Withdrawal of support for I-129F (K-1) petition

[Waitinggent 2]

I don't think that we, who are unfamiliar with their relationship, can say that it was a scam. Waiting 3 years to pull off a scam does not seem reasonable to me. A scammer would have given up long ago and looked for another man. We don't know how well they knew each other and how much time they spent together and whether she was receiving financial support from him prior to this. And we don't know if his ex-fiancee is currently the sole supporter of these people, which would make her request not so unreasonable and not at all unexpected. Certainly this should have been discussed before filing the I-129f. My fiancee is a widow and has a son about to enter the university and a daughter currently in the university. We discussed this and have a complete understanding of what support I will provide. In fact, and this may not be very romantic, but I had us each make a list of what we expect from each other and what questions we had for each other regarding our living situation, and my questions included whether she planned or wanted to work in the USA, financial support for her children, whether her son would want to get a green card, how often she wanted to travel back to Russia after we marry, and how much time she expected to spend in Russia each year, etc . . . .. . It was very useful and we are clear on everything.

[ms_jinga_lala 0]

This is really screwed up, however I feel like you can be thankful she wasn't better at what she was doing. She must have known she couldn't fool you in person each day. Just think if she had come here and married you and then started guilting you into sending money, innocently at first but ever increasing. There are manipulative people like that out there. She could have destroyed your personality and self esteem as well as your bank account. All on the pretense of "I love you, it hurts me to see my family suffer when I have it so good, can't we help a little more...." and that would have went on and on.

Thank you for posting though, some people may need to see your story to avoid this for themselves as well. Don't be sick, and don't have regrets. You did what anyone in love would do. She is the stupid one, she is the one who will never know what a good hearted husband she could have had. If all she cares about is money, she will never know true happiness, but now without her you have a real chance to find it. The hurting will pass, and you will be better for having gotten through this without spending a lifetime suffering.

[ms_jinga_lala 0]

I don't think that we, who are unfamiliar with their relationship, can say that it was a scam. Waiting 3 years to pull off a scam does not seem reasonable to me. A scammer would have given up long ago and looked for another man. We don't know how well they knew each other and how much time they spent together and whether she was receiving financial support from him prior to this. And we don't know if his ex-fiancee is currently the sole supporter of these people, which would make her request not so unreasonable and not at all unexpected. Certainly this should have been discussed before filing the I-129f. My fiancee is a widow and has a son about to enter the university and a daughter currently in the university. We discussed this and have a complete understanding of what support I will provide. In fact, and this may not be very romantic, but I had us each make a list of what we expect from each other and what questions we had for each other regarding our living situation, and my questions included whether she planned or wanted to work in the USA, financial support for her children, whether her son would want to get a green card, how often she wanted to travel back to Russia after we marry, and how much time she expected to spend in Russia each year, etc . . . .. . It was very useful and we are clear on everything.

I did the same thing, listing expectations. I'm kind of stubborn and my man is kinda spoiled lol. We had to have a clear understanding of a lot. I have needs, he has needs. Everyone has needs. They are the most important things to be discussed because if you don't meet each others true needs, your marriage can't survive.

I do however disagree that a scammer can wait 3 years. There have been scams that have been revealed that were years in the making. It takes a lot of work, but people do it. Things get into peoples minds and they convince themselves to believe it then they start living it and it makes it easy to keep up charades for a long time. Research narcissist and see how long they can keep up their charades and the lengths they will go through to get what they perceive as a need. I'm not saying this Russian woman was a narcissist at all, it's just those are the type people I have experience with.

It's entirely possible in this case that the Russian woman truly believed that it is the mans responsibility to support the entire family (some cultures and religions believe this and since we don't know her, we don't know). If that is the case, the OP may have known this. And of course finances can kill any marriage, if one or both of them were starting to worry about financial issues after she got here that could have easily set a wall between them which neither of them knew how to tear down. Then from stress they could have started making demands or pushing for all kinds of things. Who knows, one or the other could have been just as stubborn as I am and gotten hot headed about some things that were said and then couldn't let go of it all and started pushing harder.

None of us know, the only thing any of us can do is offer our support for a love that has been lost and continue to warn people of the potential for scams. Everyone should do their research, not ignore signs they see, and approach all things that are this important in life with caution. Love is not the only thing it takes to make a marriage successful.

