Fighting the 'contraceptive mentality'

[Jenn! 918]

Maybe these people should consider adopting children from the purple countries instead of making their own.

Sounds to me like they have their hands full already, why don't some of these 1 and 2 kid families do some adopting, they seem like the selfish ones if we are gonna put the label on anyone.

Anyway, I guess you missed this part of the story:

<<<

Simply filling the world with white Christians is not what motivated either the Sanfords or the McDonalds - for them having large families was a matter of faith.

The Sanfords have adopted children from around the world.

>>>

I think you missed my point. If we're concerned about the U.S. not having enough children, might as well kill two birds with one stone and help combat overpopulation in other parts of the world. I didn't call anyone selfish. That's great that the Sanfords have adopted children internationally.

[SuperDuper! 230]

Maybe these people should consider adopting children from the purple countries instead of making their own.

surely you do remember that's most of the fun?

Very Funny, Charles. Yes, making the babies is fun, but with some precautions in place, the couple can freely ejaculate and go to town until lips are bleeding without making unwanted kids. It reminds me of the old comparison of eating and defecating: We dont necessarily eat to defecate; likewise, we don't necessarily have sex to have kids.

I do believe in adoption, and sorry that the Vatican does not take a more active role in promoting adoption if their stance is against contraception. Let's get those "unwanted" kids into the arms of loving parents who want them. Perfect match and balance.

[Jenn! 918]

It reminds me of the old comparison of eating and defecating: We dont necessarily eat to defecate; likewise, we don't necessarily have sex to have kids.

I love how in this analogy kids are poop.

[HannahP 119]

Had the oddest conversation during my OB clinical today. She was a multipara pt who was wanting a tubal. Very adamant about it. But when we asked her about other b/c options (required before we can send 'em home with baby)...she had NO IDEA what b/c was. "Pills? Shot? Condom?" Nopers. Wanting the tubal was the odd part, actually. We have fairly high African and Latino populations in my area and many of them just don't know what b/c is.

You're kidding, right? How is that possible?

Not at all. Even within the context of having a professional interpreter by the bedside who is trying to explain things to them in their native tongue. Conceptually, they may know what a condom is -- but don't actually realize that this can prevent pregnancy. (And probably have an aversion to using them for a mixture of cultural and religious reasons.) The woman that I referenced thought the ONLY way to stop having kids was to get sterilized.

[Danno 1,228]

Maybe these people should consider adopting children from the purple countries instead of making their own.

Sounds to me like they have their hands full already, why don't some of these 1 and 2 kid families do some adopting, they seem like the selfish ones if we are gonna put the label on anyone.

Anyway, I guess you missed this part of the story:

<<<

Simply filling the world with white Christians is not what motivated either the Sanfords or the McDonalds - for them having large families was a matter of faith.

The Sanfords have adopted children from around the world.

>>>

I think you missed my point. If we're concerned about the U.S. not having enough children, might as well kill two birds with one stone and help combat overpopulation in other parts of the world. I didn't call anyone selfish. That's great that the Sanfords have adopted children internationally.

Actually the US population is right at "replacement level" (thanks largely to fertile hispanics)

Europe's long term ......is the one in big trouble.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

It's time for the government to regulate fuсking.

[SuperDuper! 230]

It reminds me of the old comparison of eating and defecating: We dont necessarily eat to defecate; likewise, we don't necessarily have sex to have kids.

I love how in this analogy kids are poop.

I know, Jenn, it is bizarre, but one that "anti-kids" adults throw around. The "logic" states just what I was funning Charles about: THat the reason , for most people, to have sex is to enjoy themselves and obtain deep personal intimacy with one another, not to pro-create.

Likewise, the weird argument is that people eat food to enjoy themselves, and not to deliver a hot duce load in the porcelain fixture.

Does that elucidate for you? Its not to say that kids are poop, although many more poopies enter your world and consciousness once the bundle of joy falls into your arms

[Scott & Lai 12]

[pedroh 21]

Maybe these people should consider adopting children from the purple countries instead of making their own.

surely you do remember that's most of the fun?

Very Funny, Charles. Yes, making the babies is fun, but with some precautions in place, the couple can freely ejaculate and go to town until lips are bleeding without making unwanted kids. It reminds me of the old comparison of eating and defecating: We dont necessarily eat to defecate; likewise, we don't necessarily have sex to have kids.

I do believe in adoption, and sorry that the Vatican does not take a more active role in promoting adoption if their stance is against contraception. Let's get those "unwanted" kids into the arms of loving parents who want them. Perfect match and balance.

the funny thing is that in the urban areas of latinamerica a very high percent of women(around 90) is on BC, and of course, over 95% of the latin american pop is catholic

[christeen 966]

Not sure how many of people posting here has actually looked into adopting (either nationally or internationally) My husband and I have started the process and will delve into it full fledge once he gets his GC.

