Father slain in front of daughter after dog sniffs man's leg

[SuperDuper! 230]

This incident shows how such a dog-eat-dog society that we now live in. No pun intended. On message boards people get so easily offended by the slightest perceived insult. We have to basically walk on eggshells at work and on forums being ever so careful not to mention anything that could be the most remotely offensive. Bottom line, it does not pay to confront strangers or do anything that causes a public confrontation.

If there are a group of juveniles at the beach playing loud music near you, the smart people just pick up and move, and NOT confront to tell them to turn it down. Likewise, the foolish person battles over a parking spot in a crowded parking lot. People do get killed in such petty battles because they can't help themselves and dont know when to back down and prevent a foolish confrontation. Egotistical types get self-esteem in such confrontations and take things to the limit, and get hurt or worse. It's time to wise up people and realize what our society has become: A tense, angry place with bitter, enraged people walking around like ticking time bombs, just waiting to blow up.

Unfortunately, the dog owner encountered one of these raging sociopaths. May he rest in peace, and everyone else take heed to what happened. The stranger you foolishly confront over using your stapler at the Copy store may be waiting for you in the parking lot when you leave. It just aint worth it. It's like Road Rage has now taken to the sidewalk. May we all stay safe and live in Peace.

[Danno 1,228]

doesn't cali have some very strict anti-gun laws?

Apparently, not strict enough, or not well enough enforced.

or some just don't care to follow them. i'm betting when they catch the guy, he's got a criminal record.

Sounds like he felt threatened by the dog and rationalized killing the owner of the dog as self defense.

I doubt that or else he would have shot the dog, seems like this turned into a "CHEST-BUMPING" MATCH and the father brought fists to a fight in an area were guns are used.

[Heracles 417]

This incident shows how such a dog-eat-dog society that we now live in. No pun intended. On message boards people get so easily offended by the slightest perceived insult. We have to basically walk on eggshells at work and on forums being ever so careful not to mention anything that could be the most remotely offensive. Bottom line, it does not pay to confront strangers or do anything that causes a public confrontation.

If there are a group of juveniles at the beach playing loud music near you, the smart people just pick up and move, and NOT confront to tell them to turn it down. Likewise, the foolish person battles over a parking spot in a crowded parking lot. People do get killed in such petty battles because they can't help themselves and dont know when to back down and prevent a foolish confrontation. Egotistical types get self-esteem in such confrontations and take things to the limit, and get hurt or worse. It's time to wise up people and realize what our society has become: A tense, angry place with bitter, enraged people walking around like ticking time bombs, just waiting to blow up.

Unfortunately, the dog owner encountered one of these raging sociopaths. May he rest in peace, and everyone else take heed to what happened. The stranger you foolishly confront over using your stapler at the Copy store may be waiting for you in the parking lot when you leave. It just aint worth it. It's like Road Rage has now taken to the sidewalk. May we all stay safe and live in Peace.

People in civilized countries don't shoot and kill other humans because of a dog or any other such #######. Nope, only in the United States of America. Before you even go there, yes you may find an incident in the UK or AUS but it is far from the norm.

This is a stereotypical scene of a kid from an American hood who thinks they are above the law and above others. This also supports a homicide rate for black American males being close to 8 times that of Caucasian American males.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Wut? I'm not defending the killer's actions. I'm explaining the rationale for why many will use lethal force as self defense, sometimes under the most absurd circumstances...like a dog sniffing your leg. That's where the problem exists, IMO. We have a lot of 2nd Amendment zealots who are paranoid about their personal safety that they are more inclined to pull the trigger at the first impulse.

pulled that one out of your a$ steven, got anymore bs up there?

Have you heard about the Castle Doctrine? The NRA lobbied hard to get it past in several states which basically gives a homeowner to the right to use lethal force...

Currently, the doctrine presumes that a person can use deadly force when someone unlawfully invades his home because the resident is presumed to have his back "against a wall." If not at home, a person generally has a duty to retreat from a confrontation. The doctrine is not fully enshrined in law.

But the proposed law says that a person who is lawfully in any place has "no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm."

[Danno 1,228]

This incident shows how such a dog-eat-dog society that we now live in. No pun intended. On message boards people get so easily offended by the slightest perceived insult. We have to basically walk on eggshells at work and on forums being ever so careful not to mention anything that could be the most remotely offensive. Bottom line, it does not pay to confront strangers or do anything that causes a public confrontation.

If there are a group of juveniles at the beach playing loud music near you, the smart people just pick up and move, and NOT confront to tell them to turn it down. Likewise, the foolish person battles over a parking spot in a crowded parking lot. People do get killed in such petty battles because they can't help themselves and dont know when to back down and prevent a foolish confrontation. Egotistical types get self-esteem in such confrontations and take things to the limit, and get hurt or worse. It's time to wise up people and realize what our society has become: A tense, angry place with bitter, enraged people walking around like ticking time bombs, just waiting to blow up.

Unfortunately, the dog owner encountered one of these raging sociopaths. May he rest in peace, and everyone else take heed to what happened. The stranger you foolishly confront over using your stapler at the Copy store may be waiting for you in the parking lot when you leave. It just aint worth it. It's like Road Rage has now taken to the sidewalk. May we all stay safe and live in Peace.

