Filing for the Second time - So please provide any Help/input

[isitasham 1]

It has been confirmed that the New Delhi Consulate has sent back our K-1 case to NVC/USCIS. So now we are in a dilemma whether to wait for USCIS's decision or should we go ahead and get married and start the CR-1 process. I am leaving for india next week. I am trying to be objective and here are some questions concerns I have:

Given the odds that the USCIS will decide in our favor are what? May be 50/50? The time that it is going to take to go through the whole gambit – probably 5-6 months? So I am leaning towards going the CR-1 route but my concerns are as follows:

1. I had thought that we had plenty of evidence when we filed the K-1 and was quite confident, but obviously, that didn’t work out. There are several factors that could be playing against us such as (a) Age difference of 16 years. (B) She (my fiancée) is a widow from a very traditional background in a small town in north India where as I have been living in the US for over 20 years but originally from the same native state as hers in India © Her 14 year old daughter is not wanting to come to the US (therefore, she could say in the interview that she is not willing. In fact, during the K-1 interview the CO had asked my fiancée that is the daughter willing and she replied “NO”). (d) I have been divorced now for 8 years and this could also be playing against me.

2. So given the things that are against us, what is the likelihood that we will run into the same issues as we did with the K-1 process and get denied for CR-1. Does the marriage make our case any stronger or these things will surface again in the CO’s mind.

3. My fiancée is also concerned (a valid concern) that if we are denied again after marriage then what -- she has to survive in that very traditional culture of a small town – a big risk for her.

4. To add to all this is the fact that we both do not want to have a ceremonious wedding – we are thinking of having only immediate family and some close friends in a temple setting. It will be a hindu ritualistic wedding and will be registered after wards.

5. Our major challenge is how to overcome or dispel this notion from the CO’s mind that this is not a “marriage of convenience” or a fraud but this is what the situation really is and we really love each other and care for each other.

6. Some of the things I have in mind are having sworn affidavits from friends (invitees), the priest, lots of pictures, add in the local newspaper etc.

7. So given all the above what should we do to ensure that this time around we make this a very strong case even though we have all the above limitations. I would appreciate any suggestions/comments any thing at this point.

[sachinky 465]

What was the stated reason for denial?

Did you have an engagement ceremony? Very critical. Because you're petitioning for your fiancee not your girlfriend. But make sure it's not a Bollywood style as they might think you got married instead.

Get pictures. TONS of pictures. Affidavits. From your side. And her side as well. Has it been sent back to the U.S. already? If not, try your level best to keep it at the embassy level. You, as the USC, should inquire about the status, insist on finding the exact reason for denial and then try and bolster your case. Whether it's pictures or financial documents, give them what they want.

Maybe a little more about the interview questions would be more helpful.

[catknit 144]

It has been confirmed that the New Delhi Consulate has sent back our K-1 case to NVC/USCIS. So now we are in a dilemma whether to wait for USCIS's decision or should we go ahead and get married and start the CR-1 process. I am leaving for india next week. I am trying to be objective and here are some questions concerns I have:

Given the odds that the USCIS will decide in our favor are what? May be 50/50? The time that it is going to take to go through the whole gambit – probably 5-6 months? So I am leaning towards going the CR-1 route but my concerns are as follows:

1. I had thought that we had plenty of evidence when we filed the K-1 and was quite confident, but obviously, that didn’t work out. There are several factors that could be playing against us such as (a) Age difference of 16 years. (B) She (my fiancée) is a widow from a very traditional background in a small town in north India where as I have been living in the US for over 20 years but originally from the same native state as hers in India © Her 14 year old daughter is not wanting to come to the US (therefore, she could say in the interview that she is not willing. In fact, during the K-1 interview the CO had asked my fiancée that is the daughter willing and she replied “NO”). (d) I have been divorced now for 8 years and this could also be playing against me.

2. So given the things that are against us, what is the likelihood that we will run into the same issues as we did with the K-1 process and get denied for CR-1. Does the marriage make our case any stronger or these things will surface again in the CO’s mind.

3. My fiancée is also concerned (a valid concern) that if we are denied again after marriage then what -- she has to survive in that very traditional culture of a small town – a big risk for her.