[Waitinggent 2]

Well, we can all agree that this is tragic when it happens. And we can only speculate here, and in truth we have no idea what was in the head of his fiancee. When they met, she didn't even have a grandson, and very likely her daughter was not even married, so there may not have even been a son-in-law and baby that needed supporting. Her circumstances changed. But it was certainly generous of the poster to air his unhappy story so that others can learn. An overseas relationship is certain a minefield with potential pitfalls, and I am a big advocate for discussing these issues early in a relationship. In my case, our relationship was about 11 months old when I filed the I0129f, but we discussed the possibility of her coming to the USA at about the 5 month mark. I didn't want to continue this relationship and become further attached to my fiancee if there was going to be some impediment that would ultimately doom our relationship. So I was very clear that this discussion we had did not mean that we were necessarily going to get married, but it was simply about being clear that that neither of us expected something that would be a dealbreaker and that doomed our relationship from the potential of a successful result. She was very understanding that this relationship required a lot of travel and expense and time for me, and that it is only normal that I would want to be sure that there was at least the possibility of a happy ending. It may not be an easy thing to bring up earlier in the relationship, but I think it is mandatory.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Jim

The specific scam you speak of has been found to most often be pulled by MEN posing as women and hanging out in internet clubs all day. They scrape some photos off the web of hot girls and make some profiles on the "free" dating/marriage sites" They fall in love after 3 emails and then starting milking the guys for cash. Yes, there is always an emergency, they ask for money for visas and plane tickets, promise endless lovemaking when they come to visit, then, as you can imagine they have some majoir problem at the airport. I even read of one case where the woman said she was at JFK with her vistim on the other side of the secure area and told him they turned her back. You know and I know, that "woman" never got a visa. These things do not rise to "visa fraud" as they never involve visas, it is just a scam, and yes there are plenty of them.

If you are 'lucky' the guy might even have his girlfriend or other female friend call you on the phone to 'prove' her love-I mean if she called you, it has to be love right? No matter what she has very detailed instruction on how to exactly send money through Western Union. Tell her anything about how her thinking of getting a visa is wrong, her reply is, "Russian Black Market, anything can be bought". I had one of these after me many years ago, in the young days of the internet and lucky I realized that she never really answered any questions, and her 'life story' changed a little in each email, before I did something foolish. I used a very easy way to figure this one out too. I made a new email address and just did a completely different reply to her 3rd or 4th email to me. Talked about my favourite dental floss and stuff like that and made up a different name. Sure enough, I got the same reply-only each instance of my name was changed to the false identity. Basically a lot of them have (had) scripts they just changed details like your name with the 100 other guys they were talking to

NEVER send money to someone you haven't met and sincere Russian and Ukrainian women will never ask you for money and will not acceot money unless you have both decided this is a sincere relationship

And once it is a sincere relationship, sometimes they still refuse to accept money, or 'forget' to pick it up. This WHILE they are telling you about their own financial difficulties and/or family troubles.

Another thing is that even a sincere girl in a poor country can be overwhelmed by rich Americans. When she comes to the airport to pick you up, what is going through her mind is that you have enough money to buy a plane ticket. Such is just not possible for most people. No matter how much you tell her you are "not rich", dammit, you bought a plane ticket, "don't tell ME you aren't rich!" It is just something the person has to deal with on an individual basis.

Yes, trying to explain bills, credit, loans, taxes etc. is actually a more difficult language barrier than between English and Russian

About the money is true. Fairly early on I sent Alla $100 to apply to her phone bill as she was calling me a lot and I knew she really didn't have the money for that. She refused...absolutely, to pick it up. After 30 days I had to take the money back and lost my transfer fee, not a big deal, but she absolutely would take no money. Later on we had a pow-wow and she laid out all of her expenses, then we discussed what else we needed in the future, travele expenses, visa fees, Aos fees, English tutoring for the youngest son become he arrived. Very detailed (and monotonous) then we @combined@ our incomes and decided what needed to be sent, when, etc. She absolutely refused any money that wasn't explained and budgeted. Of course when I was there she didn't offer to pick up the check at restraunts though!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