While I agree with much of your comments, I would say, I have lived in places where your observations were Right-on and I have lived in other places where this type of confrontation is rare or unheard of.

Decide where you want to live.

[Heracles 417]

While I agree with much of your comments, I would say, I have lived in places where your observations were Right-on and I have lived in other places where this type of confrontation is rare or unheard of. Decide where you want to live.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

I don't know why people in this country insist on beating around the bush. Have a look at the states in America with crime rates lower than that of Europe, Australia or even Canada.

Rates that make Europe look like south Central when compared to them.

Now dig further and look at their demographics. Case closed.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[SuperDuper! 230]

This incident shows how such a dog-eat-dog society that we now live in. No pun intended. On message boards people get so easily offended by the slightest perceived insult. We have to basically walk on eggshells at work and on forums being ever so careful not to mention anything that could be the most remotely offensive. Bottom line, it does not pay to confront strangers or do anything that causes a public confrontation.

If there are a group of juveniles at the beach playing loud music near you, the smart people just pick up and move, and NOT confront to tell them to turn it down. Likewise, the foolish person battles over a parking spot in a crowded parking lot. People do get killed in such petty battles because they can't help themselves and dont know when to back down and prevent a foolish confrontation. Egotistical types get self-esteem in such confrontations and take things to the limit, and get hurt or worse. It's time to wise up people and realize what our society has become: A tense, angry place with bitter, enraged people walking around like ticking time bombs, just waiting to blow up.

Unfortunately, the dog owner encountered one of these raging sociopaths. May he rest in peace, and everyone else take heed to what happened. The stranger you foolishly confront over using your stapler at the Copy store may be waiting for you in the parking lot when you leave. It just aint worth it. It's like Road Rage has now taken to the sidewalk. May we all stay safe and live in Peace.

While I agree with much of your comments, I would say, I have lived in places where your observations were Right-on and I have lived in other places where this type of confrontation is rare or unheard of.

Decide where you want to live.

I bet this type of confrontation is not unheard of, or at least less surprising in NYC. In Sleepy, Liberal San Francisco it is quite unexpected. The times they are a changin', so the old civil rules we could count on, sadly, no longer apply. For example, it used to be that the pretty girl at the bar could slap a man or pour a drink in his lap for being crude or squeezing her backside. I dont think there is this understanding anymore. The slapping woman will either be charged with battery or struck back or worse in the parking lot or be followed home.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Hopp

[Heracles 417]

I bet this type of confrontation is not unheard of, or at least less surprising in NYC. In Sleepy, Liberal San Francisco it is quite unexpected. The times they are a changin', so the old civil rules we could count on, sadly, no longer apply. For example, it used to be that the pretty girl at the bar could slap a man or pour a drink in his lap for being crude or squeezing her backside. I dont think there is this understanding anymore. The slapping woman will either be charged with battery or struck back or worse in the parking lot or be followed home.

Homicide rate: (per 100,000)

NYC: 6

San Fran: 14

Robbery Rate: (per 100,000)

NYC: 266

San Fran: 514

Forcible rape: (per 100,000)

NYC: 11

San Fran: 17

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[slim 1,525]

why was the pedestrian armed in the 1st place?

Maybe he read that 2nd Amendment thing we keep hearing about.

Possibly, but a dog sniffing a man's leg is absolutely no reason to shoot and kill a man in front of his daughter.

Nowhere in the story did it say he shot the man because the dog sniffed his leg. It said he shot the man after they exchanged words.

And people will still argue that it's the right of every American to carry firearms. What about the right to life? Which is more important?

If you don't have a right to carry a firearm, how do you defend your right to life, especially when confronted by someone who does carry firearms?

doesn't cali have some very strict anti-gun laws?

Apparently, not strict enough, or not well enough enforced.

.....

or some just don't care to follow them. i'm betting when they catch the guy, he's got a criminal record.

I messed up the quotes a little bit here, but there are some good points above. In "most" shootings like this (urban environment, young male shooter) there are already laws being broken before the shooting even happens. I'm no expert on Kali laws, but I'm also willing to wager the shooter wasn't carrying legally.

Also keep in mind the shooter hasn't been convicted yet. He may've had good reason to shoot the ice cream buying dad. What if the dad tried to sick his dog on the young man? There are a million things that could've happened.

We have a lot of 2nd Amendment zealots who are paranoid about their personal safety that they are more inclined to pull the trigger at the first impulse.

I haven't seen too many 2nd Amendment zealots pull the trigger at all. Most who actually do pull the trigger are either criminals already or really are in a legal lethal force scenario. See, most 2nd Amendment zealots are aware of the stiff penalties associated with "pulling the trigger" and refrain - choosing better forms of dispute resolution first.

You guys are missing the point. The piece of sh!t who did this was obviously NOT a law abiding citizen. It's highly unlikely he was licensed to carry the gun he used. People who are licensed to carry hand guns rarely do stupid things like this. The fact that someone would jump through the necessary hoops to get a license would mean they are inclined to follow the law. Besides, if he really felt threatened by the dog then he would have shot the dog rather than the owner.

