The Muslims are coming!

[HYENA 4]

darn honkeys coming in ans screwing it up for everyone!

And who are you calling honkey? White people? What other derogatory names do you know? I think we are better than that.

This doesnt have to turn into a hate thread.

I'm a honkey; I find it amusing!

[HYENA 4]

I'm sorry to offend. This cracka will stay quiet then...

[toma1 10]

I shudder at the thought of being in a relationship where my partner pulls out a dictionary definition and hits me over the head with it.

Really? You are serious, I can tell.

Yesterday my coworker said she ended a relationship with a new bf. She found herself correcting his English during a happy hour.

This was her moment of epiphany, and she knew it would never work out.

THis is the biggest red flag of love gone: When one partner corrects you in English. Unless you are going to meet the King or Queen or apply for a professorship, it doesn't matter.

Correcting one's English: THe ultimate nag and sign the party is over.

Haha, being a dyed-in-the-wool infidel I did not plan to comment in this thread, however I have to reluctantly agree here. While the tone of this post feels a bit venomous, my wife and I are using an English tutor to correct her English. She asked me to do it, and I said, "NO WAY!"

[kaus&Sanu 0]

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qi...10020753AAFNq6q hope it helps

My beloved Enraptured,

Yes, this helps. And it is as I expected. I have many questions. I Islam is a religion sanctified by God (as it is by the Torah: Genesis), then why can't I understand this teaching? I respect the Arab position where it was 'wondered' why a Savior was not sent to them specifically...but...........................................I would like to read your book. And, I think I have.

My dearest, let me first say that I believe my post above requires a 'non-reply'. Silence is always the best answer (as Christ exhibited), and I am willing to accept that your Book is for your people only...

Peace to you Sister,

Mark

Mark,

Yes, you can read the quran, translation or the original... However, out of respect for such a sacred & holy book, we as muslims perform a ritual described as "wudhu" it's quite simple, as enrapture has pointed out already. I would ask that you perform this ritual when reading it, obviously it's your choice. Given that the bible & torah is a book and word of god I perform wudhu before opening the bible or torah to. They are books from god as well. Now, the question becomes, do you as a non-muslim need or should perform wudhu before reading the quran.. If you truly are interested in the answer of this question, I'd be more than glad to research into the issue and give you an accurate answer.

Now, lets just step out of the whole religion topic for a second... How can you or I learn of anything and be accurate without actually having done some real research into the topic ie. islam. It's like me trying to understand an engine design without actually looking at design specifications, and just merely relying on repair manuals...

So yes, you can read the quran being a non-muslim, that is a fact, also goes with your experience with the mosque.

Could you please elaborate on your statement, "Arab Perspective of Saviour"...

Thank you,

Kausar

[sara..... 371]

Mark,

You can read the Quran. It is ok.

I just thought you would like to know that not all Arabs are Muslim. There are also Arab Christians and Jews.

Salam (peace)

i hope nobody gets offended i just want to add a little to this........while we as Muslims are taught how to wash before touching the quran there is nothing any place that states that a non Muslim can not read the quran how else will anyone learn about Islam if they are interested.........not to many go out and purchase books about the meaning of islam or how or what u have to do.........the quran is offered in many book stores to be purchased and many places free on the Internet.......we as Muslims love the quran just as the Christian loves the bible ..........we have the bible in our home so that we can learn and compare between the bible and quran..........we even wash before touching the Christian bible because it is a holy book to them

ok im done hope i didnt upset anyone

sara

[BishopMnA 0]

Could you please elaborate on your statement, "Arab Perspective of Saviour"...

Thank you,

Kausar

Hello Kausar,

I hope you are doing well!

To answer your question, I used the phrase 'Arab Perspective of a Savior' because of a book that I read about 5 years ago. However, your question made me wonder why I had used those exact words, because as Illnevergethis pointed out Arabs are also Christians/Jews...

