Wrath of Creditors

[NArocks 13]

Dang I missed all the good parts.

To the OP be very careful

[scandal 951]

Dang I missed all the good parts.

To the OP be very careful

Not really. But I betcha someone (other than AJ) got suspended today

OP: Since your fiance plans to repay all the debt when he gets settled in the US, that's a very different situation than your original post implied. Thanks for clarifying.

My advice would be for him to ensure he has online access to his accounts,and to track them using the web from the US after he arrives here.

He should pay at least the minimum amount each month to keep them in good standing and to keep his credit history clean.

I still have credit and bank accounts open in countries I used to live in (Canada, Israel) and have been doing this for years. Internet banking makes remote management of accounts a breeze.

[Mrs.J06 4]

If I remember correctly, when signing for our mortgage there were some questions in the forms about bankrupcy and open debt during the last 10 years, no matter where they incurred. I also had to give my last full address in Germany, so I guess if they wanted to, they could have found out about old debt.

Either way, it's not a good start to a new life. I hope our fiance comes to his senses.... I would think that repaying out of country debt gets quite expensive, with banking fees etc.

Good luck!

[Old Dominion 26]

No it doesn't I walked away from some debts in Canada and nothing ever showed up on my credit report in the US.

You freeloader, you

How much devastation did you leave behind you in Thailand too?

I'm still allowed back into Thailand, however I am banned for life from Canada. I still owe Samitivej hospital some Baht. I send them money now and then. They were good to me. Other than that I am good in Thailand.

I kinda look at it as Canada kicked me out, so I figure that cleared my debts with RBS, Hydro-Quebec, Bell Canada etc. Probably not a good way to look at it, but so be it. Amex Canada got a hold of my phone number in the US and the debt collectors called me with threats. I laughed my a$$ off at them.

Okay, everyone... Thanks- I didn't know this would become such a HOTT Topic!

He always pays his bills, he has been a stand-up citizen, and he intends to pay these bills once he gets a job here in the US. However, he is charging his online billing credit cards? I don't know how it works. I had him explain everything to me. I am asking about the consequences on me. I will be having a pre-nup because I also own a home (but there is a possibility my parents oppose it and in that case I may not have a pre-nup). He has always paid his taxes and everything, so realistically- what can I do now that I know that he has debt and that he will be coming here with debt? And to answer to everyone's doubts- I sent him $8,500 cash for his visa renewal. The UK requires that people applying for a student visa in the UK have a modest bank balance, and he has returned all of my money with interest. He has no enemies and this is a once-time thing that I don't understand, but does not reflect on his character until now. Will he screw me over? NO... because I am and will safeguard my assets. The question is about now...

I feel that a lot of you would have done the same thing, but were worried or scared of the consequences. This is precisely my concern now. I am not asking for a moral critique, but a real analysis of what may or could happen.

(Thanks to everyone who is answering...)

Q- Why were you banned from Canada?

If he intends to pay these bills once he gets work in the U.S., that's a different scenario. The consequences won't change -- both of you will be obligated. You can safeguard all your assets and still be obligated once married.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

No it doesn't I walked away from some debts in Canada and nothing ever showed up on my credit report in the US.

You freeloader, you

How much devastation did you leave behind you in Thailand too?

I'm still allowed back into Thailand, however I am banned for life from Canada. I still owe Samitivej hospital some Baht. I send them money now and then. They were good to me. Other than that I am good in Thailand.

I kinda look at it as Canada kicked me out, so I figure that cleared my debts with RBS, Hydro-Quebec, Bell Canada etc. Probably not a good way to look at it, but so be it. Amex Canada got a hold of my phone number in the US and the debt collectors called me with threats. I laughed my a$$ off at them.

Okay, everyone... Thanks- I didn't know this would become such a HOTT Topic!

He always pays his bills, he has been a stand-up citizen, and he intends to pay these bills once he gets a job here in the US. However, he is charging his online billing credit cards? I don't know how it works. I had him explain everything to me. I am asking about the consequences on me. I will be having a pre-nup because I also own a home (but there is a possibility my parents oppose it and in that case I may not have a pre-nup). He has always paid his taxes and everything, so realistically- what can I do now that I know that he has debt and that he will be coming here with debt? And to answer to everyone's doubts- I sent him $8,500 cash for his visa renewal. The UK requires that people applying for a student visa in the UK have a modest bank balance, and he has returned all of my money with interest. He has no enemies and this is a once-time thing that I don't understand, but does not reflect on his character until now. Will he screw me over? NO... because I am and will safeguard my assets. The question is about now...

I feel that a lot of you would have done the same thing, but were worried or scared of the consequences. This is precisely my concern now. I am not asking for a moral critique, but a real analysis of what may or could happen.

(Thanks to everyone who is answering...)

Q- Why were you banned from Canada?

If he intends to pay these bills once he gets work in the U.S., that's a different scenario. The consequences won't change -- both of you will be obligated. You can safeguard all your assets and still be obligated once married.

