Minarets are now constitutionally banned in Switzerland

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I have a very good point. Are you aware that the 1st Amendment wasn't adopted until 1951?

I'm referring to Native Americans being forced by Christians to become like Whites and to accept Christianity. Not much tolerance was shown by them. The so-called tolerant Swiss rejected minarets on the basis of the same kind of intolerance you point fingers at Egypt and the KSA for; they are seeking to minimize an alien influence. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, O ye intolerant ones.

Really? I thought the 1st Amendment was ratified as part of the Bill of Rights in 1787. You've got a lot of explaining to do.

How did the Whites force conversions on the Indians? Did they use the same methods used to spread Islam on a far larger scale? Neither of us can change history but the usual knee jerk defense doesn't foster much understanding. I somehow doubt I'd get much of a chance to openly criticize Islam in a MENA country the way you're free to critique Christianity here. Feel free to do so and practice your religion.

If don't know why your many Islamic nations legally enforce restrictions on other religions you've got a very weak case for complaining about intolerance in the largely secular Western nations.

Look at the numbers of mosques in the U.S. at around 1,500 and compare that to the MENA countries and there's simply nothing comparable.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I have a very good point. Are you aware that the 1st Amendment wasn't adopted until 1951?

I'm referring to Native Americans being forced by Christians to become like Whites and to accept Christianity. Not much tolerance was shown by them. The so-called tolerant Swiss rejected minarets on the basis of the same kind of intolerance you point fingers at Egypt and the KSA for; they are seeking to minimize an alien influence. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, O ye intolerant ones.

Really? I thought the 1st Amendment was ratified as part of the Bill of Rights in 1787. You've got a lot of explaining to do.

How did the Whites force conversions on the Indians? Did they use the same methods used to spread Islam on a far larger scale? Neither of us can change history but the usual knee jerk defense doesn't foster much understanding. I somehow doubt I'd get much of a chance to openly criticize Islam in a MENA country the way you're free to critique Christianity here. Feel free to do so and practice your religion.

If don't know why your many Islamic nations legally enforce restrictions on other religions you've got a very weak case for complaining about intolerance in the largely secular Western nations.

Look at the numbers of mosques in the U.S. at around 1,500 and compare that to the MENA countries and there's simply nothing comparable.

I don't have that much explaining to do. I was thinking one thing and posting about another and posted the wrong date. Still, I'm not sure how that makes your point, as your first reaction was as knee-jerk a you accused me of being. And, there was no complaint, just a statement of fact. Are you denying the history of this country did not include forced, bloody conversion of Native Americans to Christianity? In that case, it's clear that you have no idea about world history either, spouting that old canard about Islam being spread by the sword. When your idiot popes were proclaiming war on Jews and Muslims, it was the Muslims who took in the Jews to save them. Open a history book, not just some hateful website, for a change.

If you have doubts about what you can do in any one of the 23 predominately Muslim countries (which are not mine, btw), then you should go to some of them and see for yourself. There are churches and even synagogues in the Muslim world. Don't think that the entire Muslim community is defined by the KSA, coz that's just ignorant. BTW, I have been all over and criticized Muslim practices for a living for 20 years. I'm still free and alive. If I go to Great Britain, on the other hand, and criticise Islam, I could go to jail for not being PC.

Dunno how this got double posted

Edited November 30, 2009 by Sofiyya

[Heracles 417]

Yes because Islam has no history of forced conversion do they? Ottoman Empire was extremely peaceful I gather.

Switzerland like most other first world countries does not have anything goes first amendment. You go to their country, you play by their rules. Same way when I go to Muslim countries I play by their rules or end up arrested and possibly beaten to death.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Booyah!

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Yes because Islam has no history of forced conversion do they?

Switzerland like most other first world countries does not have anything goes first amendment. You go to their country, you play by their rules. Same way when I go to Muslim countries I play by their rules or end up arrested and possibly beaten to death.

Christianity has no history of forced conversion, does it?

No one is ever arrested and beaten to death in the west. No, that doesn't happen.

The interesting thing is this thread is about religious intolerance in Switzerland, not the ME. Has that been forgotten? It certainly is being conveniently ignored.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Sofiyya

[Heracles 417]

Christianity has no history of forced conversion, does it?

Compared to the atrocities of the Ottoman empire, Christians were boy scouts.

Armenian genocide is a good start.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Booyah!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

... this thread is about religious intolerance in Switzerland ...

Alternatively, this thread is about the Swiss people enacting strict architectural standards in their nation

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Christianity has no history of forced conversion, does it?

Compared to the atrocities of the Ottoman empire, Christians were boy scouts.

Armenian genocide is a good start.