So I went to my library to see if I still had that book, and I did. The book is authored by Karen Armstrong. She is a prior Catholic nun who converted to Islam. The title is 'Muhammed - An Autobiography of the Prophet'. In fact, I was able to find the exact page which had resonated in my mind so clearly when I read this book a half decade earlier. So, if you have a minute to spend, here it 'tis

(The preface of the second chapter, where this is from, is a discussion of the Ka'aba...and Muhammed's retreat to the cave during Ramadan)...she then writes, "Some of the Arabs believed that Al-lah, whose name simply meant 'the God', was the deity who was also worshipped by the Jews and the Christians. But unlike the 'people of the scriptures', as the Arabs called the people of these two venerable faiths, the Arabs were painfully aware that He had never sent them a revelation or a scripture of their own, even though they had His shrine in their midst from time immemorial. Those Arabs who come into contact with Jews and Christians felt an acute sense of inferiority; it seemed as though God had left the Arabs out of His divine plan. But that changed when on the seventeenth night of Ramadan Muhammad was torn from sleep in his mountain cave and felt himself overwhelmed by a devastating divine presence. The Word of God had been spoken for the first time in Arabia and God had finally revealed himself to the Arabs in their own language. The Holy Book would be called the Qu'ran: the Recitation.

Well...that is where I got my words/thoughts from...maybe I'm off-base...

Peace / Assalam Alaikom

Mark

[kaus&Sanu 0]

Mark,

You can read the Quran. It is ok.

I just thought you would like to know that not all Arabs are Muslim. There are also Arab Christians and Jews.

Salam (peace)

i hope nobody gets offended i just want to add a little to this........while we as Muslims are taught how to wash before touching the quran there is nothing any place that states that a non Muslim can not read the quran how else will anyone learn about Islam if they are interested.........not to many go out and purchase books about the meaning of islam or how or what u have to do.........the quran is offered in many book stores to be purchased and many places free on the Internet.......we as Muslims love the quran just as the Christian loves the bible ..........we have the bible in our home so that we can learn and compare between the bible and quran..........we even wash before touching the Christian bible because it is a holy book to them

ok im done hope i didnt upset anyone

sara

[Danno 1,228]

I'm feeling a lot of Luv in this room.

[kaus&Sanu 0]

Could you please elaborate on your statement, "Arab Perspective of Saviour"...

Thank you,

Kausar

Hello Kausar,

I hope you are doing well!

To answer your question, I used the phrase 'Arab Perspective of a Savior' because of a book that I read about 5 years ago. However, your question made me wonder why I had used those exact words, because as Illnevergethis pointed out Arabs are also Christians/Jews...

So I went to my library to see if I still had that book, and I did. The book is authored by Karen Armstrong. She is a prior Catholic nun who converted to Islam. The title is 'Muhammed - An Autobiography of the Prophet'. In fact, I was able to find the exact page which had resonated in my mind so clearly when I read this book a half decade earlier. So, if you have a minute to spend, here it 'tis

(The preface of the second chapter, where this is from, is a discussion of the Ka'aba...and Muhammed's retreat to the cave during Ramadan)...she then writes, "Some of the Arabs believed that Al-lah, whose name simply meant 'the God', was the deity who was also worshipped by the Jews and the Christians. But unlike the 'people of the scriptures', as the Arabs called the people of these two venerable faiths, the Arabs were painfully aware that He had never sent them a revelation or a scripture of their own, even though they had His shrine in their midst from time immemorial. Those Arabs who come into contact with Jews and Christians felt an acute sense of inferiority; it seemed as though God had left the Arabs out of His divine plan. But that changed when on the seventeenth night of Ramadan Muhammad was torn from sleep in his mountain cave and felt himself overwhelmed by a devastating divine presence. The Word of God had been spoken for the first time in Arabia and God had finally revealed himself to the Arabs in their own language. The Holy Book would be called the Qu'ran: the Recitation.

Well...that is where I got my words/thoughts from...maybe I'm off-base...

Peace / Assalam Alaikom

Mark

Hi Mark,

I'm doing well, although would be doing superbly well if my wife was here with me... as I'm 100% sure many other VJ'ers would agree

I hope your doing well too.

Also, thank you for the response...

That book seems interesting.. I'd like to check it out myself... I think I'm due for a trip to the library to see if they have it and check it out for myself.

I would like to point out though, that it is in-accurate. You pointed out that this book states this occurred in the month of Ramadan. What's interesting is that during the month of Ramadan, Mohammed (PBUH) was actually in the process of the last revelations to complete the quran. However, it is true what you stated from the book:

"The Word of God had been spoken for the first time in Arabia and God had finally revealed himself"

I took out the "Arabs" because although it was revealed in the Arabia area, it was not meant just for the arabs (Arab's was not specifically stated).. Otherwise, if that were true, that would then also imply that Islam is a religion purely for the Arabs and the fact is anyone can be a muslim, regardless or color, race, or wherever you may be from, just like Christianity, Catholocism.

