dealing with a vindictive ex

[venusfire503 54]

I'm not sure what happened.

My marriage (past one, not current one) was not good. When he filed for divorce, though, it seemed like things were going along just fine. I even joked that we were better at divorce than at marriage! I know part of it was the total relief of no longer trying to keep together a dead relationship. Someone I met recently met my ex before, and commented how she couldn't believe that we had been married in the past because we were SO different. It's true - we were very mis-matched, and it just got worse and worse over the years (almost 19).

Anyway, over time our "good divorce" has gotten really bad. I do my best to just ignore him - and I even saw an article once about things that people sometimes do that inadvertently cause extra problems in a divorce situation. I do my best to keep things as cordial as possible, but somehow it's just not working anymore.

My ex is the one who filed for divorce - and it's not like I was cheating or anything - we just weren't happy together. He started dating before I did, although I did get married first. He's married now, though.

I was a stay at home mom for many years, and have slowly been getting on my feet. He's a successful business owner, so my settlement has carried me through so far (my income isn't very high right now - since I was not working for so long, I had to start all over, but with three kids - and a husband who is also more or less starting over in a new country). I purposely told my lawyer from the beginning that I did NOT want to go for as much money as I very likely could have gotten - I was happy enough with what I was offered, and didn't want to drag things out and/or create tension. She kept trying to get me to change my mind, so I fired her and got a new lawyer.

I know my ex isn't happy about having to give me money every month (the reason it's not just child support is that I knew he couldn't give me a lump sum, and came up with the idea of payments over time instead of him having to go into debt out the butt and pay tons of interest on loans) - it easily could have been MUCH more if I was greedy. The amount will go down next year, too. I don't expect him to thank me for taking it easier on him or anything, but I think I deserve some amount of respect for helping him become so successful, giving up a good job to take care of the children (which I loved doing, don't get me wrong - but I felt like a single mother much of the time since he was always so busy and unavailable), and then taking only as much of the marital assets as I really needed to stay in this (expensive) area while getting back into the workforce. Trust me, I'm happy I can pay my bills, but it's not like I'm living the rich life (my house is about half the size of his, for example - and cost less than half as much) - which is fine with me. My car is 10 years old, and I can't afford to get another one. I'm content to live the way I do while I build my resume more. My kids have food and clothes, and are happy.

I also know it bothers him that I've moved on and am happy now - but he has moved on as well.

Why can't he just leave me alone? I've figured out how to just ignore him and pretend I didn't hear all the nasty comments he makes to my face, not respond to nastiness in email, and put things as neutrally as I can myself.

People say to just ignore him, but I can't. It's impossible to ignore CPS investigating you because your ex decided to file false abuse allegations against you and your husband (we of course were cleared, but it was a huge, heartbreaking, expensive disruption in our lives, and it really affected the kids). It's impossible to ignore letters sent through lawyers alleging that you're a horrible mother who doesn't take care of your kids. It's impossible to ignore the time, stress, and expense (emotional as well as financial) of having to defend your right to spend time with your kids when your ex tries to take the kids through an emergency custody petition (he failed, thank God - the judge saw there was no basis for the petition) and then tries again for 'regular' custody. Right now, we're scheduled to go to court in a few weeks, and I'm nervously waiting to find out how much more money my lawyer needs beforehand - and hoping I have enough left in my savings account.

How can I make this end? I mean, short of him getting hit by a truck someday, is this just going to go on and on until the youngest turns 18? Is there anything I can do? I've been trying to research this, but no one has been able to give me any answers.

I know I'm not perfect, but I really am doing my best to be a nice person, and avoid all this hassle. I try to be an upbeat person, but the stress of this (everything else in my life is anywhere from 'ok' to "really wonderful" - which I'm thankful for) just gets to me - and is affecting me and my husband (he hates to see me unhappy - plus my ex is a total jerk to him).

The only thing I know I'm doing to bother him is to be happy without him.

Please, don't make this one of those notorious OT-type threads - I really want to get helpful advice - not bashed.

