unbelievable

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I guess I just don't see anything wrong with the ladies in ME/NA posting whatever interests them, even if it's to complain about what they see as a negatively biased film about Islam (of course, as long as they are abiding by the website's rules of conduct.) Trolls are everywhere. So what ? Should that mean sensible people ought to be quiet, so that only trolls can be heard ? I just don't get your point.

The vast majority of the members on VJ are rather intelligent, sensible, reasonable, unbigoted people with fairly open minds. We are writing for them (as well as for ourselves.) Let the few nutjobs do as they will -- it's a free country. We can ignore them, or have a little fun at their expense.

Meanwhile, I think we will continue to post whatever we like, and continue to interact with the far greater number of genuinely nice people that abound on this website.

[tmma 467]

There is certainly certain individuals on BOTH sides in this ( ME/NA) forum and the person in in O/T that seem to go out of their way to "stumble across" links in other ( non-vj) sites, that they KNOW will cause upset.

.....After all...Wasn't the clusterfluff that " will never be mentioned" kicked off by a hot link posted with the message " be glad you did not see this", yet the link was posted here for all to click on and get upset at the prejudice and hate spewed on that site?

How many threads in O/T have been locked due to the debate getting way out of hand-the posts are there for the reactions they get....The people posting them want the reaction.

You all know all the crud that's out there-for everyone, regardless of religion or whatever-but to deliberatly find something and then post it is asking in a way for the reaction you get on here...( and I mean this for both here and whatever gets posted by the other person in O/T).

I understand there IS prejudice- there really is, for everyone in one way or another....Is it right or fair? NO, of course not...

But to go looking for stuff that will be upsetting to yourself or others seems to me to be just voluntarily adding to it all, and adding to the feelings of having to defend what should really need no defending. Religion is more than just a label, it's a way of life, and if we could all just be happy here on VJ with who we are reagrdless of religion; I honestly think alot of the drama incited on O/T ( which is obviously posted for the reactionary value too) would cease.

[dollface41601 0]

MK.....I agree i absolutely do not think people should stop posting, or voicing their opinion, but my point is, when a random person stops into the topic and voices theirs, why bash them??? Not everyone is muslim, not everyone agrees with Islam........so why hate on them for disagreeing

[Fandango 1,439]

There is certainly certain individuals on BOTH sides in this ( ME/NA) forum and the person in in O/T that seem to go out of their way to "stumble across" links in other ( non-vj) sites, that they KNOW will cause upset.

.....After all...Wasn't the clusterfluff that " will never be mentioned" kicked off by a hot link posted with the message " be glad you did not see this", yet the link was posted here for all to click on and get upset at the prejudice and hate spewed on that site?

How many threads in O/T have been locked due to the debate getting way out of hand-the posts are there for the reactions they get....The people posting them want the reaction.

You all know all the crud that's out there-for everyone, regardless of religion or whatever-but to deliberatly find something and then post it is asking in a way for the reaction you get on here...( and I mean this for both here and whatever gets posted by the other person in O/T).

I understand there IS prejudice- there really is, for everyone in one way or another....Is it right or fair? NO, of course not...

But to go looking for stuff that will be upsetting to yourself or others seems to me to be just voluntarily adding to it all, and adding to the feelings of having to defend what should really need no defending. Religion is more than just a label, it's a way of life, and if we could all just be happy here on VJ with who we are reagrdless of religion; I honestly think alot of the drama incited on O/T ( which is obviously posted for the reactionary value too) would cease.

Agreed!

And why the hotlinking continues....I have no clue....one would think it would stop...

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Maybe I missed something here. I saw meow meow and then some others said scat. So it seems to me that the "bashing" came from the "random person."

Anyway, choosing one's battles wisely is always good advice. Trolls are really not worth the effort of any actual debate, but are better dealt with by a well-aimed, one-line zinger, or by one of those entertaining forum pics

[tmma 467]

I mean we are an international community here composed of people from all nations and religions...One would think we would be the "Poster Children" for tolerance.

We are all different, from different places and different religions, but we all share a common goal- I think that in itself should be a factor that ties rather than divides....

[chiquita 0]

If it helps your whinning, go for it call me a hater.

its a TROLL...

ignore it..

DITTO DITTO DITTO

Ignore those who want to flame! Don't give them any attention. That is what they want!!

Do not respond to their remarks at all. Don't let them get under your skin.

IGGY TO THE KITTY.

Now about the film. I don't think the truth can ever come out about real Muslims. One has to know the difference between true Islam and the Islam that is in the media.

My husband is a real Muslim and he does not advocate violence in a way. I am not Muslim but I am learning about it. I am so shocked to see it is nothing like we read about in the media. Of course we should all know that the media wants and likes the shock value ie sensationalism so I am not surprised at all by this. I have been a victim of this sensationalism by the media myself a long time ago. Needless to say it was a wake up call for me.

chi

[sarachid 0]

MK.....I agree i absolutely do not think people should stop posting, or voicing their opinion, but my point is, when a random person stops into the topic and voices theirs, why bash them??? Not everyone is muslim, not everyone agrees with Islam........so why hate on them for disagreeing

"so why hate on them for disagreeing"

interesting choice of words-I don't think that is what they are doing at all.... (and to quote you again) "all you muslim women"

I have found no hate from from """all the muslim women""" here....

sarah

[tnh9479 1]

Agreed!

