Bans 'do not cut abortion rate'

[HAL 9000 96]

Going back to technology when is the male pill going to come out! Seriously its a conspiracy.

For guys to forget to take?

[HAL 9000 96]

W/out sperm there is no fertilization. Put on a darn condom. Slip it on, slip it off. Why should a female have to change her body's hormonal balance for our pleasure?

I dont get what your saying in relation to what it was I was trying to say.

Condoms are less invasive on human physiology vs hormonal pills.

Some people make the idiotic 'spread her legs' argument without considering its us horny men seeking sex for the most part, and we have to give ourselves credit for tricking/convincing enough women to let us check the oil on the engine without proper protection.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

As cleo said it isn't appropriate in all circumstances.

Well of course its not, I dont recall saying it was, for example as I have said before when the mothers life is danger. Can you think of another reason? How about when the mother decides she wouldnt be able to give the child up for adoption and you knowing that if she chose to have the child it would grow up in a broken home, I would say that adoption wouldnt be a option either?

What you don't understand is that these things are case by case and should be treated as such, rather than some blanket of relative morality across the whole of society.

You just dont get it, I have never used a blanket. I know things are complicated and there are different solutions for different people and theres plenty of choices out there. Let me give you some examples, have the baby and keep it, give up parental rights to a relative who could raise this child all the while not cutting the child out of the mothers life completly( I say this because I understand that it would be very very hard to totally give up your child), and then theres adoption. What I am saying is that I dont see that abortion should be a option. If your going to try to write me off as not understanding please at least try to find a good reason.

Sometimes abortion isn't the right option either - the point surely is that people have access to contraception and have the right to govern their own bodies, and not have things imposed on them on the basis of the alleged rights of a parasite.

alleged rights, hmm I guess you dont want to address the moral issue of this

Dude - by denying the option to abort and saying that women should accept "the consequences of the bedroom" that's exactly what you're doing.

Why not keep all options on the table?

Edited October 15, 2009 by Gene Hunt

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

W/out sperm there is no fertilization. Put on a darn condom. Slip it on, slip it off. Why should a female have to change her body's hormonal balance for our pleasure?

I dont get what your saying in relation to what it was I was trying to say.

Condoms are less invasive on human physiology vs hormonal pills.

Some people make the idiotic 'spread her legs' argument without considering its us horny men seeking sex for the most part, and we have to give ourselves credit for tricking/convincing enough women to let us check the oil on the engine without proper protection.

Condoms also break and it is possible to get pregnant despite using them. What beggars belief is the idea that if this happens that carrying the baby to term should somehow be a "punishment" for having sex.

[_Simpson_ 250]

Let us know how it feels to carry a baby to term.

Just like you're pointing out (a bit incorrectly... coathanger abortions and their complications were much more prevalent than what you're giving them actual credit for... HINT... one is too many) about actual numbers... the actual numbers of organizations and individuals willing to take 100% care of a pregnant woman's needs that will eventually make it to likely give it up for adoption are possibly less than the real numbers of women getting coathanger abortions...

Coathanger abortions, never heard it put that way, seems a little cold. Sure one is one too many but hello we dont live in a perfect world and there isnt perfect solutions.

If we were to make abortion illegal then truly abortion would be the last option. There would be more people sucking up oxygen if abortions were illegal regardless to the exact stats of back alley abortions. Often teenagers go with a abortion because it seems like the easiest way out but realize later on how damaging in can be emotionally. If only we could get through to them and explain how adoptions is very tough but how its the best option. I truly dont believe that planned parenthood properly informs people about the negative effects of having abortion. You know at one time they had shirts on there website for sale that read I had a abortion.

I got to get going, until next time

Edited October 15, 2009 by _Simpson_

[HAL 9000 96]

W/out sperm there is no fertilization. Put on a darn condom. Slip it on, slip it off. Why should a female have to change her body's hormonal balance for our pleasure?

I dont get what your saying in relation to what it was I was trying to say.

Condoms are less invasive on human physiology vs hormonal pills.

Some people make the idiotic 'spread her legs' argument without considering its us horny men seeking sex for the most part, and we have to give ourselves credit for tricking/convincing enough women to let us check the oil on the engine without proper protection.

Condoms also break and it is possible to get pregnant despite using them. What beggars belief is the idea that if this happens that carrying the baby to term should somehow be a "punishment" for having sex.

Yep.

[HAL 9000 96]

Let us know how it feels to carry a baby to term.

Just like you're pointing out (a bit incorrectly... coathanger abortions and their complications were much more prevalent than what you're giving them actual credit for... HINT... one is too many) about actual numbers... the actual numbers of organizations and individuals willing to take 100% care of a pregnant woman's needs that will eventually make it to likely give it up for adoption are possibly less than the real numbers of women getting coathanger abortions...

Coathanger abortions, never heard it put that way, seems a little cold. Sure one is one too many but hello we dont live in a perfect world and there isnt perfect solutions.

If we were to make abortion illegal then truly abortion would be the last option. There would be more people sucking up oxygen if abortions were illegal regardless to the exact stats of back alley abortions. Often teenagers go with a abortion because it seems like the easiest way out but realize later on how damaging in can be emotionally. If only we could get through to them and explain how adoptions is very tough but how its the best option. I truly dont believe that planned parenthood properly informs people about the negative effects of having abortion. You know at one time they had shirts on there website for sale that read I had a abortion.

