The Muslims are coming!

[meowmeowmeow 1]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

even when this nation was built on the expulsion, massacre, and continuous discrimination against the natives of the region they now claim as their own?

[HYENA 4]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

even when this nation was built on the expulsion, massacre, and continuous discrimination against the natives of the region they now claim as their own?

the world is not a happy place

[meowmeowmeow 1]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

even when this nation was built on the expulsion, massacre, and continuous discrimination against the natives of the region they now claim as their own?

the world is not a happy place

yeah, no doubt. to be fair, i don't really care about middle eastern politics. just had to throw that in there

[AlHayatZween 2]

I read all of Quran quotes and all of the Bible quotes and I did make a conclusion from them when I see them in their context. A much higher percentage of the Quran quotes appear to be commands then the Biblical quotes. More of the Biblical quotes are statements of something that happened rather then a command. Another conclusion I made is that on average references to death in the bible are actions by God where as in the Quran they are actions by people. When people kill in the bible there are times when it is later mentioned as wrong ie. that quote about david.

Don't get me wrong both have there fair share of killing and death but there is certainly a difference in the way it is delivered...just sayin.

The Quran is only about 10% law, and even some of that is conditional or situational. The verses that Joe repeatedly posts are part of a collection known as the "Sword Verses", which were revealed during battles. Even within them are directives to let enemies go if you see good in them. Context is incredibly important, as is a knowledge of history, when evaluating the holy books.

It is true that the tone in different English translations of the Qur'an sometimes sound very directive and even harsh...

But something that people forget to realize is that the Bible has been translated so many times, over so many centuries, and pretty much the versions you pick up now almost read as literature. In fact, the Bible is taught as literature in many universities...

It's hard to even really begin to compare the two in terms of tone and diction unless you have some sort of background in Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, and Greek. People forget that...

[scandal 951]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

even when this nation was built on the expulsion, massacre, and continuous discrimination against the natives of the region they now claim as their own?

the world is not a happy place

yeah, no doubt. to be fair, i don't really care about middle eastern politics. just had to throw that in there

Well you certainly did that (throw it in).

As I said, I recognize the legitimate aspirations of the Palestinians, and accept that they have valid grievances.

I also recognize the continuous history of attachment of the people of Israel to their land throughout 2000 years of Disaspora. During which time there were at all times Jews continuing to reside in the holy cities of Jerusalem, Tiberias, Hebron and Tzfat. I also know well the history of terrorist attacks by Arabs against Jews going back to the pre-1948 era, and continuing from that time to the present.

I would like to see a two state solution that provides for the statehood aspirations of both peoples.

Are you prepared to say the same? Are you prepared to simultaneously recognize the legitimate rights of BOTH peoples? And to condemn the atrocities of Palestinians just as you use inflammatory language regarding Israel?

Are you in favor of a two state solution, achieved through negotiation of disputed issues?

Or is the only acceptable solution in your view a single Palestinian state, with no room for a Jewish homeland?

When Israelis complain that they have no "partner for peace", that is the attitude of unfortunately far too many in the region.

[HYENA 4]

I think they both say kill each other 'till no more exist then the world will be cleansed of intolerance

[Danno 1,228]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

Since ole Geeno is pussin out, let me kick it around if I may.

I know you are close to an expert on this issue while I have studied it very little so correct my errors.

The Jews were kind of "granted" the land they now posses after ww2, in fact the orig. plot was considerable small compared to what they hold now. (due to war).

-How exactly does one "grant" a country to a group>?

- Has there been other cases of this as I am sure there are many groups which have national aspirations?

-If one thinks the politics behind Israel becoming a nation or was ill planed, can we really suggest he is an anti-Semite?

[HYENA 4]

I hereby grand thee the nation of xxx

People steal land and always have...look at Russia, China/Tibet, the US, UK, AUS ( most of this is the UK's fault or we'd all be prettier brown skinned hotties)! LOL!

Ohhhh and Iraq once owned Kuwait so they wanted it back and we followed suit "correcting" the earlier split. UK split India and Pakistan and geez....I'm starting to dislike the UK!

I wanna go back and live in a tent and smoke my peace pipe!

So the Jews have a friend with bombs so they get to keep their country. The palestinians need to step it up or continue to suffer. Maybe the meanest country win!

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

The land has always been Jewish and Arab, in modern history the Ottoman Empire had the longest claim (roughly 300 years) then with its collapse it was British / French held it and the first plans for separate nations were hatched.

It makes you wonder if the nation had been kept as one with Jewish and Arab leaders which would get the upper hand? I suppose the one with the larger voting population.

[HYENA 4]

darn honkeys coming in ans screwing it up for everyone!

