SUNDAY ...Hmm Wish you one with good news:)

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I am slowly going insane. I watched Road to Guantanamo (excellent film, I highly recommend it) and Behind Enemy Lines yesterday. Then, while flipping channels trying to find something decent to watch while I ate breakfast this morning, I stumbled upon an infomercial aimed at certain segments of conservative american society begging them to give $350 to "rescue" a russian jew and move them to Israel. Yaay, let's displace some more palestinians ay?

With this and the news, it's a wonder I'm not back in bed hiding under the sheets. The world is a scary place.

Grrrrrrr dispensationalists make me so crazyyyyy. I wish all these wacked out Jesus Freaks (no offense to anyone except the nutjobs) would pick their butts up and just move to Israel or the West Bank -- then they can experience first-hand the wonderful joy of being a Christian in the Holy Land -- getting spit on and beaten and worse by Zionist zealots. Godddddddddddd if they only knew what their "beneficiaries" really think of them....

[Bosco 1]

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

I am slowly going insane. I watched Road to Guantanamo (excellent film, I highly recommend it) and Behind Enemy Lines yesterday. Then, while flipping channels trying to find something decent to watch while I ate breakfast this morning, I stumbled upon an infomercial aimed at certain segments of conservative american society begging them to give $350 to "rescue" a russian jew and move them to Israel. Yaay, let's displace some more palestinians ay?

With this and the news, it's a wonder I'm not back in bed hiding under the sheets. The world is a scary place.

[iceyspots 0]

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

There are many, many more desperate people who suddenly and conveniently discovered their "Jewishness" when they saw a free ride out of a miserable existence -- Russians, Ethiopians, Indians, even Peruvians. The Chief Rabbinate has already expressed its concerns over this issue. But I guess an imported fake Jew is preferable to a genuine native Palestinian, at least in the eyes of the Israeli government.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

You are correct -- Judaism does not welcome converts; in fact, rabbis are supposed to do everything possible to try to talk gentiles out of the idea of converting. They have a few converts, but it is strongly discouraged.

But if you claim descent from Jewish ancestors (even if unsupportable by evidence) you are often not considered a "convert," but a member of the tribe.

[Bosco 1]

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

My husband talked about this same motivation. The sad thing is most find they are not truly integrated to society as they expected.

BTW MK - so much of the news is now focused solely on Lebanon. Can you recommend any online sources that are reporting what is happening with the Palestinians now, especially in Gaza? The news is barely reporting the scores being killed daily in Iraq now too.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

The Falush Mura have Jewish ancestry but converted to Christianity (and some later Islam). Many are going back to their Jewish roots (or "discovering" Jewish roots) so they can relocate to Israel.

Rebecca

Edited July 23, 2006 by Bosco

[iceyspots 0]

Sad world...

Oh well..

I'M going to the gym, i'll be back later

[tmma 467]

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

There are many, many more desperate people who suddenly and conveniently discovered their "Jewishness" when they saw a free ride out of a miserable existence -- Russians, Ethiopians, Indians, even Peruvians. The Chief Rabbinate has already expressed its concerns over this issue. But I guess an imported fake Jew is preferable to a genuine native Palestinian, at least in the eyes of the Israeli government.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

You are correct -- Judaism does not welcome converts; in fact, rabbis are supposed to do everything possible to try to talk gentiles out of the idea of converting. They have a few converts, but it is strongly discouraged.

But if you claim descent from Jewish ancestors (even if unsupportable by evidence) you are often not considered a "convert," but a member of the tribe.

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

There are many, many more desperate people who suddenly and conveniently discovered their "Jewishness" when they saw a free ride out of a miserable existence -- Russians, Ethiopians, Indians, even Peruvians. The Chief Rabbinate has already expressed its concerns over this issue. But I guess an imported fake Jew is preferable to a genuine native Palestinian, at least in the eyes of the Israeli government.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

You are correct -- Judaism does not welcome converts; in fact, rabbis are supposed to do everything possible to try to talk gentiles out of the idea of converting. They have a few converts, but it is strongly discouraged.

