Bill Clinton says he would "fight and die" to defend Israel from Iranian aggression

[Ban Hammer 13,149]

Because of course you should always trust the government. I wonder what it is about them that seems to command such absolute confidence - the nepotism, the conflicts of interests, the lies, the dirty tricks?

Bush did 'fix' the intelligence for Iraq - I'm comfortable with my opinion, based on what I've seen and read. Again noone's forcing you to agree. Just pointing out, as Steven_and_Jinky has already stated that comparing disparate events and circumstances is the same as comparing chalk and cheese. Again noone's forcing you to agree.

Once again, if you can't get over that simple reality perhaps you should leave the thread - rather than try to make it something it isn't.

just because you believe he fixed intelligence (which i'm having a hard time grasping - is such broken and needs to be fixed?) that does not mean i believe it, nor do i have to believe it. until, of course, you rewrite the tos for vj

while on that subject, perhaps you should read the tos, since you are so fond of pointing out to me when i allegedly violate them, pay particular attention to the word "inhibit"

we now return to our regularly scheduled pontification by fishdude

So if you know what a Chickenhawk is, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

i noticed you completely dodged that question previously about the armor. did you check that out? hmmm? keep up the deflection

Edited July 18, 2006 by charlesandnessa

[one...two...tree 2,762]

So if you know what a Chickenhawk is, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

i noticed you completely dodged that question previously about the armor. did you check that out? hmmm? keep up the deflection

Can you show me proof that Clinton specifically told the Rangers to go in using light armor? Otherwise, how I am suppose to answer such a wild claim. Research it where? Point me in the direction.

But that's really not the meat of what we're debating. You've made the claim that Clinton's lack of military experience was a big flaw in his presidency to which I then asked you, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

just because you believe he fixed intelligence (which i'm having a hard time grasping - is such broken and needs to be fixed?) that does not mean i believe it, nor do i have to believe it. until, of course, you rewrite the tos for vj

while on that subject, perhaps you should read the tos, since you are so fond of pointing out to me when i allegedly violate them, pay particular attention to the word "inhibit"

Never said you did. I'm simply pointing out that you seem to delight in hijacking a thread and turning it into a personal $hit-throwing match, unconnected with the topic under discussion. That says to me that you are unable to debate without losing your rag.

[camaleon 0]

are u guys really discussing about what clinton's said... He doesn't even know what he is talking about.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

are u guys really discussing about what clinton's said... He doesn't even know what he is talking about.

He said it 4 years ago, so its out of context for the current crisis. Not that he would really (in 100 years) "fight and die" to defend Israel from Iranian aggression.

[Ban Hammer 13,149]

So if you know what a Chickenhawk is, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

i noticed you completely dodged that question previously about the armor. did you check that out? hmmm? keep up the deflection

Can you show me proof that Clinton specifically told the Rangers to go in using light armor? Otherwise, how I am suppose to answer such a wild claim. Research it where? Point me in the direction.

But that's really not the meat of what we're debating. You've made the claim that Clinton's lack of military experience was a big flaw in his presidency to which I then asked you, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

did clinton specifically tell the rangers. hmmm. les aspin denied such due to clinton thinking it would be politically wrong. and people got killed. i'm certain that les aspin briefed bill on that, and got his approval.

that clinton didn't have any military experience is just a sticking point with me. who wants a commander in chief that is a draft dodger?

just because you believe he fixed intelligence (which i'm having a hard time grasping - is such broken and needs to be fixed?) that does not mean i believe it, nor do i have to believe it. until, of course, you rewrite the tos for vj

while on that subject, perhaps you should read the tos, since you are so fond of pointing out to me when i allegedly violate them, pay particular attention to the word "inhibit"

Never said you did. I'm simply pointing out that you seem to delight in hijacking a thread and turning it into a personal $hit-throwing match, unconnected with the topic under discussion. That says to me that you are unable to debate without losing your rag.

according to you, i hijack a thread. funny how you're the only one complaining.

but it's apparent who's losing their rag right now

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

according to you, i hijack a thread. funny how you're the only one complaining. but it's apparent who's losing their rag right now

If you like, chum.

did clinton specifically tell the rangers. hmmm. les aspin denied such due to clinton thinking it would be politically wrong. and people got killed. i'm certain that les aspin briefed bill on that, and got his approval.

that clinton didn't have any military experience is just a sticking point with me. who wants a commander in chief that is a draft dodger?