4. To add to all this is the fact that we both do not want to have a ceremonious wedding – we are thinking of having only immediate family and some close friends in a temple setting. It will be a hindu ritualistic wedding and will be registered after wards.

5. Our major challenge is how to overcome or dispel this notion from the CO’s mind that this is not a “marriage of convenience” or a fraud but this is what the situation really is and we really love each other and care for each other.

6. Some of the things I have in mind are having sworn affidavits from friends (invitees), the priest, lots of pictures, add in the local newspaper etc.

7. So given all the above what should we do to ensure that this time around we make this a very strong case even though we have all the above limitations. I would appreciate any suggestions/comments any thing at this point.

1) Age difference can be a factor, no doubt about it. For a place like India, having the man older shouldn't be a red flag - the 16 years may have raised an eyebrow but it isn't unheard of in India at all.

Traditional background can be a strength or weakness to a case - two traditional people engaged makes "sense". A mixed couple in that sense may send up a red flag.

The 14 year old not wanting to move with her mother when a father is not in the picture may have been the biggest red flag from what you mentioned. No one can be a psychic and figure out what the COs were thinking but I could see the questions become, "Well, what happens to the fatherless daughter? How typical would this be in a "normal" Indian family". Is she in a competitive school or convent school where there is a huge advantage to her staying in India? If that's the case, I'd bring it up in whatever new petition you file.

The time span from your divorce would strengthen the case in my mind [one of the things that can be a red flag is a naturalized USC divorcing once obtaining citizenship and then petitioning for their "real love" from home almost immediately - you have 8 years behind you, it's more than obvious you are not doing that

scam].

2) CR1's hold more weight - you've committed to the marriage at that point. If there was nothing glaringly wrong with your original petition, chances are the service center will look at the returned petition and your current petition and pass it on thru. That should alleviate any issues with relationship "bona fides". If you ended up with a reaffirmed K1 - they can NOT return it based on the concept of non-legitimate relationship. Some attorneys abide by the same theory with a CR1 filled after a denied K1 - the service center is now on record a 2nd time stating the relationship holds water.

3) Legit concern on her part - my [limited] knowledge is that a CR1 can't expire; if there are issues it will go back to be readjudicated but it will take time. As long as you are legally married and there are no other issues lurking in the closet - eventually you should be able to prove your case. It may be a long hard road though.

4) Should be fine given your circumstances - 2nd marriage for both parties involved. If you were 20 somethings from upper class families, the CO may be concerned if you didn't hold a Bollywood extravaganza .

5)This will be paramount to address in your CR1 application - kaushalia has successful experience with this...hopefully she'll chime in.

6)All good ideas but don't neglect even old school relationship proof - weekly letters or cards - they can hold weight too.

I would suggest taking a phone consult with a reputable attorney - give him/her the whole story and see what they say. I'd suggest Marc Ellis [a member here] as well as the Murthy Group [they have satelite offices in India - I found the Murthy Group not as well versed on family immigration issues but very experienced with India-centric issues - if you can only take one go with Marc Ellis - he was top notch and well versed in the ins and outs of returned petitions and family immigration issues. I'm just curious if the issues with your case are just very India-centric and that's why I'm mentioning Murthy].

[produke 0]

pictures, wedding card, movie, letters, calling cards can make ur case strong. It seems you are in a tough situation, and its important to find out reason for denial. best wishes...

[isitasham 1]

Thanks so much for the insight. Here are the additional details:

Stated reason for denial – Documents submitted by you are unable to establish that a credible relationship exists between yourself and petitioner. The fiancé visa petition was valid for 4 months from the date of approval. Your petition was approved on ……and since then four months have elapsed. Because the consular officer was not convinced with the relationship between yourself and the petitioner, petition has not been revalidated. We are returning the petition to NVC…………etc.

In response to Catknit’s question, my case may be India centric and especially, North-india centric. Here is something I’ll share about the CO who interviewed my fiancée – it was a Caucasian lady who could speak a few words of “Punjabi”. She was probably already pre-disposed having looked at the documents and was very unfriendly – did not respond to the greetings from my fiancée; was sort of cold and was trying to showoff her knowledge of the “Punjabi” culture, not realizing that my fiancée is not from the Punjabi culture. A little knowledge on CO’s part could be a dangerous thing……..