But if you claim descent from Jewish ancestors (even if unsupportable by evidence) you are often not considered a "convert," but a member of the tribe.

Would you cite your sources on this ( 2nd bolded area, please)

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Islam falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

Can I take offense at what you are writing too? Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others. Please show the respect you expect from others.

have a nice day.

Edited July 23, 2006 by tmma

[tmma 467]

***should read

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Judaism falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

Sorry for the mix up there!

[noura 0]

Would you cite your sources on this ( 2nd bolded area, please)

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Islam falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

they didn't state ppl were converting to Islam falsely, but that they were converting to Judaism to get to Israel

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

Can I take offense at what you are writing too? Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others. Please show the respect you expect from others.

have a nice day.

this seems rather harsh... just my perspective - and have a nice day also... that should smooth things over

Noura

Edited July 23, 2006 by noura

[sarah and hicham 3]

Actually I do wonder how everyone here would react if the same post was made about Muslims....

I think we know how it would end.

Be careful,

Sarah

[tmma 467]

Would you cite your sources on this ( 2nd bolded area, please)

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Islam falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

they didn't state ppl were converting to Islam falsely, but that they were converting to Judaism to get to Israel

And I corrected that....

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

Can I take offense at what you are writing too? Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others. Please show the respect you expect from others.

have a nice day.

this seems rather harsh... just my perspective - and have a nice day also... that should smooth things over

Noura

[Bosco 1]

How do you feel this thread has perpetuates bigotry against Judaism? I am not trying to stir up anything, I really want to understand what is behind your perception. You can take offense to anything you read but if you wouldn't mind being more specific as to what statements you find bigoted. You said "you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others". Please elaborate on the insults.

Again, I am really trying to understand your point of view as I see this as a discussion of immigration and the promotion of immigration to Israel, and questioning why some people may be motivated to do so.

Rebecca

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

There are many, many more desperate people who suddenly and conveniently discovered their "Jewishness" when they saw a free ride out of a miserable existence -- Russians, Ethiopians, Indians, even Peruvians. The Chief Rabbinate has already expressed its concerns over this issue. But I guess an imported fake Jew is preferable to a genuine native Palestinian, at least in the eyes of the Israeli government.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

You are correct -- Judaism does not welcome converts; in fact, rabbis are supposed to do everything possible to try to talk gentiles out of the idea of converting. They have a few converts, but it is strongly discouraged.

But if you claim descent from Jewish ancestors (even if unsupportable by evidence) you are often not considered a "convert," but a member of the tribe.

Isn't it maddening? My husband was talking just this morning about all the Falash Mura Ethiopians reverting to Judaism so they can go to Israel (the number they plan on allowing in is over 20.000).

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

LOL my husband knows an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel. He told him "Please don't tell anyone, but my name is really Abdullah. I am Muslim. But there is no food in my country. The Israelis offered to bring all the Jews, so I told them I am Jewish because I want to eat. Please don't tell anyone my secret."

There are many, many more desperate people who suddenly and conveniently discovered their "Jewishness" when they saw a free ride out of a miserable existence -- Russians, Ethiopians, Indians, even Peruvians. The Chief Rabbinate has already expressed its concerns over this issue. But I guess an imported fake Jew is preferable to a genuine native Palestinian, at least in the eyes of the Israeli government.

That's strange, I heard Judaism isn't very welcoming to converts. Supposedly like.. if a non-Jewish man wants to marry a Jewish woman.. he will have to ask the rabbi if he will allow him to convert on 3 separate occassions before the rabbi will accept.. correct me if i'm wrong, though.

You are correct -- Judaism does not welcome converts; in fact, rabbis are supposed to do everything possible to try to talk gentiles out of the idea of converting. They have a few converts, but it is strongly discouraged.

But if you claim descent from Jewish ancestors (even if unsupportable by evidence) you are often not considered a "convert," but a member of the tribe.