You can pass all the gun control laws you like, but you're not going to stop scum like this from killing people. Gun control laws only affect people who actually FOLLOW the law.

Jim gets my vote for most sensible post of the day.

And I don't think the guy shot the man because a dog sniffed him. It was the words they exchanged. There are a LOT of angry people out there and it doesn't take much to set them off. I read about it in the journals of my students. Frightening stuff!!

Here's lies the problem. It's like the whole "war on terrorism" thing. We're not going to win that "war" by killing people. We're only going to defeat it by changing the underlying conditions that started it in the first place. Same with criminals who shoot people here in the U.S. We don't fix that problem by banning guns, we fix it by fixing the underlying problems that cause people to shoot each other.

People in civilized countries don't shoot and kill other humans because of a dog or any other such #######. Nope, only in the United States of America. Before you even go there, yes you may find an incident in the UK or AUS but it is far from the norm.

Nope. In civilized countries, they just stab them. (Because their guns are already mostly gone.)

This is a stereotypical scene of a kid from an American hood who thinks they are above the law and above others. This also supports a homicide rate for black American males being close to 8 times that of Caucasian American males.

Nothing like stereotypes supported by factual evidence!

[Heracles 417]

People in civilized countries don't shoot and kill other humans because of a dog or any other such #######. Nope, only in the United States of America. Before you even go there, yes you may find an incident in the UK or AUS but it is far from the norm.

Nope. In civilized countries, they just stab them. (Because their guns are already mostly gone.)

This is a stereotypical scene of a kid from an American hood who thinks they are above the law and above others. This also supports a homicide rate for black American males being close to 8 times that of Caucasian American males.

Nothing like stereotypes supported by factual evidence!

Any proof to back that up?

I have already quoted the overall homicide rate you conveniently ignore. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_count...l_homicide_rate

--------

Now regarding my comment. Is the following source any good?

US Homicide rate: (Per 100,000)

Whites: 4.8

Blacks: 36.9

Source: FBI, Supplementary Homicide Reports, 1976-2005.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[slim 1,525]

Which statement?

You provided factual evidence to back up your point that blacks kill each other way more often than whites.

-Or are you referring to all the stabbings in AUS?

[Heracles 417]

Which statement?

You provided factual evidence to back up your point that blacks kill each other way more often than whites.

-Or are you referring to all the stabbings in AUS?

Actually, I stated that the homicide rate by black males is x times higher than that of white males. I then provide my source, which was the FBI.

It's you who keeps on bringing up stabbings and other straw man arguments to discredit gun related murders.

EG someone was once killed with a rubber ducky in Aus. Therefore, this justifies guns too right?

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[SuperDuper! 230]

Booyah, your facts are interesting, but off the mark. To put my point in another way, I will pose a question. Which city are you more likely to get in a bar fight in, NYC or SF? People are just much more wound up in NYC. They are quicker to honk, and more likely to give you a piece of their mind back East. Have you ever been to the Bronx? They talk a lot louder and faster and more direct and less polite compared to Californians. That is the point.

[Heracles 417]

Booyah, your facts are interesting, but off the mark. To put my point in another way, I will pose a question. Which city are you more likely to get in a bar fight in, NYC or SF? People are just much more wound up in NYC. They are quicker to honk, and more likely to give you a piece of their mind back East. Have you ever been to the Bronx? They talk a lot louder and faster and more direct and less polite compared to Californians. That is the point.

That part in bold is interesting. Are we talking about the same CA? I haven't been to San Fran but this is definitely not the case in LA.

The thing about San Fran is that is probably not the gay lib committing the crimes. It's a certain demographic. The same freakin demographic committing the same sort of crimes in cities throughout America. Cities where this demographics has a decent size population in. The places with the lowest crime rates all have a low percentage of this demographic residing in them. Coincidence I think not.

I am not here to ponder the why, nor do I care to, but I am stating the obvious. As much as I give ###### to slim, it's not gun toting rednecks that are committing these homicides.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Booyah!

[SuperDuper! 230]

Booyah, your facts are interesting, but off the mark. To put my point in another way, I will pose a question. Which city are you more likely to get in a bar fight in, NYC or SF? People are just much more wound up in NYC. They are quicker to honk, and more likely to give you a piece of their mind back East. Have you ever been to the Bronx? They talk a lot louder and faster and more direct and less polite compared to Californians. That is the point.

That part in bold is interesting. Are we talking about the same CA? I haven't been to San Fran but this is definitely not the case in LA.

Dude, Bronx vs LA?? You are saying there is no difference, or that LA is louder and faster talking? ANyways, you are a sharp guy, so I will assume you get the point I am trying to make: Mild mannered communities are no longer immune from instant public conforntations. THe smart person will just avoid the maniac who is trying to provoke you into a confrontation. We must keep our dogs on a leash so it does not impinge on others' personal space, and be polite to strangers if we know what is good for us and the safety of our families. It's the 1% person that you hope and pray you never encounter on his bad day. I'm done. Later.