I am afraid that the case might again go to the same CO as she “supposedly” might have established herself as the expert in “North Indian” culture in the New Delhi consulate.

It has been confirmed that the New Delhi Consulate has sent back our K-1 case to NVC/USCIS. So now we are in a dilemma whether to wait for USCIS's decision or should we go ahead and get married and start the CR-1 process. I am leaving for india next week. I am trying to be objective and here are some questions concerns I have:

Given the odds that the USCIS will decide in our favor are what? May be 50/50? The time that it is going to take to go through the whole gambit – probably 5-6 months? So I am leaning towards going the CR-1 route but my concerns are as follows:

1. I had thought that we had plenty of evidence when we filed the K-1 and was quite confident, but obviously, that didn’t work out. There are several factors that could be playing against us such as (a) Age difference of 16 years. (B) She (my fiancée) is a widow from a very traditional background in a small town in north India where as I have been living in the US for over 20 years but originally from the same native state as hers in India © Her 14 year old daughter is not wanting to come to the US (therefore, she could say in the interview that she is not willing. In fact, during the K-1 interview the CO had asked my fiancée that is the daughter willing and she replied “NO”). (d) I have been divorced now for 8 years and this could also be playing against me.

2. So given the things that are against us, what is the likelihood that we will run into the same issues as we did with the K-1 process and get denied for CR-1. Does the marriage make our case any stronger or these things will surface again in the CO’s mind.

3. My fiancée is also concerned (a valid concern) that if we are denied again after marriage then what -- she has to survive in that very traditional culture of a small town – a big risk for her.

4. To add to all this is the fact that we both do not want to have a ceremonious wedding – we are thinking of having only immediate family and some close friends in a temple setting. It will be a hindu ritualistic wedding and will be registered after wards.

5. Our major challenge is how to overcome or dispel this notion from the CO’s mind that this is not a “marriage of convenience” or a fraud but this is what the situation really is and we really love each other and care for each other.

6. Some of the things I have in mind are having sworn affidavits from friends (invitees), the priest, lots of pictures, add in the local newspaper etc.

7. So given all the above what should we do to ensure that this time around we make this a very strong case even though we have all the above limitations. I would appreciate any suggestions/comments any thing at this point.

1) Age difference can be a factor, no doubt about it. For a place like India, having the man older shouldn't be a red flag - the 16 years may have raised an eyebrow but it isn't unheard of in India at all.

Traditional background can be a strength or weakness to a case - two traditional people engaged makes "sense". A mixed couple in that sense may send up a red flag.

The 14 year old not wanting to move with her mother when a father is not in the picture may have been the biggest red flag from what you mentioned. No one can be a psychic and figure out what the COs were thinking but I could see the questions become, "Well, what happens to the fatherless daughter? How typical would this be in a "normal" Indian family". Is she in a competitive school or convent school where there is a huge advantage to her staying in India? If that's the case, I'd bring it up in whatever new petition you file.

The time span from your divorce would strengthen the case in my mind [one of the things that can be a red flag is a naturalized USC divorcing once obtaining citizenship and then petitioning for their "real love" from home almost immediately - you have 8 years behind you, it's more than obvious you are not doing that

scam].

2) CR1's hold more weight - you've committed to the marriage at that point. If there was nothing glaringly wrong with your original petition, chances are the service center will look at the returned petition and your current petition and pass it on thru. That should alleviate any issues with relationship "bona fides". If you ended up with a reaffirmed K1 - they can NOT return it based on the concept of non-legitimate relationship. Some attorneys abide by the same theory with a CR1 filled after a denied K1 - the service center is now on record a 2nd time stating the relationship holds water.

3) Legit concern on her part - my [limited] knowledge is that a CR1 can't expire; if there are issues it will go back to be readjudicated but it will take time. As long as you are legally married and there are no other issues lurking in the closet - eventually you should be able to prove your case. It may be a long hard road though.

4) Should be fine given your circumstances - 2nd marriage for both parties involved. If you were 20 somethings from upper class families, the CO may be concerned if you didn't hold a Bollywood extravaganza .