I was thinking maybe someone would have suggestions. It would be great if my ex and I could just have a civil discussion, and I could find out if I'm doing something that is causing all his venom toward me, but I don't see that happening. I even suggested to him last year that we go to some kind of mediator or something, but he wasn't interested.

venusfire

[Christi and Ian 24]

Can you file for full custody of the children? Obviously ignoring him isn't working. If you bite back, perhaps he'll go back to his corner. Or perhaps you can file some sort of harassment lawsuit? It seems logical, especially if you've been exonerated of all of the allegations against you.

Or there's always gas money and a shovel...(just kidding!)

[TracyHamza 1]

well, it sounds to me like he is one of those ex's who doesn't like the idea of you being happy in your new life....from what you say i think you have been way too kind to him thru the divorce and after everything he put you, your husband and your kids thru...by him making those accusations and getting CPS involved when there was no reason is not only hurting you but your kids as well...i think he did that out of spite really (perhaps jealousy over your new hubby or maybe his new wife is prodding him..it's hard to tell)....i would definitely try to get some sort of action taken, ie. restraining order or harassment if it continues....i don't like confrontation either but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and say enough... maybe if you show him you have had enough he will let you and your family have a little peace...stand your ground and good luck...i hope things get better for you

[TracyHamza 1]

well, it sounds to me like he is one of those ex's who doesn't like the idea of you being happy in your new life....from what you say i think you have been way too kind to him thru the divorce and after everything he put you, your husband and your kids thru...by him making those accusations and getting CPS involved when there was no reason is not only hurting you but your kids as well...i think he did that out of spite really (perhaps jealousy over your new hubby or maybe his new wife is prodding him..it's hard to tell)....i would definitely try to get some sort of action taken, ie. restraining order or harassment if it continues....i don't like confrontation either but sometimes you have to bite the bullet and say enough... maybe if you show him you have had enough he will let you and your family have a little peace...stand your ground and good luck...i hope things get better for you

oh yeah....and i think having a video recorder handy every time he comes over is a BIG attitude adjuster....see if he gets nasty while you film his every visit......

[Y's_habibitk 2]

did the civilness end abruptly or over time? was it right after you got married? do you think he is threatened by having another man help raise his kids? maybe if you can find the root of this nonsense, you can go from there.

im sorry that i dont have any wise advise. i think the above poster has a point with the harrasment suit(since he obviously is harrassing you via the family court system)but that might just create an even larger problem than you already have not to mention more stress on the children.

Edited October 17, 2009 by Y's_habibitk

[venusfire503 54]

Can you file for full custody of the children? Obviously ignoring him isn't working. If you bite back, perhaps he'll go back to his corner. Or perhaps you can file some sort of harassment lawsuit? It seems logical, especially if you've been exonerated of all of the allegations against you.

Or there's always gas money and a shovel...(just kidding!)

The thing is, he's the one who already filed for primary custody. My lawyer said I could file against him after our court case if things don't go well, but I'd have to have a 'good' reason that didn't come up in court.

Oh, if I was an atheist who thought I wouldn't get caught... well, even then, I wouldn't want to put my kids through that....

If I had known he was going to be like this, I would've filed for full custody first. Instead, I thought I'd let things go as they were originally set up - with me having 60% custody (since my schedule allows more availability). I thought he'd be ok with it, since he was fine with it for a few years, and since the custody schedule was originally set up to accommodate his work schedule. That's the real kicker - he filed for primary custody, even though his work schedule would require him to get his wife or a babysitter to watch them if they spent any more time at his house. On the other hand, I'm always here when my kids are. Plus, if he was really interested in more time with them, why doesn't he show up earlier than he does? He COULD come right after work to get them those days, but he goes home and relaxes first. Also, I've always said "yes" when he wants to see them on holidays - but he never wants them more than 2 hours. I even suggested last summer that he take them a little longer because it was so hot and he has an inground pool, and all we had for them was a little kiddie pool and a hose.... but he brought them back right away. Oh, also - he doesn't always ask to see them for holidays or birthdays anymore. I even suggested in the past that he could pick up just the oldest (who occasionally wants to get away from her younger siblings) for lunch or something when they're with me on the weekend, but he hasn't done it even ONE TIME.