I got to get going, until next time

Just channeling my inner feminist. Coathanger abortions mean, literally that as well as all the non-standard approaches to having one done- either by oneself or by a medical practitioner that is not trained in the procedure.

OK, done with that.

Sure- if you use absolute numbers to state your claim, there is no argument. Just like if we expand your emotional damage claim... that posterior to this damaging event, there likely wouldn't be repeat abortions by teens that have changed as a result of having one.

These clinics offer a lot more than just abortions. And the counseling they offer really does the best it can to ensure abortion is really what is sought. No need to make conclusions about an entire procedure or the morality behind it on one T-shirt that actually is a jab at anti-abortionists and their desire to impose their beliefs where it does not belong.

[Peikko 1,575]

Let us know how it feels to carry a baby to term.

Just like you're pointing out (a bit incorrectly... coathanger abortions and their complications were much more prevalent than what you're giving them actual credit for... HINT... one is too many) about actual numbers... the actual numbers of organizations and individuals willing to take 100% care of a pregnant woman's needs that will eventually make it to likely give it up for adoption are possibly less than the real numbers of women getting coathanger abortions...

Coathanger abortions, never heard it put that way, seems a little cold. Sure one is one too many but hello we dont live in a perfect world and there isnt perfect solutions.

If we were to make abortion illegal then truly abortion would be the last option. There would be more people sucking up oxygen if abortions were illegal regardless to the exact stats of back alley abortions. Often teenagers go with a abortion because it seems like the easiest way out but realize later on how damaging in can be emotionally. If only we could get through to them and explain how adoptions is very tough but how its the best option. I truly dont believe that planned parenthood properly informs people about the negative effects of having abortion. You know at one time they had shirts on there website for sale that read I had a abortion.

I got to get going, until next time

When are you going to realise that abortions are not just performed on irresponsible teenagers? Making abortion illegal is not the way to reduce abortions - giving greater access to reliable and cheap contraceptives, making using contraceptives acceptable is.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

...and getting that male pill released of course.

Edited October 16, 2009 by Sousuke

[Peikko 1,575]

All the possible options should be explored and both parties should make sure that they can't contribute to an unwarned pregnancy without the co operation of the other if necessary.

[Joseph & Ana 0]

No, Hal has not redefined anything. You want to do that based on your own version of what is morally acceptable.

The fact is that murder is a moral judgment and one that we place on the act of killing another human being based on a particular set of circumstances. Killing a fetus does not come within these criteria.

Because it has been redefined.

Hard to believe, I know, but birth control does fail.

But let's see - it would seem that these "moral" arguments can be summarized as follows:

"Well you should have considered that before you opened your thighs, you silly tart".

"I'm don't give a ####### if your child grows up in squalor or in a care home, the important thing in this overpopulated world is that you have a chance at life, regardless of the quality of it"

Ding ding! Huzzah!

The margarat sanger truth finally comes out. Population control

[Joseph & Ana 0]

.

Imposing pregnancy? NO one is imposing pregnancy - She CHOSE to be pregnant when she spread her legs. In case anyone hasn't heard, that is how babies are made.

And in case you haven't heard, if HE would use a freaking condom that wouldn't happen.

Your misogyny is record setting, Bubba. Momma must be so proud of you.

Right on sister.

Who are exactly the ones pleading for girls to prove they love us?

Don't you find it truly hypocritical that the ones fighting for the guvamint to stay away from our health care can't wait to get the guvamint to control what a woman does with her body?

Wrong again. Killing the baby isn't her right.

On planet Joe,

No, the fact is that you've already redefined what life and murder is. We're trying to restore it back to where it should be. Back to reality, and truth.

Truth stands for redefining things as he sees them. Heaven have mercy on all of us if we ever crash land there.

Its already been redefined. I'm not redefining anything. Just trying to restore truth where a lie now stands.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Are you saying it shouldn't be a right or isn't a right?

Because as the law stands today, abortion is very much a right.

Now, if you believe it shouldn't be a right I have to point to the long record of failure by you right-wing freaks to overturn Roe v Wade. How long have y'all been bleating on and on about this now? How many Congressmen/women, Senators, Presidents have you elected on the platform of repealing Roe v Wade?

Pathetic. Absolutely fuсking pathetic.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Hey Jo,

I just want to say that I'm Pro-Life. The problem is this topic really can't be argued on the basis of morality, what is and isn't murder, and justice. The fact is that morality is a line drawn in the sand its not concrete. Every society has a different view of where the line is. If you look back to the Romans or the Greek City States they all had a much different code of morals. Likewise their Justice is different. So why and how does our society define what murder is? Basically in way that keeps everyone under control. There really is no such thing as Justice its just a tool to make people in a society feel like things are under control.

Edited October 16, 2009 by Sousuke

[Peikko 1,575]

Joe is indeed creating new definitions.

No one has ever prosecuted any woman for not bringing a fetus to live birth in the USA. I will go out on a limb here and say I don't believe it has ever been a stutute on the books of any country that I can think of. Simply put, killing a fetus has never been considered murder and I don't think that definition is ever going to end up on any statute book.