Don't buy into Obamacare?

[Danno 1,228]

Did you purposefully miss the point?

1. when I drive, I am very likely to cause "others danger".

When you have no health insurance you may not cause others 'danger' - but you certainly make them pay for you.

2. No state I know of requires me to insure my car... only damage I cause to others.

See above.

3. The auto insurance is not run by the Govt, the only exception I know of is, NJ tried it and went so far in debt it was a State-Emergency. Not sure what they do there now.

Just because one state tried something once and managed it poorly does not mean that anyone who tries a plan will have the same result.

4. No one forces me to drive, in NC you cant get a license without "liability" coverage (with some exception). If you don't want to pay.... mopeds have no such restrictions on insurance or license.

5. you can carpool take the bus, walk use a bike but there are other ways to live your life with out buying

Auto liability insurance.

I guess if everyone with no HC insurance agreed to stay home and sit quietly, it might be an option.

I was actually right-on-point.

We were comparing two types of insurances, you then verred off into the crazy policy whereby people can use the emergency room as a free=clinic.

Then you suggest that because we have this "free Emergency room"policy... we must frame all future reforms around that it.

Sorry many of us aren't buying it.

[mawilson 2,133]

It's not. Many people welcome healthcare reform, yet oppose government-run healthcare.

The reason is simple: rationing by a private company is not as dangerous as rationing by the

government. You don't like your health insurance company, you can always choose another

one... not so with the government.

[rebeccajo 14]

Did you purposefully miss the point?

1. when I drive, I am very likely to cause "others danger".

When you have no health insurance you may not cause others 'danger' - but you certainly make them pay for you.

2. No state I know of requires me to insure my car... only damage I cause to others.

See above.

3. The auto insurance is not run by the Govt, the only exception I know of is, NJ tried it and went so far in debt it was a State-Emergency. Not sure what they do there now.

Just because one state tried something once and managed it poorly does not mean that anyone who tries a plan will have the same result.

4. No one forces me to drive, in NC you cant get a license without "liability" coverage (with some exception). If you don't want to pay.... mopeds have no such restrictions on insurance or license.

5. you can carpool take the bus, walk use a bike but there are other ways to live your life with out buying

Auto liability insurance.

I guess if everyone with no HC insurance agreed to stay home and sit quietly, it might be an option.

I was actually right-on-point.

We were comparing two types of insurances, you then verred off into the crazy policy whereby people can use the emergency room as a free=clinic.

Then you suggest that because we have this "free Emergency room"policy... we must frame all future reforms around that it.

Sorry many of us aren't buying it.

"Crazy policy" where people can get treatment in the emergency room?

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

It's not. Many people welcome healthcare reform, yet oppose government-run healthcare.

The reason is simple: rationing by a private company is not as dangerous as rationing by the

government. You don't like your health insurance company, you can always choose another

one... not so with the government.

Yes, and no. You are limitted by where you live as to what healthcare options are available. If the government wants true competition, let all the insurance companies provide coverage in all 50 states. For California bussinesses, 6 out of 1300 companies is not true competition.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

But for sh!ts and giggles - who here complains about mandatory car insurance? Anyone? Danno, does it bother you that you could face legal trouble if you are caught without car insurance?

Actually there is a huge difference.

1. when I drive, I am very likely to cause "others danger".

....sure....use that logic with why you want to prevent gay marriages from being legal.

Harm to others...yeah right...only when it's convenient for your logic.

Steve, I think I gave a reasoned logical response to your suggestion comparing auto insurance and health insurance.

How does throwing up the topic of : alternatives to marriage law, contribute to this conversation?

Your logic of 'do no harm' to others, Danno....falls apart when it comes to your position on gay marriage.

FAIL.

[Darnell 8,478]

Just imagine, you graduate high school or College and want to hang at the beach or hike the Aplach. trail for 6 months, who could afford to do that if you must keep up with paying the Gov it's premium every month?

Not only will you pay them every month or suffer their wrath if you don't but who knows what it will be costing in 5 or 10 years after their hands have been all over it.

Ah - you are totally forgetting the good guise of 'graduation presents'.

Families will gang together to make the 1900 dolla deposit for their new graduate - life is fun !

Edited September 26, 2009 by Darnell

[rebeccajo 14]

Danno, I have a question for you.

You are opposed to healthcare reform because you think some people will be getting it for free, right?

You are opposed to healthcare reform because you think everybody will have to pay for it, right?

Which is it - either? Both?

Oh this is going to be good!

Guess not.

[trailmix 77]

It's not. Many people welcome healthcare reform, yet oppose government-run healthcare.

The reason is simple: rationing by a private company is not as dangerous as rationing by the

government. You don't like your health insurance company, you can always choose another

one... not so with the government.

Well that sounds simple when you put it like that, however it's not really true is it? You are rationed in the U.S. by your ability to pay.

Now technically, say you didn't like the insurance your employer had to offer so you went out on your own and bought something you do like, fair enough, this applies as you said above.

I would hazard a guess that most people cannot afford to do this. Therefore many - the lucky ones I guess, compared to the uninsured, are forced to buy in to the employer offered option - that doesn't seem like a choice for most people as I see it.

At least with government run healthcare you can see where the buck stops and vote them out of office (so yes, you can choose another one), when the buck is stopping with insurance companies it's a cloudy trail to see who is really to blame.