5)This will be paramount to address in your CR1 application - kaushalia has successful experience with this...hopefully she'll chime in.

6)All good ideas but don't neglect even old school relationship proof - weekly letters or cards - they can hold weight too.

I would suggest taking a phone consult with a reputable attorney - give him/her the whole story and see what they say. I'd suggest Marc Ellis [a member here] as well as the Murthy Group [they have satelite offices in India - I found the Murthy Group not as well versed on family immigration issues but very experienced with India-centric issues - if you can only take one go with Marc Ellis - he was top notch and well versed in the ins and outs of returned petitions and family immigration issues. I'm just curious if the issues with your case are just very India-centric and that's why I'm mentioning Murthy].

[catknit 144]

A little knowledge on CO’s part could be a dangerous thing……..

Very true - on one of my recent trips to the consulate I heard a CO grilling a woman on why she wasn't still wearing the bangles from the wedding - that it was the CO's knowledge that bangles are worn for the first year and here it was however many months later and the woman had arrived bare armed. I'll give the interveiwee credit for keeping her cool, explaining that she had kept them on for a month but for reasons X, Y, Z she had opted to not be bangled to the hilt everyday.

In the CO's defense, I will say that a LOT of the women I'd see waiting to interveiw were typically in very flashy - wedding festivity type attire and bangled up [whether they wore them everyday - I don't know].

The COs are working off the "typical" and "normal" - middle of the bell curve type mentality; they want to see what would fit a textbook case [Family A meets with Family B and they decide on the marriage - there are 2 + trips, one for the engagement party, the castes match, maybe the astrology matches, the educations match - blah, blah, blah - OR it's a love marriage based on something tangible and easily recognizable, met at uni, met at work, went over to see grandma/grandpa and met at a party]. Given the absolute range of traditions and cultures in India NO ONE can know everything. If the CO thought she fit a Punjabi profile and then the answers didn't match up...well, the denial can be the result. I know it hurts - trust me, been there. And it seems so completely unfair - because you know how you feel, what your plans are, and you just hit a huge wall. But, there are steps forward and the CR1 may be the way to go.

I'd still talk with Marc Ellis - this is definitely a perception issue of your relationship [in the context of Indian culture] and not some random Indian bureacratic mishap [which is where I think Murthy may have the upper hand being on the ground here].

[sachinky 465]

Could you give us a range of questions asked at the interview? Might help us pick up on something.

[isitasham 1]

A little knowledge on CO’s part could be a dangerous thing……..

Very true - on one of my recent trips to the consulate I heard a CO grilling a woman on why she wasn't still wearing the bangles from the wedding - that it was the CO's knowledge that bangles are worn for the first year and here it was however many months later and the woman had arrived bare armed. I'll give the interveiwee credit for keeping her cool, explaining that she had kept them on for a month but for reasons X, Y, Z she had opted to not be bangled to the hilt everyday.

In the CO's defense, I will say that a LOT of the women I'd see waiting to interveiw were typically in very flashy - wedding festivity type attire and bangled up [whether they wore them everyday - I don't know].

The COs are working off the "typical" and "normal" - middle of the bell curve type mentality; they want to see what would fit a textbook case [Family A meets with Family B and they decide on the marriage - there are 2 + trips, one for the engagement party, the castes match, maybe the astrology matches, the educations match - blah, blah, blah - OR it's a love marriage based on something tangible and easily recognizable, met at uni, met at work, went over to see grandma/grandpa and met at a party]. Given the absolute range of traditions and cultures in India NO ONE can know everything. If the CO thought she fit a Punjabi profile and then the answers didn't match up...well, the denial can be the result. I know it hurts - trust me, been there. And it seems so completely unfair - because you know how you feel, what your plans are, and you just hit a huge wall. But, there are steps forward and the CR1 may be the way to go.

I'd still talk with Marc Ellis - this is definitely a perception issue of your relationship [in the context of Indian culture] and not some random Indian bureacratic mishap [which is where I think Murthy may have the upper hand being on the ground here].

You are absolutely right Catknit.........its a question of how you deal with the perception (based on "Normal") vs. your typical case/situation. You as benefactor are doomed if you do something outlandish (that doesn't fit the normal) and then if you do do the "standard stuff " then you do not have a good enough case............