And why the hotlinking continues....I have no clue

Ok...I am stepping in here. Are there a set of rules for the ME/NA forum that I have been unaware of? Give me a break.

I have read a lot recently and have not posted. However, all of this just goes beyond and is why I rarely post any more. This is a general discussion forum. If Rebecca wants people in this forum to be aware of a movie that she thinks propagates discrimination that OUR loved ones do feel EVERY DAY living here in the US, then by all means I am happy she is making us aware. And I know what is coming next...we all see it every day on VJ...our loved ones knew what they were getting into. To be honest, I don't really think they did. My husband every day is surprised by the lack of freedoms he hears about or the blatant discrimination that goes on. I think almost all of us just want to spread tolerance, understanding, and peace.

Twila

[morocco4ever 63]

JP....That couldnt have been worded better....I dont want to cross any lines here, but to all you muslim women, I think you all bring this upon yourself, with all my respect, You know how half of the world views islam, and unfortunately, many people on VJ view it in a negative aspect....so WHY add fuel to the fire????? The ME/NA forum is not limited to only the opinions of muslims, it is a free internet forum, where thousands of christians, jews, protestants, hindus, and even atheists come everyday, You cant expect everyone to agree with you can you? Thats not how the world works...No disrespect to you ladies or your religion, but JP is right.....do us christians come on here posting things about abortion rights, etc? NO, and only because we know it would cause a HUGE war......Visa journey, is an immigration site, yes there is time for Off topic, but most try to keep it an off topic that will not cause bashing or war....Maybe keep the debateable topics to instant messages or the yahoo group....Everyone moanes and groans when someone voices their opinion,yet, you must know by now, it is ALWAYS going to happen....

Edited to add....I mean no disrespect to any of you or your religion

I think what is upsetting people here is that prejudice is illegal in the US. It doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but illegal none the less. Hate crimes, unfair hiring practice, harrassment, it just gets to be too much, and it is hard for us to sit by and watch it happen and not say anything. I don't think this thread got out of hand really, the woman spoke her opinion and we pretty much mostly just laughed it off. The topic itself is sad though. What if they had a film about old people, fat people, women, blacks, or disabled? Prejudices run there as well, and no matter what it is going to set off some time bombs. We pick and chose our battles, and if fighting prejudice is a persons passion then so be it. There will be some heated debates, eventually the string ends and we move on.

To be honest what I have read here is mild compared to a chat room I went into on paltalk that was a discussion between Muslims and Christians. I guess I was naive because I just said "can't we all be a little kinder to each other" and with that comment I was bashed by guess who....the Christians. Interesting...I grew up Christian and I remember being taught that this kind of behavior is un Christ like and unaccepable as Christians. I have come to realize that some people use religion not because they truly believe in their religion, rather they enjoy the war and the drama and they chose religion to be the scape goat for their anger.

Its sad isn't it what this world has come to, thank goodness we have found a site where we can meet and discuss these things, and even whine when we need to, and know that we have friends here that will pick us up and make us feel better again.

Thanks to all my ME/NA friends...your the best!

[Fandango 1,439]

Agreed!

And why the hotlinking continues....I have no clue

Ok...I am stepping in here. Are there a set of rules for the ME/NA forum that I have been unaware of? Give me a break.

I have read a lot recently and have not posted. However, all of this just goes beyond and is why I rarely post any more. This is a general discussion forum. If Rebecca wants people in this forum to be aware of a movie that she thinks propagates discrimination that OUR loved ones do feel EVERY DAY living here in the US, then by all means I am happy she is making us aware. And I know what is coming next...we all see it every day on VJ...our loved ones knew what they were getting into. To be honest, I don't really think they did. My husband every day is surprised by the lack of freedoms he hears about or the blatant discrimination that goes on. I think almost all of us just want to spread tolerance, understanding, and peace.

Twila

Well, Twila, before you 'step in here' let me just say that if you have any clue to what we're alluding to, you'd be curious yourself as to why summat that opened up our site...specifically this forum...to outside hate....would continue. So while there are no 'official' rules per se to my knowledge on hotlinking.....I feel hotlinking (considering the LAST debacle)...especially hotlinking to summat that is hateful...opens this site up to unwanted attn. And someone who's preaching hate & whatnot on a site can SEE that it's been hotlinked (from what I'm told) and give them a direct heads up straight here. Do YOU think it's wise?