I don't think that we, who are unfamiliar with their relationship, can say that it was a scam. Waiting 3 years to pull off a scam does not seem reasonable to me. A scammer would have given up long ago and looked for another man. We don't know how well they knew each other and how much time they spent together and whether she was receiving financial support from him prior to this. And we don't know if his ex-fiancee is currently the sole supporter of these people, which would make her request not so unreasonable and not at all unexpected. Certainly this should have been discussed before filing the I-129f. My fiancee is a widow and has a son about to enter the university and a daughter currently in the university. We discussed this and have a complete understanding of what support I will provide. In fact, and this may not be very romantic, but I had us each make a list of what we expect from each other and what questions we had for each other regarding our living situation, and my questions included whether she planned or wanted to work in the USA, financial support for her children, whether her son would want to get a green card, how often she wanted to travel back to Russia after we marry, and how much time she expected to spend in Russia each year, etc . . . .. . It was very useful and we are clear on everything.

You are right, which is why I mention that multi-generations live together and a major breadwinner simply will not abandon the family.

On the other hand, some scammers keep several men on the hook for as long as possible and when it comes time to leave they make an excuse and bail out and fall back on other men. I can't make that judgement but obviously this marriage would not work, so be glad you found out now. You can always do another petition if you want.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

Jim

The specific scam you speak of has been found to most often be pulled by MEN posing as women and hanging out in internet clubs all day. They scrape some photos off the web of hot girls and make some profiles on the "free" dating/marriage sites" They fall in love after 3 emails and then starting milking the guys for cash. Yes, there is always an emergency, they ask for money for visas and plane tickets, promise endless lovemaking when they come to visit, then, as you can imagine they have some majoir problem at the airport. I even read of one case where the woman said she was at JFK with her vistim on the other side of the secure area and told him they turned her back. You know and I know, that "woman" never got a visa. These things do not rise to "visa fraud" as they never involve visas, it is just a scam, and yes there are plenty of them.

NEVER send money to someone you haven't met and sincere Russian and Ukrainian women will never ask you for money and will not acceot money unless you have both decided this is a sincere relationship

Another thing is that even a sincere girl in a poor country can be overwhelmed by rich Americans. When she comes to the airport to pick you up, what is going through her mind is that you have enough money to buy a plane ticket. Such is just not possible for most people. No matter how much you tell her you are "not rich", dammit, you bought a plane ticket, "don't tell ME you aren't rich!" It is just something the person has to deal with on an individual basis.

First, let me clarify something that come up in a couple of other posts.

I wasn't implying that scams are more common in FSU countries. I had hoped my post made this clear, but maybe not. I was only saying that there seem to be more websites dedicated to scams in FSU countries than other countries, and these will come up in a google search. As I said, there's a modus operandi that's common to each country or region. Perhaps the money scam just stings more than a marriage-for-greencard scam, which prompts more people to create websites about them.

Ok, about men pulling off the money scam - yes, there are some stories on those scam exposure sites about people having been duped into sending money by men posing as women. There are also many stories from men who have traveled to their new girlfriend's country (sometimes several times) and spent time with her, before committing to sending regular remittances. They also rack up hefty phone bills talking to their girlfriends. Somewhere behind the scenes there may indeed be a man orchestrating things, but there is also a real flesh-and-blood girl playing the part of the girlfriend. In fact, the apex of this scam often comes with a desperate phone call from the girl who claims to have been detained at the airport for some reason, and now needs 2 or 3 thousand dollars to re-purchase tickets or pay fees or fines or bribes or whatever. The poor suckers who fall for these are left standing in an airport for a foreign fiancee who never arrives.

I have no idea if the OP's situation fits any variation of this scam, but the fact that the support and money requirements were the deal breaker just set off some alarms bells, and reminded me of some of the stories I'd read. That's why I said I hoped he hadn't been milked for a lot of cash already. If that were the case, then she may have sensed things were getting too serious and it was time to break it off, so she used the demand for a commitment to long term support of a large family to scare him off.

