Obama honors fallen Americans at Dover

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

I didn't say I was full-blown on libertarianism - Just on foreign policy.

Its certain others who want to say "You're not libertarian" - who pull things out of their a@@. At least when I call someone a lib - they really are.

I do think we need more troops in Afgh or get out. Those are the options. Pussyfooting around doesn't help.

Because *you* say so.

*I* say you're a GOPer masquerading as a libertarian, simply because its become fashionable - and given that you can't/won't substantiate any of it... Well... I think most people can put 2+2 together.

[Joseph & Ana 0]

Then you're not "far right".

Yes I am.

You're idea of far right is Nazi - and it isn't true.

Which of the positions you indicated above do you consider "far right"?

For instance - plenty of people oppose abortion, but not all of them support the idea of making abortion completely illegal (including rape cases) or charging the women with "murder". That would be a far right position, Mr Joe.

As I said before it absolutely has to do with authoritarian influence of government into people's lives.

Nothing you described above sounds anything but mainstream conservatism. What is it that puts you on the far right?

Libs like to call reality the opposite of what it really is. The libs stand for authoritarian government intruding into everyone's lives. I.e. you can't eat this its not healthy, you can't smoke this, but you CAN smoke this, you can't burn that its not healthy, you can't drive this, you can't weigh this much, you can't make this much money, you can't eat meat because it warms the planet, and so on and so forth.

But conservatives say - don't kill the unborn and THATS GOTTA STOP ITS AUTHORITARIAN!

How's about dispensing with the rhetoric and answering my question:

Which of the positions you indicated above do you consider "far right"?

Don't be ashamed of your liberalism. You can't hide behind Libertarian when you're clearly not.

I know everything about Libertarians.

Libertarianism is indeed a distinct political philosophy - but imo its used in a dishonest way by a lot of former Republicans who cite it merely to indicate their frustration at the two party system - and has little to do with whether they are actually libertarian in outlook, or whether they are part of any libertarian movement./

Good job on making that up on the spot. Too bad it doesn't apply to me, and I don't care what republicans you're talking about.

Forgive me Joe, but to use your tried and trusted line of argument - all I've ever seen you do is trash the Democratic party, never once have I seen you go on the offensive against any member of the Republican party with anything like the vitriol you throw at the Democrats, regardless of how thinly based the charges are.

I'm not a registered voter in the US so I've never really developed any affinity with either party, so the whole punch and judy show doesn't really interest me.

As to the rest its just my opinion - but the only person here on VJ who has ever put substance behind the claim of being libertarian is Matt. You certainly haven't ponied up anything that would make anyone think that you aren't just another die-hard partisan who merely pretends to be an independent because its become fashionable to do so. The reason I say this - is because substance has never really been your forte. Its always been about shouting at "lefties", not unlike some miserable old git shaking his fist at kids playing in his garden.

Once again you're mistaken in believing I care whether you believe I have some libertarian views or not. I am and always have been a Conservative Independent. That means that I will never vote Democrat unless there is a Zell Miller (which there isn't and won't be) - and it means that I will sometimes vote Republican. I have also on many occasions voted 3rd party. In any event, it doesn't matter. I've never done anything that was fashionable to do so. You obviously don't pay attention. And you are a lefty - thats no reflection on me.

Because *you* say so.

*I* say you're a GOPer masquerading as a libertarian, simply because its become fashionable - and given that you can't/won't substantiate any of it... Well... I think most people can put 2+2 together.

You'll have to remind me again of the posts where I mention that I care whether you think I've proven worthy or not.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

[Joseph & Ana 0]

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

The problem is that you libs take offense when someone calls you as such. I am honored when i'm called a right wing-nut, or a conservative.

If i were to call you a progressive - you'd be happy. However, its interchangeable with lib. So I'll stick with lib, so that you'll continue to foam at the mouth.

Rules? I don't know of any rules.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Once again you're mistaken in believing I care whether you believe I have some libertarian views or not. I am and always have been a Conservative Independent. That means that I will never vote Democrat unless there is a Zell Miller (which there isn't and won't be) - and it means that I will sometimes vote Republican. I have also on many occasions voted 3rd party. In any event, it doesn't matter. I've never done anything that was fashionable to do so. You obviously don't pay attention. And you are a lefty - thats no reflection on me.

Why won't you answer my question about which of the opinions you indicated on the other page constitute a "far right" viewpoint?

It's not a trick question - I imagine the only reason you can't answer it is because you have no firm political or philosophical principles.

[The_Dude 1,142]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

There are a lot of different ideologies within the Libertarian party. Some, like John Stossel believe in the full ideology to the hilt. But most pick and choose what they like to believe in. Is this a true Libertarian? Probably not, but none the less, the party is growing. I don't think there are that many people who support every single policy and ideology that their party puts out. Despite what imbeciles like Joe think, you don't need to tow the line verbatum.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

The problem is that you libs take offense when someone calls you as such. I am honored when i'm called a right wing-nut, or a conservative.

If i were to call you a progressive - you'd be happy. However, its interchangeable with lib. So I'll stick with lib, so that you'll continue to foam at the mouth.

Rules? I don't know of any rules.

Actually Joe, it makes me laugh - because these rants only serve to make you look stupid in public.

[Joseph & Ana 0]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

There are a lot of different ideologies within the Libertarian party. Some, like John Stossel believe in the full ideology to the hilt. But most pick and choose what they like to believe in. Is this a true Libertarian? Probably not, but none the less, the party is growing. I don't think there are that many people who support every single policy and ideology that their party puts out. Despite what imbeciles like Joe think, you don't need to tow the line verbatum.