I can't blame you if you don't know what we're talking about here...but if you knew, you'd prolly be against the hotlinking too. It caused a lot of hurt & embarrassment to many ppl here & I don't think we should be looking to play with fire again. I'm not looking to pee in anyone's cornflakes, so you can put your defenses down.... we're all in the same boat here as far as what brought us here. I choose to look at common ground rather than focusing on what makes us different. I am just interested in trying to protect this site as much as poss...as should every other member here.

kthxbye

[Ban Hammer 13,283]

And someone who's preaching hate & whatnot on a site can SEE that it's been hotlinked (from what I'm told) and give them a direct heads up straight here. Do YOU think it's wise?

they can

[Bosco 1]

Well, Twila, before you 'step in here' let me just say that if you have any clue to what we're alluding to, you'd be curious yourself as to why summat that opened up our site...specifically this forum...to outside hate....would continue.

kthxbye

Twila completely has a "clue". She was singled out by the unmentionable pink elephant.

Rebecca

[tnh9479 1]

Agreed!

And why the hotlinking continues....I have no clue

Ok...I am stepping in here. Are there a set of rules for the ME/NA forum that I have been unaware of? Give me a break.

I have read a lot recently and have not posted. However, all of this just goes beyond and is why I rarely post any more. This is a general discussion forum. If Rebecca wants people in this forum to be aware of a movie that she thinks propagates discrimination that OUR loved ones do feel EVERY DAY living here in the US, then by all means I am happy she is making us aware. And I know what is coming next...we all see it every day on VJ...our loved ones knew what they were getting into. To be honest, I don't really think they did. My husband every day is surprised by the lack of freedoms he hears about or the blatant discrimination that goes on. I think almost all of us just want to spread tolerance, understanding, and peace.

Twila

Well, Twila, before you 'step in here' let me just say that if you have any clue to what we're alluding to, you'd be curious yourself as to why summat that opened up our site...specifically this forum...to outside hate....would continue. So while there are no 'official' rules per se to my knowledge on hotlinking.....I feel hotlinking (considering the LAST debacle)...especially hotlinking to summat that is hateful...opens this site up to unwanted attn. And someone who's preaching hate & whatnot on a site can SEE that it's been hotlinked (from what I'm told) and give them a direct heads up straight here. Do YOU think it's wise?

I can't blame you if you don't know what we're talking about here...but if you knew, you'd prolly be against the hotlinking too. It caused a lot of hurt & embarrassment to many ppl here & I don't think we should be looking to play with fire again. I'm not looking to pee in anyone's cornflakes, so you can put your defenses down.... we're all in the same boat here as far as what brought us here. I choose to look at common ground rather than focusing on what makes us different. I am just interested in trying to protect this site as much as poss...as should every other member here.

kthxbye

I know a lot more than you think. I was one of the people focused on by that site. I don't blame the person who linked to the site. I blame the hatred of the person who runs that site. It is amazing how religion can bring out the absolute best and the absolute worst of people -- regardless of whether they are Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Shinto, Wiccan, so on. I think being aware of what is out there is to be armed.

Twila

[jordanianprincess 0]

Ok I think the point was greatly missed. THis is not about what subjects a person can talk about. This is not about rules on VJ. This is turning into something it was not meant to be.

Let's get one thing straight.

Christians get bashed by people of other religions. Muslims get bashed by people of other religions. Jews get bashed by people of other religions. Hate sees no boundries.

Jean - When you watch the show Carlos Mencia and he is making fun of Arabs and Muslims, why do you get offended? He also makes fun of Asians, Mexicans, Jews, Christians. and everything else under the sun. His show is not created to make fun of Islam, he makes fun of everyone.

THe point that is being missed here is that you can't make everyone believe that Islam is a good thing, the same way I can't make everyone believe Christianity is. Is there anything you can say to defend the actions of Osama Bin Laden? Is there anything I can say to defend the actions of Jim Jones? NO. Not all Muslims are the same, not all Christians are the same. My point is, that the actions of some Muslims don't represent the beliefs of all of them.

I think what Kelly meant with her post, and there is no need to stick to the words "to all you muslim women" because she didn't mean it in a disrespectful way. She meant that if you are gonna post on a public, and you are posting on a hot topic, among people that can't wait to stir it up, then don't be surprised to get "hate mail". Ignore it! Ignore them! There will always be ignorant people in the world and there is no need to sink to their level.

Muslims in the usa are just as much a target as any other minority. Everyone in the usa is a target now. The difference is that there is a great deal of Interest in the media about Islam now because of current events.

I AM arab. I see people make fun of arabs all the time and you know what I do, I laugh. I laugh because when they make fun of everything other kind of racial joke or generalization I laugh.

About your husbands living here and worrying about the hate they will get? They are not the first nor the last arabs to come to the USA. They will be just fine. I know its hard not to mother them, but they don't need that. Let them make their way. After all, you saw his charming ways and fell in love with him, so others will too.

DISCLAIMER: PLEASE DON'T TAKE OUT ONE PHRASE AND FOCUS ON IT, THERE IS NO NEED TO BE THAT PETTY. MY COMMENTS WERE WRITTEN TO BE TAKEN AS A WHOLE. IF YOU TAKE ONE PART OUT AND FOCUS ON IT, YOU WILL NOT GET THE MEANING OF WHAT I WROTE OR MEANT.