[thongd4me 69]

Jim

The specific scam you speak of has been found to most often be pulled by MEN posing as women and hanging out in internet clubs all day. They scrape some photos off the web of hot girls and make some profiles on the "free" dating/marriage sites" They fall in love after 3 emails and then starting milking the guys for cash. Yes, there is always an emergency, they ask for money for visas and plane tickets, promise endless lovemaking when they come to visit, then, as you can imagine they have some majoir problem at the airport. I even read of one case where the woman said she was at JFK with her vistim on the other side of the secure area and told him they turned her back. You know and I know, that "woman" never got a visa. These things do not rise to "visa fraud" as they never involve visas, it is just a scam, and yes there are plenty of them.

NEVER send money to someone you haven't met and sincere Russian and Ukrainian women will never ask you for money and will not acceot money unless you have both decided this is a sincere relationship

Another thing is that even a sincere girl in a poor country can be overwhelmed by rich Americans. When she comes to the airport to pick you up, what is going through her mind is that you have enough money to buy a plane ticket. Such is just not possible for most people. No matter how much you tell her you are "not rich", dammit, you bought a plane ticket, "don't tell ME you aren't rich!" It is just something the person has to deal with on an individual basis.

First, let me clarify something that come up in a couple of other posts.

I wasn't implying that scams are more common in FSU countries. I had hoped my post made this clear, but maybe not. I was only saying that there seem to be more websites dedicated to scams in FSU countries than other countries, and these will come up in a google search. As I said, there's a modus operandi that's common to each country or region. Perhaps the money scam just stings more than a marriage-for-greencard scam, which prompts more people to create websites about them.

Ok, about men pulling off the money scam - yes, there are some stories on those scam exposure sites about people having been duped into sending money by men posing as women. There are also many stories from men who have traveled to their new girlfriend's country (sometimes several times) and spent time with her, before committing to sending regular remittances. They also rack up hefty phone bills talking to their girlfriends. Somewhere behind the scenes there may indeed be a man orchestrating things, but there is also a real flesh-and-blood girl playing the part of the girlfriend. In fact, the apex of this scam often comes with a desperate phone call from the girl who claims to have been detained at the airport for some reason, and now needs 2 or 3 thousand dollars to re-purchase tickets or pay fees or fines or bribes or whatever. The poor suckers who fall for these are left standing in an airport for a foreign fiancee who never arrives.

I have no idea if the OP's situation fits any variation of this scam, but the fact that the support and money requirements were the deal breaker just set off some alarms bells, and reminded me of some of the stories I'd read. That's why I said I hoped he hadn't been milked for a lot of cash already. If that were the case, then she may have sensed things were getting too serious and it was time to break it off, so she used the demand for a commitment to long term support of a large family to scare him off.

We don't know if the OP was scammed or not (possibly he was) but HE will never know either.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

Jim

The specific scam you speak of has been found to most often be pulled by MEN posing as women and hanging out in internet clubs all day. They scrape some photos off the web of hot girls and make some profiles on the "free" dating/marriage sites" They fall in love after 3 emails and then starting milking the guys for cash. Yes, there is always an emergency, they ask for money for visas and plane tickets, promise endless lovemaking when they come to visit, then, as you can imagine they have some majoir problem at the airport. I even read of one case where the woman said she was at JFK with her vistim on the other side of the secure area and told him they turned her back. You know and I know, that "woman" never got a visa. These things do not rise to "visa fraud" as they never involve visas, it is just a scam, and yes there are plenty of them.

NEVER send money to someone you haven't met and sincere Russian and Ukrainian women will never ask you for money and will not acceot money unless you have both decided this is a sincere relationship

Another thing is that even a sincere girl in a poor country can be overwhelmed by rich Americans. When she comes to the airport to pick you up, what is going through her mind is that you have enough money to buy a plane ticket. Such is just not possible for most people. No matter how much you tell her you are "not rich", dammit, you bought a plane ticket, "don't tell ME you aren't rich!" It is just something the person has to deal with on an individual basis.

First, let me clarify something that come up in a couple of other posts.

I wasn't implying that scams are more common in FSU countries. I had hoped my post made this clear, but maybe not. I was only saying that there seem to be more websites dedicated to scams in FSU countries than other countries, and these will come up in a google search. As I said, there's a modus operandi that's common to each country or region. Perhaps the money scam just stings more than a marriage-for-greencard scam, which prompts more people to create websites about them.