Apparently the American people did when they voted him into office the second time. A chicken by any other name...

Represents the American people, but isn't representative of the American people

[one...two...tree 2,762]

So if you know what a Chickenhawk is, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

i noticed you completely dodged that question previously about the armor. did you check that out? hmmm? keep up the deflection

Can you show me proof that Clinton specifically told the Rangers to go in using light armor? Otherwise, how I am suppose to answer such a wild claim. Research it where? Point me in the direction.

But that's really not the meat of what we're debating. You've made the claim that Clinton's lack of military experience was a big flaw in his presidency to which I then asked you, why is it relevant in Clinton's case that he had no military experience, but it's a non-issue for you with regard to Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, etc. - the key players who engineered the war in Iraq?

did clinton specifically tell the rangers. hmmm. les aspin denied such due to clinton thinking it would be politically wrong. and people got killed. i'm certain that les aspin briefed bill on that, and got his approval.

that clinton didn't have any military experience is just a sticking point with me. who wants a commander in chief that is a draft dodger?

Did you know that Les Aspin was favored by the Reagan Administration? He also happened to be a Democrat and had opposed the war in Vietnam - he never served in the military, yet was considered a military expert. Check it out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Aspin

Here's another website worth checking out regarding the Battle of Mogadishu and specifically about the issue of light armor:

http://inquirer.philly.com/packages/somalia/ask/ask20.asp

Defense Secretary Les Aspin cut Bradley armored vehicles from the force request. There are those who feel this was, perhaps, the worst single mistake associated with this event (and, indeed, Aspin later acknowledged it was a mistake). Others, notably Maj. Gen. Bill Garrison, the TFR commander, believe armor would not have significantly altered what happened and might have made things worse.

But lets get back to the whole point of what makes a good President. Because Clinton opposed the war in Vietnam doesn't disqualify him from being a capable Commander-in-Chief. You've tried to prove that with what happened in Somalia and the failure of that mission had nothing to do with his lack of military experience. The man has got more intelligence in his elbow than Chucklenuts (GWB) has in his cranium. Even if we were to say it's true, then that makes Cheney, Wolfowitz and the engineers of the Iraq war, military bafoons. You can't have it both ways. You can't hold Clinton's lack of military service against his job performance but let off all the Chickenhawks in Washington.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Here's a more pertinent criticism of Bill

Clinton Allowed Genocide

Clinton acknowledges he failed to stop Rwandan massacre

Lying About Rwanda's Genocide

[Alex+R 0]

Here's a more pertinent criticism of Bill

Clinton Allowed Genocide

Clinton acknowledges he failed to stop Rwandan massacre

Lying About Rwanda's Genocide

Seriously folks.

[Alex+R 0]

I'm such a thread killer.

All I had to give was thumbs

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I'm such a thread killer.

All I had to give was thumbs

Thumbs back to you.

[Saddle Bronc 124]

If you find some evidence that the Clinton administration 'fixed' the intelligence around a pre-determined policy, I'll agree with you

i'll pass on doing so fishdude, i don't want to be sued for you having an aneurysm

If you say so Charles. But between you and me - it's because you can't

Though feel free to continue with the 'quick witted' jibes unassociated to the topic under discussion.

Unfortunately, not quite true--fishdude CAN sue him for having an aneurysm (you did notice that the US has more attorneys than the entire continent of Asia? Some will be only all-too-willing to take fishdude's case in such an event). :lol:

[Saddle Bronc 124]

are u guys really discussing about what clinton's said... He doesn't even know what he is talking about.

He said it 4 years ago, so its out of context for the current crisis. Not that he would really (in 100 years) "fight and die" to defend Israel from Iranian aggression.

Camaleon's point is well taken. He also said it in Toronto, aka Pigtown, which last-I-checked is in Canada--and does not even have the largest American population in that country (that specific honour goes to Calgary, where I was raised).

On the Iranian aggression point see my earlier post

[*Robert* 2]

I miss the Hill & Billary show!!!

Much more amusing with blue stained dresses, cigars, and no sex...