The process is not as easy as saying "hey, let me pick up a kid today" and many of the poorest country's with the highest reproduction rate do not allow adoption!!! We have done over 2 years of research, home-study and began a program with Guatemala when the entire program was shut down, which broke out hearts and emptied our wallets...

I am not going to argue weather we should just adopt US children or International, I believe that is a personal choice to be left for what is best for each family. I will say that at the time we were prohibited from US programs because my husband did not have a GC and my husband could not get a GC because of his job... Now that his job has changed we will most likely pursue a US program due to the volatility of international programs (not to mention the $40,000 price tag)! The process is greuling, difficult and expensive, and in many cases much more so then giving birth to a child...

As far as reproduction, there are many cultural factors that go into large familys and pros and cons. The poorer nations have a much higher infant mortality rate and lower survival rate thus, the net gain in population is much lower than what is shown in a birth rate, whereas in more developed nations the survival rates are higher... Then if you factor into the equasion immigration and multi-ethnic reproduction then you have a larger but more "blended" society... Does not mean the extinction of a nation, just a changing face... Pretty much everyone here on the VJ is a testament to that since our spouses are from all over the world....

As far as if they "should" have that many children? It depends on the care and ability to care for such a large family... not just financially, but emotionally and developmentally as well.

[Marilyn. 340]

we are thinking of adopting through the foster care system.. we have looked up info on it on the internet but that is about it so far

[christeen 966]

we are thinking of adopting through the foster care system.. we have looked up info on it on the internet but that is about it so far

Each state usually offers classes that kinda go through the system and how it works... The classes are very useful and helpful and they explain the process as well as some of the pitfalls and benefits... We too are going to go through the US system... we're kinda scared of the Intl system!!!

[Danno 1,228]

I do believe in adoption, and sorry that the Vatican does not take a more active role in promoting adoption if their stance is against contraception. Let's get those "unwanted" kids into the arms of loving parents who want them. Perfect match and balance.

NOt very familiar with The Catholic Church?

Catholic Charities has not only "promoted Adoptions" they have been a huge facilitator of Adoptions for many many years uniting children and families.

They are also heavily invested in many relief efforts here and around the world.

Unfortunately they seem to have no PR machine to brag about the good work they do so folks are left to assume the worst... and then pass on these assumptions as if they are fact.

I guess we are all guilty of this on various topics.

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Catholic Charities is a worldwide network of charities whose aim is to "reduce poverty, support families, and empower communities."[1] It is one of the largest and most respected charities.[2] Catholic Charities traces its origin to an orphanage founded in 1727 in New Orleans, Louisiana by the French Ursulines Sisters.

Catholic Charities, USA (CCUSA), with headquarters in Alexandria, Virginia, is recognized as one of the nation's largest voluntary social service networks. It was founded in 1910 as the National Conference of Catholic Charities. More than 1,700 agencies, institutions and organizations make up the Catholic Charities network - including individual organizations of the dioceses, such as the Archdiocese of Chicago. Nearly 90 cents of every dollar donated to Catholic Charities agencies goes directly to programs and services.[3]

Together, with the local, diocesan Catholic Charities affiliates, Catholic Charities is the second largest social service provider in the United States and it is only surpassed by the US Federal Government. Often, this means that the CCUSA network is able to provide assistance which other agencies are simply unable to provide or in circumstances where the other assistance is insufficient to provide the necessary aid.

[HannahP 119]

Maybe these people should consider adopting children from the purple countries instead of making their own.

surely you do remember that's most of the fun?

Very Funny, Charles. Yes, making the babies is fun, but with some precautions in place, the couple can freely ejaculate and go to town until lips are bleeding without making unwanted kids. It reminds me of the old comparison of eating and defecating: We dont necessarily eat to defecate; likewise, we don't necessarily have sex to have kids.

I do believe in adoption, and sorry that the Vatican does not take a more active role in promoting adoption if their stance is against contraception. Let's get those "unwanted" kids into the arms of loving parents who want them. Perfect match and balance.

the funny thing is that in the urban areas of latinamerica a very high percent of women(around 90) is on BC, and of course, over 95% of the latin american pop is catholic

We read several studies in my cultural anthro class on Latin-Americans and, actually, there is totally data out there. Immigrants tend to have a slightly higher than average birthrate (I think it was .5); second gens have comparable birthrates to the US average.

It was an interesting class. My prof spend 25+ years working in Western KS, first with the meat industry pops and than with the Latinos that eventually flooded into the industry in the late 80s/early 90s.

[christeen 966]

Not a Catholic myself, but you are very correct!! I have 2 cousins that were adopted through Catholic Charities in Chicago... We looked into them too when we were starting our process, great organization, regardless of what others think of the Catholic Church in general, they do a lot of good....