Gardasil (HPV) Being voted on by CDC on October 21st 2009

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Honestly? my wife didn't get the shot because no one ever required us to.

Edited October 15, 2009 by Sousuke

[The_Dude 1,142]

Hey Rob,

Its because its a vaccine that does not really apply to many of us, simple as that. If a doctor says "This will do you no good" Why even enter into the risks of side effects no matter how slight they may be?

Well, for me, you cannot say with any certainty that it won't. I love my wife wholeheartedly and have no intention of being with anyone else, and I know she feels the same way. But, as the bumber sticker says, "Sh!t happens".

[The_Dude 1,142]

Lets not forget that the decision to require the shot wasn't actually a decision at all - it was just part of a bureaucratic process, hopefully the CDC will make the right decision and remove the requirement.

I really don't understand some peoples objections to it though. If the circumstances were different, and the vaccine had been tested and been implemented for 20 years as opposed to 2, would your opinion be any different? Is your objection based on it something being forced upon people?

From my viewpoint, its a vaccine that could help save my wifes life, and that is paramount to me, even if the circumstances in which she would have to go through to contract it would be less than desireable and quite rare. I've read the clinical data and for me, If I were the one who was the potential immigrant, I would want it.

If it had been in around and tested for 20 years, I wouldn't have an objection to it.

But on these terms? No. Giving an STD vaccine to someone who has been tested, proven to be ok, and is getting married is ridiculous, especially at 500 dollars for the whole series.

Merck is a for profit company. They don't care if it saves your wife's life or not. They care about their bottom line.

They care about making you think you need it to save your wife's life.

I know all about Merck, as a matter of fact, my 401K is vested in them. But that is neither here nor there. I am well aware of their tactics as a for profit company, and I am well aware of the clinical data from the testing of the vaccine. I have read both sides of the argument, and for me, I would still get it. There are far too many hysterical stories out there that are anecdotal at best. Take for example, a thread in this very forum about a UK girl who died after getting a similar shot. The sensational headlines say that she died after getting the shot. What they neglect to tell you is that she in fact died from a massive tumor that she had for quite some time.

The fact remains that HPV is an STD and can be transmitted. Everyone says that they have no intention of ever being with anyone else, that is why we get married and take vows asserting as such. But look at the reality of marriage in this world. Far too many people don't spend the rest of their lives with that person. I know the chances of getting HPV is remote, but wouldn't you like to be vaccinated against something that can kill you?

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Lets not forget that the decision to require the shot wasn't actually a decision at all - it was just part of a bureaucratic process, hopefully the CDC will make the right decision and remove the requirement.

I really don't understand some peoples objections to it though. If the circumstances were different, and the vaccine had been tested and been implemented for 20 years as opposed to 2, would your opinion be any different? Is your objection based on it something being forced upon people?

From my viewpoint, its a vaccine that could help save my wifes life, and that is paramount to me, even if the circumstances in which she would have to go through to contract it would be less than desireable and quite rare. I've read the clinical data and for me, If I were the one who was the potential immigrant, I would want it.

If it had been in around and tested for 20 years, I wouldn't have an objection to it.

But on these terms? No. Giving an STD vaccine to someone who has been tested, proven to be ok, and is getting married is ridiculous, especially at 500 dollars for the whole series.

Merck is a for profit company. They don't care if it saves your wife's life or not. They care about their bottom line.

They care about making you think you need it to save your wife's life.

I know all about Merck, as a matter of fact, my 401K is vested in them. But that is neither here nor there. I am well aware of their tactics as a for profit company, and I am well aware of the clinical data from the testing of the vaccine. I have read both sides of the argument, and for me, I would still get it. There are far too many hysterical stories out there that are anecdotal at best. Take for example, a thread in this very forum about a UK girl who died after getting a similar shot. The sensational headlines say that she died after getting the shot. What they neglect to tell you is that she in fact died from a massive tumor that she had for quite some time.

The fact remains that HPV is an STD and can be transmitted. Everyone says that they have no intention of ever being with anyone else, that is why we get married and take vows asserting as such. But look at the reality of marriage in this world. Far too many people don't spend the rest of their lives with that person. I know the chances of getting HPV is remote, but wouldn't you like to be vaccinated against something that can kill you?

Actually thats the other reason why most people say the vaccine isn't for everyone, because in fact the chances of getting HPV are actually very high. Thats why most doctors say its worthless once people are of a certain age and have a certain level of exposure.

[HAL 9000 96]

A little late in the game...

but on top of HPV being an STD its also a nonSTD.

[trailmix 77]

That is one part of the conditions to immigrate to the U.S. If you object to it, you have a couple of options. As I said, you can choose NOT to immigrate here, you can get the shot, or you can choose another country. That is three choices albeit unsavory choices, they are still choices.

