorced and many more that dont post. Looking back, it makes you wonder if they questioned whether they were ever loved by their spouses

True, but you're here and they're not. Is this thread a call for help, or not?

Edited December 11, 2009 by Sofiyya

[HannahP 119]

It tiresome to read and watch some of these Americans blaming themselves entirely when the person they were involved with never loved them to begin with.

You've been there. Did you realize it then?

No I did not. I did not see alot of things coming and excused alot as culture

Ok, I'm going to remember what you're still in denial about, and as long as you won't own your behavior, you'll do it again. You did see the the bad things coming, and you told us you saw them coming. They were huge, red flags and you waved them in front of you. What we could not understand is why you just wouldn't get out of the way.

Ahh, but people who get into abusive relationships tend to fall into them time and time again. History repeats itself, despite the fact that the woman may be in denial of everything.