I'm firmly convinced that he's doing it to lower his child support payments. My lawyer said if he even gets one more night (50%), then it would go down quite a bit. As it is, he's already getting credit for extra days - he picks them up at 7 in the evening, keeps them for a day, then drops them off early the next morning. They count where the kids sleep at night, so he gets two nights for having them one day. Many non-custodial parents just get them one evening in between weekends, and don't save on child support for doing so. If I was an a-hole, I would've argued against it - him only having them 2 to 4 nights every two weeks instead of 6 would've given me much more child support (oh, and my first lawyer even pointed out that the amount he offered and I accepted was lower than the law allowed even then) - but again, I'm happy to get just enough to get by - I'm not greedy. If I could get a really good job, I'd honestly tell him to shove his money, and put anything he did give me into accounts for the kids. I just don't see the point of them being with their stepmother or a babysitter when I'm available. I'm not trying to deny him time with the kids. Like I said, I could've fought against them spending ANY weekday nights with him, and maybe even could've insisted they spend Friday nights with me - then he'd be down to ONE night every two weeks.

GRRRR.... even though I have a decent shot of doing well in court, I'm really running out of money and I've heard of women losing custody just because they run out of money to pay their lawyers to fight to keep their kids.

venusfire

[TracyHamza 1]

did the civilness end abruptly or over time? was it right after you got married? do you think he is threatened by having another man help raise his kids? maybe if you can find the root of this nonsense, you can go from there.

im sorry that i dont have any wise advise. i think the above poster has a point with the harrasment suit(since he obviously is harrassing you via the family court system)but that might just create an even larger problem than you already have not to mention more stress on the children.

i agree...it's a shame the ex don't or won't see that it hurts the children.....but some people like being vindictive i guess

[Y's_habibitk 2]

did the civilness end abruptly or over time? was it right after you got married? do you think he is threatened by having another man help raise his kids? maybe if you can find the root of this nonsense, you can go from there.

im sorry that i dont have any wise advise. i think the above poster has a point with the harrasment suit(since he obviously is harrassing you via the family court system)but that might just create an even larger problem than you already have not to mention more stress on the children.

i agree...it's a shame the ex don't or won't see that it hurts the children.....but some people like being vindictive i guess

ya, people who use the kids to "get back at" or manipulate the ex make me ill

[TracyHamza 1]

Can you file for full custody of the children? Obviously ignoring him isn't working. If you bite back, perhaps he'll go back to his corner. Or perhaps you can file some sort of harassment lawsuit? It seems logical, especially if you've been exonerated of all of the allegations against you.

Or there's always gas money and a shovel...(just kidding!)

The thing is, he's the one who already filed for primary custody. My lawyer said I could file against him after our court case if things don't go well, but I'd have to have a 'good' reason that didn't come up in court.

Oh, if I was an atheist who thought I wouldn't get caught... well, even then, I wouldn't want to put my kids through that....

If I had known he was going to be like this, I would've filed for full custody first. Instead, I thought I'd let things go as they were originally set up - with me having 60% custody (since my schedule allows more availability). I thought he'd be ok with it, since he was fine with it for a few years, and since the custody schedule was originally set up to accommodate his work schedule. That's the real kicker - he filed for primary custody, even though his work schedule would require him to get his wife or a babysitter to watch them if they spent any more time at his house. On the other hand, I'm always here when my kids are. Plus, if he was really interested in more time with them, why doesn't he show up earlier than he does? He COULD come right after work to get them those days, but he goes home and relaxes first. Also, I've always said "yes" when he wants to see them on holidays - but he never wants them more than 2 hours. I even suggested last summer that he take them a little longer because it was so hot and he has an inground pool, and all we had for them was a little kiddie pool and a hose.... but he brought them back right away. Oh, also - he doesn't always ask to see them for holidays or birthdays anymore. I even suggested in the past that he could pick up just the oldest (who occasionally wants to get away from her younger siblings) for lunch or something when they're with me on the weekend, but he hasn't done it even ONE TIME.