Questions asked by CO were typical:

1. How did you meet your finacee.?

2. What does your fiancée do?

3. How many times was your fiancée married before?

4. Do have any picture – handed over the pictures.

5. Does your daughter want to go to the US – answer no.

15 minutes later the CO comes back with the 221(g)

[Twisted K 2]

Sorry, I do not know most of the answers to your question, concerning the divorce or child involved. However, I can give you my experience on the refile. IMHO, I would not get married on this trip, because I was told it could raise another red flag that you heard about the denial coming, and immediately rushed to get married. What we ultimately decided to do was just have a fun vacation for valentines, then I would make another trip to get married. when i returned from our wedding in june, i put together 3 binders (should have, in all propability, been 1, but didn't realize that until after it had been sent) organizing our nearly 2 year relationship. I made sure to address everything, line by line, of our k1 journey (with the previous uscis file number so they could have full access), including the 221g and what steps we took to resolve the issue. (to get a complete list, feel free to click here. I organized everything with a table of contents and sent it off. All-in-all, the package was 11 pounds and 3 oz. 77 days after the NOA1, we received our approval, with no rfe's.

I think it is important, when re-filing, to disclose everything. People were telling me that we were overdoing it, but I firmly believe that when it is concerning your life, there is no such thing as over-doing. If you have any other questions, don't hesitate to ask. It is a lot of work, and will take a lot of time. We are actually coming up on our 1 year anniversary of his first interview (just to give you a quick timeline). It was on November 12, 2008 where he was given the initial 221g (which in all honesty, was pre-determined before the interview, just by looking at our documents.) The CO said everything went fine, just give us these documents, and you will get your visa. So after consulting our useless attorney (who finally admitted that he did not have any experiences with denials) we submitted everything we could on Nov 14. After daily calls and emails to the embassy, on Dec 29th, they told us they did not believe the evidence we sent was enough, and they are returning our petition for further review.

Good luck in your decision, and remember, love and persistence will prevail

[Twisted K 2]

sorry, the "click here" did not work: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...=204020&hl=

[isitasham 1]

sorry, the "click here" did not work: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...=204020&hl=

I would not get married on this trip, because I was told it could raise another red flag that you heard about the denial coming, and immediately rushed to get married..........

Kaushalia, Thank you again so much for sharing. Here is the thing, if I don't get married on this trip...........then it could be another year or 9 months before I could go back to get married and that would then mean almost 1 1/2 to 2 years or so before she gets here. I am trying to understand the red flag issue presented to you.............given the time its going to take to wait for the USCIS decision, it would seem normal for any couple to get married and start the CR-1 process to save time............ the intent was always there to get married even with the K-1 petition.............then why should it be a red flag? Just tyring to understand the reasoning behind it?

[Twisted K 2]

i would start by reading this article by marc ellis: http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0323-ellis.shtm

again, i would strongly suggest you speak with him for advice. it is a difficult situation to get through, and i am definitely not an attorney. i would hate to give you the wrong advice. know what i mean? marc is extremely helpful, and has researched this up and down, and i would say knows his stuff more than anyone i know.

also, there is another extremely helpful person who i sought after for a lot of my guidance. her name on here is ~kiyah. although she will tell you she is not an attorney, she has been through this, and now has her husband here with her. she started the pinned topic at the top of the MENA forum on returned petitions. once you get through the pages of wanting to get it pinned, there is some awesome information: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3896

i found that if you post on here, then someone is bound to come and answer. these are the people who have been through the returned petitions and are living in the usa with their spouses.

i can offer information where i can, but i am also still in the middle of the process, which is why i don't want to steer you wrong. i will also do my best to point you in the right directions.

kiyah also has a lot of article links on her signature. i would advise reading those.