Would you cite your sources on this ( 2nd bolded area, please)

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Islam falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

Can I take offense at what you are writing too? Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others. Please show the respect you expect from others.

have a nice day.

What post Sarah? Again, I am not trying to stir anything up but if what post was made about Muslims. I feel like I am missing someone. If someone posted that someone possibly converted to Islam out of self preservation, I would not take offense. Can you be specific about what is at issue here because I am missing it.

Rebecca

Actually I do wonder how everyone here would react if the same post was made about Muslims....

I think we know how it would end.

Be careful,

Sarah

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

Would you cite your sources on this ( 2nd bolded area, please)

Also isn't it contradicting the previous quote above about people converting to Islam falsly to get to Isreal? They seem to be successful in their conversion?

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

Can I take offense at what you are writing too? Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others. Please show the respect you expect from others.

have a nice day.

You could easily Google info about Judaism's official attitudes toward conversion yourself, if you really wanted to know. I mean it's not like some kind of secret. But here are just a few sources:

http://moshiach.com/discover/index.php?pag...;id=182&c=8

http://www.jewfaq.org/gentiles.htm#Conversion

http://www.chabad.org/library/article.asp?AID=248165

http://www.somethingjewish.co.uk/articles/...conversion_.htm

Conservative and Orthodox Jews frown on conversion more than Reform Jews.

Regarding the story of this particular Ethiopian immigrant -- you need to read it again, this time more carefully. To recap: He was not a "convert" to Judaism. He merely claimed to be Jewish in order to immigrate to Israel, and admitted this. My husband walked in unexpectedly and found him praying, and when the man realized that he'd been discovered, he acknowledged that he was actually Muslim. So he wasn't "successful in his conversion" at all, but rather, "successful in his deception."

As far as your other assumptions.... they are simply that: assumptions, and rather ill-conceived ones.

Of course you are always allowed to take offense at anything you like. You're also perfectly free to misread all sorts of things that aren't actually there, and get in a huff over nothing.

[Ban Hammer 13,508]

Also, it really seems to me that you are perpetrating exactly the same kind of bigotry you yourselves complain of being victims of.

As far as your other assumptions.... they are simply that: assumptions, and rather ill-conceived ones.

Of course you are always allowed to take offense at anything you like. You're also perfectly free to misread all sorts of things that aren't actually there, and get in a huff over nothing.

it would seem tmma has a point"

I stumbled upon an infomercial aimed at certain segments of conservative american society begging them to give $350 to "rescue" a russian jew and move them to Israel. Yaay, let's displace some more palestinians ay?

Grrrrrrr dispensationalists make me so crazyyyyy. I wish all these wacked out Jesus Freaks (no offense to anyone except the nutjobs) would pick their butts up and just move to Israel or the West Bank

The infomercial reminds me of the stories my mom's best friend used to tell me. She grew up in NYC and remembers when there were jars/cans going around at school and elsewhere to raise money so Jews could move to Israel.

Rebecca

Or ( being a non-ME/NA forum regular-am I not allowed?), I have seen the way non-regs on this forum are treated.......I think this thread is instigating hate against Judaism; and I take offense, just as you ladies do when you feel disrespect is shown to your religion ( wether you are born to it or adopted it)....I really feel you are so wrapped up in your victim mentality about being muslim, you fail to see the insults you cast out at others.

amen to that tmma

and for the record, i'm not jewish

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

BTW MK - so much of the news is now focused solely on Lebanon. Can you recommend any online sources that are reporting what is happening with the Palestinians now, especially in Gaza? The news is barely reporting the scores being killed daily in Iraq now too.

Rebecca

Well you have to search around for it. I check a lot of different sources online every day -- including Associated Press, Reuters, Electronic Intifada, Ha'aretz, the Jerusalem Post, Yahoo News, MSN, CNN, British papers like the Guardian and the Telegraph, and of course al Jazeera I'm also linked up to the wire services... guess I'm a news junkie. And we talk to my husband's family and many of our friends there in Palestine just about every day, so we get the latest from them also.

-MK