What was stated at around that time was: "This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâm as your religion." This statement was actually referring to not just the arabs but all of mankind.

Also another part of that book, "Those Arabs who come into contact with Jews and Christians felt an acute sense of inferiority" ... All i can say is wow, that is wrong... I think if I could do some more research I may be able to find instances where the Christian's, Jews, were okay with eachothers presence... (I'm not familiar of this and would require some more research on my part)... I know of an instance when Mohammed PBUH travelled to an area of the Catholics or it was Christians, he was provided shelter etc. because there were others looking for him. I'll research and get back to you on that.

Alright man, well t/c, i have to get going now as my 4 y/o daughter is hitting me with her balloon cause she want's to play...

-Kausar

[AlHayatZween 2]

Of course you can read the Qur'an...

That's great!

[SuperDuper! 230]

I shudder at the thought of being in a relationship where my partner pulls out a dictionary definition and hits me over the head with it.

Really? You are serious, I can tell.

Yesterday my coworker said she ended a relationship with a new bf. She found herself correcting his English during a happy hour.

This was her moment of epiphany, and she knew it would never work out.

THis is the biggest red flag of love gone: When one partner corrects you in English. Unless you are going to meet the King or Queen or apply for a professorship, it doesn't matter.

Correcting minor language errors: THe ultimate nag and sign the party is over.

Haha, being a dyed-in-the-wool infidel I did not plan to comment in this thread, however I have to reluctantly agree here. While the tone of this post feels a bit venomous, my wife and I are using an English tutor to correct her English. She asked me to do it, and I said, "NO WAY!"

Yes, my man, you are correct! Correcting minor language errors is a leading indicator of NAGHOOD and has no place in a loving, laughing relationship.

HYENA, I am white too, and am not offended, but if its ok for you to use derogatory race terms, even in a joking manner, it opens the door, if you know what I mean, and is just unnecessary on a multi-ethnic board like this. If white people are open game, then so is everyone else, and we just dont want to go there. THanks for trying to understand.

Edited October 12, 2009 by itzallgood

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I don't know what all this debate is about. The issue isn't Muslims or Christians or whatever. The issue I have is with the radical, fundamental, intolerant fringes of either of these religious groups (and they both have them). I have friends that are Muslims, I have friends that are all colors of Christian and I have friends that aren't religious at all. I don't have a problem with any of them. They're all nice people. Why would or should I care whether they worship a God and if they do, which God they worship. Since religion is a private matter between a person and God (my friends know that this is how I feel about the subject), it's simply not my business and they won't try to make it such.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Two corrections to prior posts:

Karen Armstrong was a nun, but is not a convert to Islam.

Arabia was the last place where the Message of Allah was revealed, not the first. The first Messenger of Islam was Adam (pbuh), and Muhammad (pbuh) is the seal (the last) of the prophets of Islam. Other venerated prophets of the faith include, but are not limited to, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus.

[Heracles 417]

I don't know what all this debate is about. The issue isn't Muslims or Christians or whatever. The issue I have is with the radical, fundamental, intolerant fringes of either of these religious groups (and they both have them). I have friends that are Muslims, I have friends that are all colors of Christian and I have friends that aren't religious at all. I don't have a problem with any of them. They're all nice people. Why would or should I care whether they worship a God and if they do, which God they worship. Since religion is a private matter between a person and God (my friends know that this is how I feel about the subject), it's simply not my business and they won't try to make it such.

Quite true. I actually know of some atheist that are bigger fundies than any religious fundies.

Fundies clearly come in all denominations.

[BishopMnA 0]

Two corrections to prior posts:

Karen Armstrong was a nun, but is not a convert to Islam.

Arabia was the last place where the Message of Allah was revealed, not the first. The first Messenger of Islam was Adam (pbuh), and Muhammad (pbuh) is the seal (the last) of the prophets of Islam. Other venerated prophets of the faith include, but are not limited to, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus.

Very good points Sofiyya. I knew Armstrong was a nun who had 'left the faith'...and I know she is a proponent of Islam, and drew the conclusion that she was a convert...which may/may not be true. She's actually a very talented writers regarding various world religions, and even has written a book (I think callled 'Spiraling Staircase' regarding her own religious experiences.

As a Catholic, I think it is important to recognize that Islam is a world religion that is sanctified by God, as clearly spelled out in the Book of Genesis...in that sense I fully agree with what you've said about the long line of shared prophets between the Jewish/Christian/Islamic prophets.

Peace ----