If that's all you got, you ain't got much. Christianity is the most widespread religion in the world due to the violence Christians did in God's name during their conquests in the New World. Conversions were forced on African slaves, Natives and Australian aborigines, not to mention Southern Africans. The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

... this thread is about religious intolerance in Switzerland ...

Alternatively, this thread is about the Swiss people enacting strict architectural standards in their nation

Was I arguing against that before Islam was (predictably) attacked by a few Ku Klux Klanners? No.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

It's not 'violence' when the victims weren't even considered entirely human.

Was I arguing against that before Islam was (predictably) attacked by a few Ku Klux Klanners? No.

So you have no problem with the Swiss ban on minarets.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

It's not 'violence' when the victims weren't even considered entirely human.

Was I arguing against that before Islam was (predictably) attacked by a few Ku Klux Klanners? No.

So you have no problem with the Swiss ban on minarets.

What did I already say about it?

The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

It's not 'violence' when the victims weren't even considered entirely human.

Then, as now, it seems.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

So you have no problem with the Swiss ban on minarets.

What did I already say about it?

I have no idea.

Ignorance abounds and is still legal. Minarets are merely an architectural appendage to masjids. Few masjids even use them anymore for the call to prayer. They have nothing to do with ideology.

[Heracles 417]

If that's all you got, you ain't got much. Christianity is the most widespread religion in the world due to the violence Christians did in God's name during their conquests in the New World. Conversions were forced on African slaves, Natives and Australian aborigines, not to mention Southern Africans. The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

Tell me not all Muslims are violent barbarians and I will agree with you. Tell me that modern day Christians are anywhere near as barbaric as Muslims and you know that is a lie. Something I am sure is just as forbidden under Islam as it is under Christianity and Judaism.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Booyah!

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Yes because Islam has no history of forced conversion do they?

Switzerland like most other first world countries does not have anything goes first amendment. You go to their country, you play by their rules. Same way when I go to Muslim countries I play by their rules or end up arrested and possibly beaten to death.

Christianity has no history of forced conversion, does it?

No one is ever arrested and beaten to death in the west. No, that doesn't happen.

The interesting thing is this thread is about religious intolerance in Switzerland, not the ME. Has that been forgotten? It certainly is being conveniently ignored.

Is tolerance of countries in the ME towards other religions where the bar is held for Switzerland? If so, Switzerland has a long way to go downward.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

If that's all you got, you ain't got much. Christianity is the most widespread religion in the world due to the violence Christians did in God's name during their conquests in the New World. Conversions were forced on African slaves, Natives and Australian aborigines, not to mention Southern Africans. The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

Tell me not all Muslims are violent barbarians and I will agree with you. Tell me that modern day Christians are anywhere near as barbaric as Muslims and you know that is a lie. Something I am sure is just as forbidden under Islam as it is under Christianity and Judaism.

I'd think Muslims were more barbaric than Christians if I wasn't one, lived among them all my life and had nothing but an idiot non-Muslim media to depend on for information.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Sofiyya

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

If that's all you got, you ain't got much. Christianity is the most widespread religion in the world due to the violence Christians did in God's name during their conquests in the New World. Conversions were forced on African slaves, Natives and Australian aborigines, not to mention Southern Africans. The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

Tell me not all Muslims are violent barbarians and I will agree with you. Tell me that modern day Christians are anywhere near as barbaric as Muslims and you know that is a lie. Something I am sure is just as forbidden under Islam as it is under Christianity and Judaism.

muslims are allowed to lie to kufr during times of war.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Yes because Islam has no history of forced conversion do they?

Switzerland like most other first world countries does not have anything goes first amendment. You go to their country, you play by their rules. Same way when I go to Muslim countries I play by their rules or end up arrested and possibly beaten to death.

Christianity has no history of forced conversion, does it?

No one is ever arrested and beaten to death in the west. No, that doesn't happen.

The interesting thing is this thread is about religious intolerance in Switzerland, not the ME. Has that been forgotten? It certainly is being conveniently ignored.

Is tolerance of countries in the ME towards other religions where the bar is held for Switzerland? If so, Switzerland has a long way to go downward.

Since you have no real knowledge of the ME, I will take that as the usual rhetoric.

If that's all you got, you ain't got much. Christianity is the most widespread religion in the world due to the violence Christians did in God's name during their conquests in the New World. Conversions were forced on African slaves, Natives and Australian aborigines, not to mention Southern Africans. The level of violence in the name of Jesus is often denied, but easily confirmed.

Tell me not all Muslims are violent barbarians and I will agree with you. Tell me that modern day Christians are anywhere near as barbaric as Muslims and you know that is a lie. Something I am sure is just as forbidden under Islam as it is under Christianity and Judaism.

muslims are allowed to lie to kufr during times of war.

Islam discourages lying except to save your life.