[meowmeowmeow 1]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

even when this nation was built on the expulsion, massacre, and continuous discrimination against the natives of the region they now claim as their own?

the world is not a happy place

yeah, no doubt. to be fair, i don't really care about middle eastern politics. just had to throw that in there

Well you certainly did that (throw it in).

As I said, I recognize the legitimate aspirations of the Palestinians, and accept that they have valid grievances.

I also recognize the continuous history of attachment of the people of Israel to their land throughout 2000 years of Disaspora. During which time there were at all times Jews continuing to reside in the holy cities of Jerusalem, Tiberias, Hebron and Tzfat. I also know well the history of terrorist attacks by Arabs against Jews going back to the pre-1948 era, and continuing from that time to the present.

I would like to see a two state solution that provides for the statehood aspirations of both peoples.

Are you prepared to say the same? Are you prepared to simultaneously recognize the legitimate rights of BOTH peoples? And to condemn the atrocities of Palestinians just as you use inflammatory language regarding Israel?

Are you in favor of a two state solution, achieved through negotiation of disputed issues?

Or is the only acceptable solution in your view a single Palestinian state, with no room for a Jewish homeland?

When Israelis complain that they have no "partner for peace", that is the attitude of unfortunately far too many in the region.

if my memory serves me correctly, the two nation state was the proposed solution to everything, until zionists violated this pact and went ahead and declared the state of israel in 1948. by the way, jewish terrorism did exist in the pre-1948 period as well. and it still exists today, google gush emunim as an example.

and yeah sure i am cool with recognizing a two state solution, but the kicker here is how is that gonna happen? especially when israel continues to keep building settlements on disputed land and in jerusalem? by the way, did you know that ariel sharon publicly said in the 1990s what every israeli politician wants: to push all the palestinians into "eastern palestine" aka jordan and make thata palestinian state instead, leaving the disputed land for israelis? just wondering if this is a serious thing that israel wants to do still. jordan's population is already 75% palestinian so it makes some sense.

and have you heard of this greater israel idea? Greater Israel Map

it's so sad how this "anti-semite" term is abused as well. arabs are semites too! so if someone hates on an arab, can i call them an anti-semite too?

have you read this book? pretty alarming? Paul Findlay: They Dare to Speak Out

certainly, the palestinian side is not innocent either. many palestinians had sold the lands that jews now claim as part of israel. violence is not an excuse, but that's the humanitarian argument. truth be told, this area has been beset with violence for centuries, it is what most people know. as far as suicide bombers go, when over 60-70% of the population lives on less than $2 a day, has absolutely no hope for the future, is restricted in almost zoo-like conditions, and cannot live a normal functioning life due to unnecessary and sporatic checkpoints which are patrolled by obviously racist and excessively demeaning soldiers, what do you expect? the psychological state of some people will obviously be fcvked up, and for these people, strapping on a bomb and blowing yourself up is their way of giving something to their people, dying for their cause, and guaranteeing themselves a place in heaven (although this is stupid, because suicide is a huge no-no in islam, if you die defending your land in armed combat then yeah you are a martyr, but not the bomb thing)

anywayssssssssssssssss...........no easy solution to this problem, indeed.

a lot of people don't know also that palestine was not the first choice for the jewish homeland. the zionist party patrolled the world for other locations, like argentina and uganda....

palestinians have just as much right as jews do to that land. i understand that Yahweh promised the Jews their Holy Land and all and that they are the "chosen people", but that doesn't excuse the fact that there are people who have been living on these lands for centuries and it's just not cool to say "hey, you're not one of us, get the heck out".

correct me if i am wrong.

[meowmeowmeow 1]

darn honkeys coming in ans screwing it up for everyone!

actually, that's a good point....well, to be blunt, i wonder how the world would be if 500 years of imperialism, colonialism, and domination from predominantly western european invaders in south america, north america, asia, africa, etc. didn't happen.

[HYENA 4]

I think it would be a diverse and beaitiful place with tanned hotties everywhere!

[meowmeowmeow 1]

it already is!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Jump to conclusions mats sell well it seems.

Have I missed something here? Did you provide an explanation for this statement, other than the obvious "take it at face value"?

I know you're not generally a massive pr1ck. A little befuddled perhaps. But not one to just claim that the national aspirations of a people 2,000 years in the making is the "worst thing that could happen". We should go back to living stateless, yes?

I'm all for recognizing the valid national aspirations of the Palestinians. and working to achieve them. But not at the expense of the valid national aspirations (and achievements) of my own peeps.

Is an explanation required Mr Scandal seeing as you've already written me off an anti-Israel antisemite...

I'd have been perfectly happy to discuss this - but on the basis of your earlier post, you can go ** yourself