Ok, about men pulling off the money scam - yes, there are some stories on those scam exposure sites about people having been duped into sending money by men posing as women. There are also many stories from men who have traveled to their new girlfriend's country (sometimes several times) and spent time with her, before committing to sending regular remittances. They also rack up hefty phone bills talking to their girlfriends. Somewhere behind the scenes there may indeed be a man orchestrating things, but there is also a real flesh-and-blood girl playing the part of the girlfriend. In fact, the apex of this scam often comes with a desperate phone call from the girl who claims to have been detained at the airport for some reason, and now needs 2 or 3 thousand dollars to re-purchase tickets or pay fees or fines or bribes or whatever. The poor suckers who fall for these are left standing in an airport for a foreign fiancee who never arrives.

I have no idea if the OP's situation fits any variation of this scam, but the fact that the support and money requirements were the deal breaker just set off some alarms bells, and reminded me of some of the stories I'd read. That's why I said I hoped he hadn't been milked for a lot of cash already. If that were the case, then she may have sensed things were getting too serious and it was time to break it off, so she used the demand for a commitment to long term support of a large family to scare him off.

We don't know if the OP was scammed or not (possibly he was) but HE will never know either.

Did you read the rest of the post, or did you skip to the last paragraph and start jacking up the font size?

[thongd4me 69]

Jim

The specific scam you speak of has been found to most often be pulled by MEN posing as women and hanging out in internet clubs all day. They scrape some photos off the web of hot girls and make some profiles on the "free" dating/marriage sites" They fall in love after 3 emails and then starting milking the guys for cash. Yes, there is always an emergency, they ask for money for visas and plane tickets, promise endless lovemaking when they come to visit, then, as you can imagine they have some majoir problem at the airport. I even read of one case where the woman said she was at JFK with her vistim on the other side of the secure area and told him they turned her back. You know and I know, that "woman" never got a visa. These things do not rise to "visa fraud" as they never involve visas, it is just a scam, and yes there are plenty of them.

NEVER send money to someone you haven't met and sincere Russian and Ukrainian women will never ask you for money and will not acceot money unless you have both decided this is a sincere relationship

Another thing is that even a sincere girl in a poor country can be overwhelmed by rich Americans. When she comes to the airport to pick you up, what is going through her mind is that you have enough money to buy a plane ticket. Such is just not possible for most people. No matter how much you tell her you are "not rich", dammit, you bought a plane ticket, "don't tell ME you aren't rich!" It is just something the person has to deal with on an individual basis.

First, let me clarify something that come up in a couple of other posts.

I wasn't implying that scams are more common in FSU countries. I had hoped my post made this clear, but maybe not. I was only saying that there seem to be more websites dedicated to scams in FSU countries than other countries, and these will come up in a google search. As I said, there's a modus operandi that's common to each country or region. Perhaps the money scam just stings more than a marriage-for-greencard scam, which prompts more people to create websites about them.

Ok, about men pulling off the money scam - yes, there are some stories on those scam exposure sites about people having been duped into sending money by men posing as women. There are also many stories from men who have traveled to their new girlfriend's country (sometimes several times) and spent time with her, before committing to sending regular remittances. They also rack up hefty phone bills talking to their girlfriends. Somewhere behind the scenes there may indeed be a man orchestrating things, but there is also a real flesh-and-blood girl playing the part of the girlfriend. In fact, the apex of this scam often comes with a desperate phone call from the girl who claims to have been detained at the airport for some reason, and now needs 2 or 3 thousand dollars to re-purchase tickets or pay fees or fines or bribes or whatever. The poor suckers who fall for these are left standing in an airport for a foreign fiancee who never arrives.

I have no idea if the OP's situation fits any variation of this scam, but the fact that the support and money requirements were the deal breaker just set off some alarms bells, and reminded me of some of the stories I'd read. That's why I said I hoped he hadn't been milked for a lot of cash already. If that were the case, then she may have sensed things were getting too serious and it was time to break it off, so she used the demand for a commitment to long term support of a large family to scare him off.

We don't know if the OP was scammed or not (possibly he was) but HE will never know either.

Did you read the rest of the post, or did you skip to the last paragraph and start jacking up the font size?

Yes I read it all.

No I'm not as sure as some in passing judgment.

The font was to specify what I was replying to, not to impress anyone.