This thread was posted in Off-Topic. If you dont' like people disagreeing with you, I suggest you find another forum to post in. Grow thicker skin, or GTFO.

As you and Malrothien both mention, it is currently a requirement to immigrate to the U.S.

However, just because it is a requirement does not mean that it is right. These people are immigrants, they are not sheep (or guinea pigs as the case may be).

No where in my post did I imply or otherwise state that I felt like "these people" were sheep. This is my second go with immigration into a country. There are rules and regulations that I do not like, but while I can write a letter and state my opinion, those are the rules. Period.

But that's my point, those aren't the rules 'period' - well I mean they are the rules as they stand now - but rules are made to be changed. I see nothing wrong with a group of immigrants and/or their U.S. SOs trying to change a rule that they believe to be unfair.

If you believe a rule is unfair and you just go along with it - that is sheep like behaviour which is how I came to the conclusion I posted earlier.

I think the bottom line here is - why are immigrants required to get the vaccine but citizens are not? Immigrants, in the great population of the U.S. are but a drop in the bucket.

Edited October 16, 2009 by trailmix

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

moved from off topic to aos forum per op request.

[jomegared 0]

moved from off topic to aos forum per op request.

Thank you Charles.

[spectheintro 18]

Thanks for this--I'll be sure to call and ask them to remove it.

As for my rationale why:

A vaccine exists in order to protect a population, not an individual. Anyone that tells you otherwise is lying to you--vaccination works on the premise that by vaccinating a suitable amount of people, the disease cannot spread. You are better off not getting any vaccines in your lifetime, but only if everyone else around you DOES get the vaccine. The more people that aren't vaccinated, the more dangerous a particular disease becomes, simply because it can spread.

I do not believe HPV is a disease that poses any significant threat, for a variety of reasons. First, HPV itself is not fatal (like measles, mumps, rubicella, hepatitis, etc)--it can cause a condition which can be fatal, if not diagnosed and treated in time. Second, the HPV vaccine does not confer a broad enough range of immunity towards developing that condition to make it worth the cost of the vaccine, both physically (I don't happen to believe the vaccine is hyper-deadly, but like any vaccine it carries adverse risks) and financially. (Merck is charging nearly $600 for three doses of this thing.) You can get Gardasil and still be at a significant risk (compared to pre-vaccination) of developing cervical cancer.

I'm not ideologically opposed to the vaccine--if someone wants to be conferred immunity, that's fine. But I am opposed to mandating vaccination, because I think the costs involved far outweigh any potential benefits thereof. The benefit of requiring MMR vaccination FAR OUTWEIGHS the costs: it protects the US population from an epidemic that could be catastrophic. But HPV? It's not even in the same ballpark. Forcing this financial and health burden on immigrants is silly. The vaccine doesn't do enough for us to justify it.

Edited October 16, 2009 by spectheintro

[jomegared 0]

That is one part of the conditions to immigrate to the U.S. If you object to it, you have a couple of options. As I said, you can choose NOT to immigrate here, you can get the shot, or you can choose another country. That is three choices albeit unsavory choices, they are still choices.

This thread was posted in Off-Topic. If you dont' like people disagreeing with you, I suggest you find another forum to post in. Grow thicker skin, or GTFO.

As you and Malrothien both mention, it is currently a requirement to immigrate to the U.S.

However, just because it is a requirement does not mean that it is right. These people are immigrants, they are not sheep (or guinea pigs as the case may be).

No where in my post did I imply or otherwise state that I felt like "these people" were sheep. This is my second go with immigration into a country. There are rules and regulations that I do not like, but while I can write a letter and state my opinion, those are the rules. Period.

But that's my point, those aren't the rules 'period' - well I mean they are the rules as they stand now - but rules are made to be changed. I see nothing wrong with a group of immigrants and/or their U.S. SOs trying to change a rule that they believe to be unfair.

If you believe a rule is unfair and you just go along with it - that is sheep like behaviour which is how I came to the conclusion I posted earlier.

I think the bottom line here is - why are immigrants required to get the vaccine but citizens are not? Immigrants, in the great population of the U.S. are but a drop in the bucket.

I read a thread where you say you support Gardasil. Thank you for being so civil about this. This issue is tearing us apart. I believe, I mean I truly believe that this was not manufactured to hurt anyone, and that the intent was to benefit the people who want it. With our interview quickly approaching we recently found out about this requirement. It shattered us, especially my fiancee. She has done research and has spent endless nights this last 2 weeks researching this vaccine. She started with Australia, where it has been tested for years. And the reports are not good. Just because they test it on 4000 people doesn't mean its acceptable for the millions that chose to immigrate. The pressure of the interview coming, especially being the Casablanca consulate who are routinely dicks, and this requirement, threw us for a loop. Emotions are high and our relationship is tense.