I'm firmly convinced that he's doing it to lower his child support payments. My lawyer said if he even gets one more night (50%), then it would go down quite a bit. As it is, he's already getting credit for extra days - he picks them up at 7 in the evening, keeps them for a day, then drops them off early the next morning. They count where the kids sleep at night, so he gets two nights for having them one day. Many non-custodial parents just get them one evening in between weekends, and don't save on child support for doing so. If I was an a-hole, I would've argued against it - him only having them 2 to 4 nights every two weeks instead of 6 would've given me much more child support (oh, and my first lawyer even pointed out that the amount he offered and I accepted was lower than the law allowed even then) - but again, I'm happy to get just enough to get by - I'm not greedy. If I could get a really good job, I'd honestly tell him to shove his money, and put anything he did give me into accounts for the kids. I just don't see the point of them being with their stepmother or a babysitter when I'm available. I'm not trying to deny him time with the kids. Like I said, I could've fought against them spending ANY weekday nights with him, and maybe even could've insisted they spend Friday nights with me - then he'd be down to ONE night every two weeks.

GRRRR.... even though I have a decent shot of doing well in court, I'm really running out of money and I've heard of women losing custody just because they run out of money to pay their lawyers to fight to keep their kids.

venusfire

is there a set court schedule of when he gets the children?....if so you should keep track of everything...like him being late and what excuse he gives as well as any missed holidays or times that he is supposed to spend time with them

[TracyHamza 1]

i can only offer advice based on my own experience....my first husband (god rest his soul) had this problem with his ex after we were married....she left him and their son years before i met him, retained custody but his son was living with him the whole time..she would only get him on the weekends.. he was a wonderful dad and when we got married this really irritated her i guess so we started having problems....one weekend she was angry that my husband asked her to pick up cory so she called the st police and said she didn't know where we lived and we were keeping cory and wouldn't let him leave.(i thought this was funny because the house we lived in was the one SHE picked out when they were first married and we told the cops this)...sooo...when the police arrived (with her in her car leading the way ..but didn't know where we were) i came out of the house and video taped the entire scene...she then went to file for full custody that monday and was very nasty in her statement.....i told my husband to keep calm and we went and when he filed he explained the entire situation with her leaving and that my husband had been the one who was the sole supporter and that he wished to have full custody....needless to say because of the evidence my husband was granted it......so i know a little about the vindictiveness with ex's....we never had a problem after that.....

Edited October 17, 2009 by anas_tracy_love

[New Beginnings 32]

This may not work at all but what about trying to get a mediator for the whole family or family counseling, him and his wife and you and your husband. Get all of you in the same place and try to work out whatever underlying issue is there.. He's obviously holding on to something and who knows, maybe that could help!

[TracyHamza 1]

This may not work at all but what about trying to get a mediator for the whole family or family counseling, him and his wife and you and your husband. Get all of you in the same place and try to work out whatever underlying issue is there.. He's obviously holding on to something and who knows, maybe that could help!

that's a good suggestion too....but considering what the ex has done to her already with the whole alleged abuse thing it's highly unlikely on his part (she would have to wonder what would be his motive for suddenly turning up sweet)even if she were willing...and if i were in her place i would have to draw the line after he did that..i hope she can find an amicable solution for her situation...

[venusfire503 54]

This may not work at all but what about trying to get a mediator for the whole family or family counseling, him and his wife and you and your husband. Get all of you in the same place and try to work out whatever underlying issue is there.. He's obviously holding on to something and who knows, maybe that could help!

New Beginnings,

I did try to get him to agree for the two of us to get something like that - some sort of neutral third party - last summer. He was not interested. Then again, we went to marriage counseling off and on for 5 years, and that never got anywhere.

I hope the court orders co-parenting therapy or something like that. For one thing, he thinks co-parenting = "I do what he says".

He's really horrible. The stuff I heard from the kids that I KNOW he said to/around them.... Once, my daughter said something to me, and the following day, my ex used the exact same phrase in an email he sent to me (it was about how many days I had spent in Morocco). Another time, one of the kid's teachers told me that he said something to her (about what I fed them), and it was exactly what my daughter had said to me the night before - right after spending time with her father. Other times, the kids will just come straight out and tell me that he's said things - and I don't ask them, either (and I try not to react - just change the subject after saying "well, that's not true"). While we were still married, he said all types of things to me - that there was something wrong with me and I should "get help", he claimed that I was in poor health - talked me into getting tested for diabetes (I'm actually very healthy, although I could lose a few pounds). Oh - he told the kids I was in the hospital and needed surgery because I didn't take care of myself - I had an appendectomy, which has nothing to do with how you take care of yourself!