[isitasham 1]

i would start by reading this article by marc ellis: http://www.ilw.com/articles/2006,0323-ellis.shtm

again, i would strongly suggest you speak with him for advice. it is a difficult situation to get through, and i am definitely not an attorney. i would hate to give you the wrong advice. know what i mean? marc is extremely helpful, and has researched this up and down, and i would say knows his stuff more than anyone i know.

also, there is another extremely helpful person who i sought after for a lot of my guidance. her name on here is ~kiyah. although she will tell you she is not an attorney, she has been through this, and now has her husband here with her. she started the pinned topic at the top of the MENA forum on returned petitions. once you get through the pages of wanting to get it pinned, there is some awesome information: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3896

i found that if you post on here, then someone is bound to come and answer. these are the people who have been through the returned petitions and are living in the usa with their spouses.

i can offer information where i can, but i am also still in the middle of the process, which is why i don't want to steer you wrong. i will also do my best to point you in the right directions.

kiyah also has a lot of article links on her signature. i would advise reading those.

Thank you Kaushalia, the link is very beneficial.............I think i get it..........its far more complicated...................yes, I will contact Marc Ellis.........

[isitasham 1]

A little knowledge on CO’s part could be a dangerous thing……..

Very true - on one of my recent trips to the consulate I heard a CO grilling a woman on why she wasn't still wearing the bangles from the wedding - that it was the CO's knowledge that bangles are worn for the first year and here it was however many months later and the woman had arrived bare armed. I'll give the interveiwee credit for keeping her cool, explaining that she had kept them on for a month but for reasons X, Y, Z she had opted to not be bangled to the hilt everyday.

In the CO's defense, I will say that a LOT of the women I'd see waiting to interveiw were typically in very flashy - wedding festivity type attire and bangled up [whether they wore them everyday - I don't know].

The COs are working off the "typical" and "normal" - middle of the bell curve type mentality; they want to see what would fit a textbook case [Family A meets with Family B and they decide on the marriage - there are 2 + trips, one for the engagement party, the castes match, maybe the astrology matches, the educations match - blah, blah, blah - OR it's a love marriage based on something tangible and easily recognizable, met at uni, met at work, went over to see grandma/grandpa and met at a party]. Given the absolute range of traditions and cultures in India NO ONE can know everything. If the CO thought she fit a Punjabi profile and then the answers didn't match up...well, the denial can be the result. I know it hurts - trust me, been there. And it seems so completely unfair - because you know how you feel, what your plans are, and you just hit a huge wall. But, there are steps forward and the CR1 may be the way to go.

I'd still talk with Marc Ellis - this is definitely a perception issue of your relationship [in the context of Indian culture] and not some random Indian bureacratic mishap [which is where I think Murthy may have the upper hand being on the ground here].

You are absolutely right Catknit.........its a question of how you deal with the perception (based on "Normal") vs. your typical case/situation. You as benefactor are doomed if you do something outlandish (that doesn't fit the normal) and then if you do do the "standard stuff " then you do not have a good enough case............

Questions asked by CO were typical:

Questions asked:

1. How did you meet your fiancé?

2. What does your fiancé do?

3. How many times was your fiancé married before?

4. Do have any pictures – handed over the pictures.

5. Any pictures of your fiancé with the children – answer NO

6. Did he meet the Children? - answer NO because of short trip (see explanation below).

7. Does your daughter (14 yr. old) want to go to the US – answer NO.

15 minutes later the CO comes back with the 221(g)

Yesterday, I forgot to include 2 important questions that were asked -- see questions 5 and 6. Believe me, I was sleep deprived, and now when I think about it, these probably are the most crucial questions that got us into the AP to begin with. Would eveyone agree with that its these 2 questions along with Q7 that are the major issues here??

[isitasham 1]

A little knowledge on CO’s part could be a dangerous thing……..

Very true - on one of my recent trips to the consulate I heard a CO grilling a woman on why she wasn't still wearing the bangles from the wedding - that it was the CO's knowledge that bangles are worn for the first year and here it was however many months later and the woman had arrived bare armed. I'll give the interveiwee credit for keeping her cool, explaining that she had kept them on for a month but for reasons X, Y, Z she had opted to not be bangled to the hilt everyday.

In the CO's defense, I will say that a LOT of the women I'd see waiting to interveiw were typically in very flashy - wedding festivity type attire and bangled up [whether they wore them everyday - I don't know].