This thread was specifically for one purpose. The CDC is making a decision. I read previous threads that spoke about the results coming in October.

My search revealed that the meeting to decided these issues was quickly approaching and anything I could do for my girl, I would. Including contacting these people taking 5 minutes of their time

to plead my case. If anything, it might stay in there mind seeing that the vote is next Wednesday.

I respect those that differ in opinion, and I thank those who agree. But just realize where we are in our time line and why things so quickly get, "off-topic," and offensive.

[jomegared 0]

Thanks for this--I'll be sure to call and ask them to remove it.

As for my rationale why:

A vaccine exists in order to protect a population, not an individual. Anyone that tells you otherwise is lying to you--vaccination works on the premise that by vaccinating a suitable amount of people, the disease cannot spread. You are better off not getting any vaccines in your lifetime, but only if everyone else around you DOES get the vaccine. The more people that aren't vaccinated, the more dangerous a particular disease becomes, simply because it can spread.

I do not believe HPV is a disease that poses any significant threat, for a variety of reasons. First, HPV itself is not fatal (like measles, mumps, rubicella, hepatitis, etc)--it can cause a condition which can be fatal, if not diagnosed and treated in time. Second, the HPV vaccine does not confer a broad enough range of immunity towards developing that condition to make it worth the cost of the vaccine, both physically (I don't happen to believe the vaccine is hyper-deadly, but like any vaccine it carries adverse risks) and financially. (Merck is charging nearly $600 for three doses of this thing.) You can get Gardasil and still be at a significant risk (compared to pre-vaccination) of developing cervical cancer.

I'm not ideologically opposed to the vaccine--if someone wants to be conferred immunity, that's fine. But I am opposed to mandating vaccination, because I think the costs involved far outweigh any potential benefits thereof. The benefit of requiring MMR vaccination FAR OUTWEIGHS the costs: it protects the US population from an epidemic that could be catastrophic. But HPV? It's not even in the same ballpark. Forcing this financial and health burden on immigrants is silly. The vaccine doesn't do enough for us to justify it.

Thank you for the support Spec.

Great explanation!

I have found that most of these people on the CDC board are college professors.

You can Google their university and just send them a quick, and very brief email.

[trailmix 77]

I read a thread where you say you support Gardasil. Thank you for being so civil about this. This issue is tearing us apart. I believe, I mean I truly believe that this was not manufactured to hurt anyone, and that the intent was to benefit the people who want it. With our interview quickly approaching we recently found out about this requirement. It shattered us, especially my fiancee. She has done research and has spent endless nights this last 2 weeks researching this vaccine. She started with Australia, where it has been tested for years. And the reports are not good. Just because they test it on 4000 people doesn't mean its acceptable for the millions that chose to immigrate. The pressure of the interview coming, especially being the Casablanca consulate who are routinely dicks, and this requirement, threw us for a loop. Emotions are high and our relationship is tense.

I hope you are successful and they drop it

Actually I think that anyone who wants a gardasil vaccination should 100% be able to have it - that's really my stand on it. Forcing people to have it is another kettle of fish

[jomegared 0]

I read a thread where you say you support Gardasil. Thank you for being so civil about this. This issue is tearing us apart. I believe, I mean I truly believe that this was not manufactured to hurt anyone, and that the intent was to benefit the people who want it. With our interview quickly approaching we recently found out about this requirement. It shattered us, especially my fiancee. She has done research and has spent endless nights this last 2 weeks researching this vaccine. She started with Australia, where it has been tested for years. And the reports are not good. Just because they test it on 4000 people doesn't mean its acceptable for the millions that chose to immigrate. The pressure of the interview coming, especially being the Casablanca consulate who are routinely dicks, and this requirement, threw us for a loop. Emotions are high and our relationship is tense.

I hope you are successful and they drop it

Actually I think that anyone who wants a gardasil vaccination should 100% be able to have it - that's really my stand on it. Forcing people to have it is another kettle of fish

I COMPLETELY agree.

[spectheintro 18]

Thank you for the support Spec.

Great explanation!

I have found that most of these people on the CDC board are college professors.

You can Google their university and just send them a quick, and very brief email.

Do you think that would be more or less effective than contacting my Senator/Congressperson? I want to know the best way of making my voice heard, in a fairly time-effective manner.

[jomegared 0]

Ok, so here is a name.

Dr. Harrell Chesson.

He is a researcher at the CDC who is presenting his findings on the effectiveness, (or lack thereof) of administering the HPV vaccine.

There are multiple numbers listed.

The CDC main switchboard, not the public line, is 404-639-3311.

From there you should be able to ask for Dr, Chesson. My goal.

60 second summary of why I am against it, and the hardship it has placed on us.

I will call tomorrow and let you know how it goes.

I sent a bunch of emails to the CDC, but no response yet.