You don't tow any line except for the Liberal one.

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

The problem is that you libs take offense when someone calls you as such. I am honored when i'm called a right wing-nut, or a conservative.

If i were to call you a progressive - you'd be happy. However, its interchangeable with lib. So I'll stick with lib, so that you'll continue to foam at the mouth.

Rules? I don't know of any rules.

Actually Joe, it makes me laugh - because these rants only serve to make you look stupid in public.

Good, then I'm glad you get entertainment.

One could have mistaken it for liberal rage, but either way its cool.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Case in point

[nowhereman 1]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

I didn't say I was full-blown on libertarianism - Just on foreign policy.

Its certain others who want to say "You're not libertarian" - who pull things out of their a@@. At least when I call someone a lib - they really are.

I do think we need more troops in Afgh or get out. Those are the options. Pussyfooting around doesn't help.

Joe you completely contradicted yourself... you get your panties in a bunch when someone says you aren't a libertarian but at the same time if someone says they are not a liberal and you think they are then by default they are a "lib". In fact just yesterday you pulled that on me and I pretty much shut you down to the point where your defense was "because I said so".

I am a former member of the Republican party & now a registered Independent. I have never been a registered Democrat. I have voted both Republican & Democrat in the past. These facts completely outweight your labeling me as a "lib". On the flip side if you call yourself a Libertarian I for one will give you the benefit of the doubt.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

...your defense was "because I said so".

Amazing isn't it.

[Joseph & Ana 0]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

I didn't say I was full-blown on libertarianism - Just on foreign policy.

Its certain others who want to say "You're not libertarian" - who pull things out of their a@@. At least when I call someone a lib - they really are.

I do think we need more troops in Afgh or get out. Those are the options. Pussyfooting around doesn't help.

Joe you completely contradicted yourself... you get your panties in a bunch when someone says you aren't a libertarian but at the same time if someone says they are not a liberal and you think they are then by default they are a "lib". In fact just yesterday you pulled that on me and I pretty much shut you down to the point where your defense was "because I said so".

I am a former member of the Republican party & now a registered Independent. I have never been a registered Democrat. I have voted both Republican & Democrat in the past. These facts completely outweight your labeling me as a "lib". On the flip side if you call yourself a Libertarian I for one will give you the benefit of the doubt.

I said I was more libertarian on foreign policy. I did not label myself.

You are a lib. Your voting record doesn't matter. Its that you whole-heartedly support Obama's policies... Pussyfooting Afgh, socialized medicine, taxing the rich and corporations, cap and trade - you tow the line myfriend.

I know you'd like to think you shut me down, but you didn't.

[The_Dude 1,142]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

There are a lot of different ideologies within the Libertarian party. Some, like John Stossel believe in the full ideology to the hilt. But most pick and choose what they like to believe in. Is this a true Libertarian? Probably not, but none the less, the party is growing. I don't think there are that many people who support every single policy and ideology that their party puts out. Despite what imbeciles like Joe think, you don't need to tow the line verbatum.

You don't tow any line except for the Liberal one.

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

The problem is that you libs take offense when someone calls you as such. I am honored when i'm called a right wing-nut, or a conservative.

If i were to call you a progressive - you'd be happy. However, its interchangeable with lib. So I'll stick with lib, so that you'll continue to foam at the mouth.

Rules? I don't know of any rules.

Actually Joe, it makes me laugh - because these rants only serve to make you look stupid in public.

Good, then I'm glad you get entertainment.

One could have mistaken it for liberal rage, but either way its cool.

Have you read any of my posts? Yes, I tend to side more liberally on some issues, but I have viewpoints that would generally be called conservative. But then again, I don't think you actually read peoples posts. Joe, are you in fact a forum bot?

[Joseph & Ana 0]

The basis of the Libertarian ideology is the maximization of individual liberties & freedoms and the minimization (or even abolition) of the State. However true Libertarianism is about as practical as Marxism... a nice idea that is simply implausible to apply to the real world. In reality Libertarians are basically Republicans who, for various reasons, have broken away from the mainstream party & formed a new party that stresses the above ideals.

There are a lot of different ideologies within the Libertarian party. Some, like John Stossel believe in the full ideology to the hilt. But most pick and choose what they like to believe in. Is this a true Libertarian? Probably not, but none the less, the party is growing. I don't think there are that many people who support every single policy and ideology that their party puts out. Despite what imbeciles like Joe think, you don't need to tow the line verbatum.

You don't tow any line except for the Liberal one.

I'm shocked Joe - but I thought we were following your model of discourse - where a person makes grand pronouncements of opinion as truth regardless of whether or not evidence exists to back them up? Perhaps you can point me in the direction of the rule book so we can all operate on the same page.

The problem is that you libs take offense when someone calls you as such. I am honored when i'm called a right wing-nut, or a conservative.

If i were to call you a progressive - you'd be happy. However, its interchangeable with lib. So I'll stick with lib, so that you'll continue to foam at the mouth.

Rules? I don't know of any rules.

Actually Joe, it makes me laugh - because these rants only serve to make you look stupid in public.

Good, then I'm glad you get entertainment.

One could have mistaken it for liberal rage, but either way its cool.

Have you read any of my posts? Yes, I tend to side more liberally on some issues, but I have viewpoints that would generally be called conservative. But then again, I don't think you actually read peoples posts. Joe, are you in fact a forum bot?

Lets hear it then. Where are you conservative?

Edited October 30, 2009 by Joseph & Ana

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Where are you Libertarian, Joe?

Enough with the fluff pronouncements - substance please!