Anyway, sorry to ramble on - I'm just so IRRITATED with him, and the closer it gets to the court date, the more irritated I get.

On top of it all, I know he is teaching the kids bad things. He's one of those people who will do whatever it takes to get what he wants, and doesn't care who it hurts, if it's moral or legal, etc. I don't think he's the best influence on them, so I guess it's good that he always shoves them off onto babysitters or their friends' families - or has playdates at his house, knowing they'll more or less be out of the way.

I'm so happy that he hasn't managed to turn them against me and my husband, at least. They know we really love them.

I think the teachers, doctors, etc see through him too.

Anyway, I appreciate the help and support everyone!

venusfire

[Aymsgirl 0]

I hate to hear when things like this happen to people. I've had ex problems but not to your extent. The best advice I was given was to document everything. From times that he calls the children, times he drops and picks them up, to amounts that he spends on necessities for them such as if there is a clause with payments on educational, recreational and medical expenses. My ex pays his support but nothing else that he is supposed to so every now and then I wave my magic book with amounts in it and I find him catching up and getting himself back into a normal routine with the kids. Good luck and I hope he wears himself out soon.

[Aymsgirl 0]

This may not work at all but what about trying to get a mediator for the whole family or family counseling, him and his wife and you and your husband. Get all of you in the same place and try to work out whatever underlying issue is there.. He's obviously holding on to something and who knows, maybe that could help!

New Beginnings,

I did try to get him to agree for the two of us to get something like that - some sort of neutral third party - last summer. He was not interested. Then again, we went to marriage counseling off and on for 5 years, and that never got anywhere.

I hope the court orders co-parenting therapy or something like that. For one thing, he thinks co-parenting = "I do what he says".

He's really horrible. The stuff I heard from the kids that I KNOW he said to/around them.... Once, my daughter said something to me, and the following day, my ex used the exact same phrase in an email he sent to me (it was about how many days I had spent in Morocco). Another time, one of the kid's teachers told me that he said something to her (about what I fed them), and it was exactly what my daughter had said to me the night before - right after spending time with her father. Other times, the kids will just come straight out and tell me that he's said things - and I don't ask them, either (and I try not to react - just change the subject after saying "well, that's not true"). While we were still married, he said all types of things to me - that there was something wrong with me and I should "get help", he claimed that I was in poor health - talked me into getting tested for diabetes (I'm actually very healthy, although I could lose a few pounds). Oh - he told the kids I was in the hospital and needed surgery because I didn't take care of myself - I had an appendectomy, which has nothing to do with how you take care of yourself!

Anyway, sorry to ramble on - I'm just so IRRITATED with him, and the closer it gets to the court date, the more irritated I get.

On top of it all, I know he is teaching the kids bad things. He's one of those people who will do whatever it takes to get what he wants, and doesn't care who it hurts, if it's moral or legal, etc. I don't think he's the best influence on them, so I guess it's good that he always shoves them off onto babysitters or their friends' families - or has playdates at his house, knowing they'll more or less be out of the way.

I'm so happy that he hasn't managed to turn them against me and my husband, at least. They know we really love them.

I think the teachers, doctors, etc see through him too.

Anyway, I appreciate the help and support everyone!

venusfire

Kids are very smart. Mine are almost 12 and 10 and they are now realizing who takes care of them and provides for their needs. They also know who comes through when they always need something. Just recently have I said do you see why you live with Mom? I had this discussion with my almsot 12 year old daughter when her father knew for almost 4 weeks that she needed 36.50 his half of her overnight camping trip for history class and he showed up and threw 12 bucks at me and said I will owe you. LOL...yeah, just like everything else I'll put it on your IOU list. She's old enough to see with her own eyes and see his games he plays now. It sounds like yours are still young and he is messing with their little minds. Just keep being a good mom and one day they will realize it on their own.

Edited October 17, 2009 by Aymsgirl