[dalegg 143]

Just imagine, you graduate high school or College and want to hang at the beach or hike the Aplach. trail for 6 months, who could afford to do that if you must keep up with paying the Gov it's premium every month?

Not only will you pay them every month or suffer their wrath if you don't but who knows what it will be costing in 5 or 10 years after their hands have been all over it.

Tough! Right now if one of those students falls off the cliff while he's hiking he's automatically treated at the nearest emergency room. He might even have to be helicoptered out of there, and regardless of whether or not he has health insurance, he will get fixed up. If he's as cheap as most students are, he'll never pay the bill, but that doesn't mean the bill doesn't get paid! You and I pay it-through higher insurance premiums.

If they don't like it then maybe next time they can think a little bit harder about who they voted for.

My friend that is a valid point!

but you don't fix one stupid law with then thousand more.

Why not require the cost of this guys emergency care to be deducted from any future income tax refund? I believe they do this for Child support already.

There could also be an opportunity to do civic work to repay this debt.

It's crazy to make everyone surrender liberty for cases like this.

Most of these kids don't have enough deductions to get any reasonable tax refund, then if they have 30 years of debt to the government they lack the motivation to advance in their careers if they know a good chunk of their income is just going to be garnished. No, there are too many people who are too stupid to know what's best for their own good, so we have to help them. Besides someone has to cover MY medicare and the ratio of social security receivers to givers is shrinking. This is a sure way to secure my own future.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Damn straight! Put all these young whipper snappers into gulags if they don't want to get insurance. Put them to work sewing polyester pants and golf shirts, and making white slip-on loafers. I wants to look stylish in my old age!

[dalegg 143]

Pay attention to the wise one.

[Danno 1,228]

Did you purposefully miss the point?

1. when I drive, I am very likely to cause "others danger".

When you have no health insurance you may not cause others 'danger' - but you certainly make them pay for you.

2. No state I know of requires me to insure my car... only damage I cause to others.

See above.

3. The auto insurance is not run by the Govt, the only exception I know of is, NJ tried it and went so far in debt it was a State-Emergency. Not sure what they do there now.

Just because one state tried something once and managed it poorly does not mean that anyone who tries a plan will have the same result.

4. No one forces me to drive, in NC you cant get a license without "liability" coverage (with some exception). If you don't want to pay.... mopeds have no such restrictions on insurance or license.

5. you can carpool take the bus, walk use a bike but there are other ways to live your life with out buying

Auto liability insurance.

I guess if everyone with no HC insurance agreed to stay home and sit quietly, it might be an option.

I was actually right-on-point.

We were comparing two types of insurances, you then verred off into the crazy policy whereby people can use the emergency room as a free=clinic.

Then you suggest that because we have this "free Emergency room"policy... we must frame all future reforms around that it.

Sorry many of us aren't buying it.

"Crazy policy" where people can get treatment in the emergency room?

Awwe shucks you missed the ball again.... here let me go slower.

The crazy policy where people get to waltz out without ever owing a dime.

Skip out on paying your taxes, a traffic ticket or a child support payment and the Gov will follow you for decades.

Get treated for a case of clap at the emergency room and never owe a dime.

If the Bill is big.... we will understand, but don't tell me you have money for deluxe cable TV ...but not for a payment on your emergency room bill.

That is bat-crazy.

[Danno 1,228]

But for sh!ts and giggles - who here complains about mandatory car insurance? Anyone? Danno, does it bother you that you could face legal trouble if you are caught without car insurance?

Actually there is a huge difference.

1. when I drive, I am very likely to cause "others danger".

....sure....use that logic with why you want to prevent gay marriages from being legal.

Harm to others...yeah right...only when it's convenient for your logic.

Steve, I think I gave a reasoned logical response to your suggestion comparing auto insurance and health insurance.

How does throwing up the topic of : alternatives to marriage law, contribute to this conversation?

Your logic of 'do no harm' to others, Danno....falls apart when it comes to your position on gay marriage.

FAIL.

Steve you are the one who is inconsistent.

You are only focused on the rights of two men having the right to decide what a marriage shall consist of... rather than three or four.

(Is this where I am suppose to type silly stuff like... "FAIL"?)

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Skip out on paying your taxes, a traffic ticket or a child support payment and the Gov will follow you for decades.

Get treated for a case of clap at the emergency room and never owe a dime.

Yet you have no qualms about outlawing gay marriage, or gay couples who wish to adopt. You're in favor of continuing to keep marijuana illegal including continuing to throw millions of people in jail for marijuana related charges. You're a real work of contradictions there, Danno.

[Danno 1,228]

Skip out on paying your taxes, a traffic ticket or a child support payment and the Gov will follow you for decades.

Get treated for a case of clap at the emergency room and never owe a dime.

Yet you have no qualms about outlawing gay marriage, or gay couples who wish to adopt. You're in favor of continuing to keep marijuana illegal including continuing to throw millions of people in jail for marijuana related charges. You're a real work of contradictions there, Danno.

While I confess I do place the rights of children to be placed in the most optimum environment first.... and the rights of two men playing Mom and DAD second.. I don't think I have ever commented on laws concerning POT.

Care to refresh my memory?