The COs are working off the "typical" and "normal" - middle of the bell curve type mentality; they want to see what would fit a textbook case [Family A meets with Family B and they decide on the marriage - there are 2 + trips, one for the engagement party, the castes match, maybe the astrology matches, the educations match - blah, blah, blah - OR it's a love marriage based on something tangible and easily recognizable, met at uni, met at work, went over to see grandma/grandpa and met at a party]. Given the absolute range of traditions and cultures in India NO ONE can know everything. If the CO thought she fit a Punjabi profile and then the answers didn't match up...well, the denial can be the result. I know it hurts - trust me, been there. And it seems so completely unfair - because you know how you feel, what your plans are, and you just hit a huge wall. But, there are steps forward and the CR1 may be the way to go.

I'd still talk with Marc Ellis - this is definitely a perception issue of your relationship [in the context of Indian culture] and not some random Indian bureacratic mishap [which is where I think Murthy may have the upper hand being on the ground here].

You are absolutely right Catknit.........its a question of how you deal with the perception (based on "Normal") vs. your typical case/situation. You as benefactor are doomed if you do something outlandish (that doesn't fit the normal) and then if you do do the "standard stuff " then you do not have a good enough case............

Questions asked by CO were typical:

Questions asked:

1. How did you meet your fiancé?

2. What does your fiancé do?

3. How many times was your fiancé married before?

4. Do have any pictures – handed over the pictures.

5. Any pictures of your fiancé with the children – answer NO

6. Did he meet the Children? - answer NO because of short trip (see explanation below).

7. Does your daughter (14 yr. old) want to go to the US – answer NO.

15 minutes later the CO comes back with the 221(g)

Yesterday, I forgot to include 2 important questions that were asked -- see questions 5 and 6. Believe me, I was sleep deprived, and now when I think about it, these probably are the most crucial questions that got us into the AP to begin with. Would eveyone agree with that its these 2 questions along with Q7 that are the major issues here??

Hello all,

I want to thank each one of you for your valuable input our questions. We are still undecided as to what course of action we need to take. Here is more information regarding the 221(g) and our resonses to it. This is information that CO already has and will be shared with DHS. We would like feedback from you as to what you think about the responses or did we already screw it up by stating something that we shoudn't have?

Thanks again!

These were the 221(g) requirements:

Please provide the following proof of relationship……..

1. Notarized explanation of how and when you first met and why you decided to get engaged.

2. List of all engagement ceremony guests and their relationship to you with addresses/phone. Please do not include immediate family.

3. Itemized emails, postmarked cards letter b/w you and your fiancé.

4. Photos of you and petitioner before, during, and after engagement.

5. Notarized statements signed by applicant’s parents discussing their views on this engagement.

6. Notarized copy of your fiancés passport.

7. Voter’s ID card and voters lists for the past 5 years.

Following are excerpts from our response submitted to 221(g) specifically to their requirements 1 and 2

1. Petitioner could not meet my children during his stay in India partly due to time constraints as the final decision to get engaged was not made until Oct... and also due to the fact that it is a given that children are a part of this package. We are aware of, and fully understand the responsibilities of each of our children on either side without feeling the absolute necessity of meeting them. My teen-age daughter is not fully comfortable with my re-marriage and we continue to work with her because of her difficult teen-age years. In addition, she was very attached to her late father and finds it difficult that there could be another man in her mother’s life.

2. Being a widow with two children, I strongly believe, and so does my family that my marriage to Petitioner will be a positive thing for my life, my future, and my children’s future.

Given the fact that this would be a re-marriage for both of us the engagement ceremony was kept low key with only immediate family members present. The engagement was however, conducted with full hindu religious rituals (pictures attached) by the priest ………... Priest’s contact details are below:…….

Reference the Fourth Item under Proof of Relationship to be submitted – Photos of you and the petitioner before, during and after your engagement.

I would like to add that this engagement and the subsequent marriage that would take place is not a typical situation but an extra-ordinary one because of the following:

1. This will be a case of re-marriage for both me and my fiancé.

2. There are children involved on both sides.

3. I am from a conservative family residing in a small town setting with a less permissive social environment.

Given the above extra-ordinary circumstances, and because of petitioner’s short stay in India, we had limited time that we were able to spend with each other, not giving us the opportunity for a leisure travel or to take pictures.