Strictly speaking debts prior to marriage do not automatically become both person's debt just as a mother or father's debt does not become the offsprings. Only duel assets would be effected.

That doesn't stop collectors from trying to go beyond the legal party through lies etc.

Edited August 28, 2009 by lancer1655

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Assuming your fiance is talking about unsecured credit, then he would be fine.

Although theoretically a British bank could pursue him here in the states, there is no chance of them actually doing so. The costs involved for trans-atlantic debt collection are way too high.

You don't need to worry too much about yours or his credit score either. FICO (and other) scores in the U.S. are indexed by your social security number. Regardless of how good (or bad) your credit score was when you came to the U.S., you effectively start out with 0 credit.

Reneging on a loan is not a crime in the U.S. or UK, so you don't have to worry about any "moral turpitude".

Having said that... You never know what the future holds. It would seem foolish to unnecessarily screw up ones credit worthiness anywhere.

Good Luck

All true but for ont thing. Intentionally running up a credit card and intending to default IS a crime. It is fraud. What are the odds they will pursue him and prosecute him? About -0-.

I guess the thing that would concern me most is a fiance that is capable of such things. People that are capable of such things will do them when they can. He may "get away" with this...this time. Next time it is on YOUR dime. He will not be able to work when he arrives for some time. Your living expense essentially double, maybe more. The house that was empty all day will now be occupied and consuming electricity, gas, etc. Medical insurance costs skyrocket when you become a "family" or even just to add a "spouse". Food costs double, maybe more. There is the AOS fees to pay, not to mention an endless list of other expenses that come with relocating to a new country. I cannot even list them, but they are STILL impacting our budget a year after my wife arrived. I cannot believe the increase in all expenses we have had, and my wife is frugal and made sure all her debts were paid in full before leaving Ukraine. Bottom line...his descretionary spending is about to be curtailed BIG TIME and he clearly likes to spend...especially someone else's money. Be careful.

[SophWeb 25]

I have some debt back in the UK. Not a lot, measured in terms of low-hundreds (of pounds) but it's there none the less. It wasn't my intention to leave a debt behind and it was my intention to get it cleared off ASAP but that's just the way things work some times. Unexpected expenses in my last few weeks in England and not the easiest financial times Stateside means it's still there. In so far as I can tell, though, it's not affecting my credit in the USA in any way.

I believe (but don't quote me on it) that there are laws which prohibit the export of personal data from EU countries to countries outside of the EU. That would presumably include financial/credit data so to the OP, while what he did can't really be condoned, I think it's highly unlikely to bite him on the backside here. That said, he'll possibly have CCJs entered against him which would make gaining credit in Britain almost impossible should he ever return.

In the fine print of many loans or credit cards there is a clause that basically says the bank has the right to transfer your debt over to another company, including personal information. Meaning that they will sell your debt to another credit company who is then responsible for recovering it. Once you sign the initial papers, you're agreeing to allow them to pass on this information. Who knows how the second company will try to get that money back? This second company may have a sister company in the US that will attempt to track you down. They may even be a dodgy company who sends big scary men to intimidate you into repaying your debt. You never know...

OP, you said that your fiance intends to repay the money, which is good, however, who's to know when he will be able to repay it back? If you default on any repayments, then I can assure you they will do everything in their power to find your fiance.

You say you want a real analysis on the possible consequences, without the moral critique - the truth is none of us can know for sure what will happen. I can guarantee that if he (or both of you) were to ever return to the UK, this will come back to haunt you. Unpaid debt never just 'goes away'. I would not recommend burning that bridge in the UK. You never know what the future will bring, as I said in a previous post, so why limit your future options?

In terms of your US life though, no one can say for sure what the consequences will be. I don't believe any of us are skilled enough in international law or the ins and outs of credit companies to make that call. But there is a huge risk, because there is a chance they will hunt him down. If these creditors were able to find him, then it could possible affect his future status in the US. I personally think your chances of that happening are low, but they are definitely still there. It all comes down to choice. If you want to take that financial risk, then fine, you have to lay in the bed you've made.

You've spent so long being apart, and dealing with the US Goverment red tape, why risk messing that all up over silly material things. Your relationship is what is most important. I would not risk being apart in the future over this debt.

Best of luck to the both of you.

[fordman 0]

Assuming your fiance is talking about unsecured credit, then he would be fine.

Although theoretically a British bank could pursue him here in the states, there is no chance of them actually doing so. The costs involved for trans-atlantic debt collection are way too high.

You don't need to worry too much about yours or his credit score either. FICO (and other) scores in the U.S. are indexed by your social security number. Regardless of how good (or bad) your credit score was when you came to the U.S., you effectively start out with 0 credit.

Reneging on a loan is not a crime in the U.S. or UK, so you don't have to worry about any "moral turpitude".

Having said that... You never know what the future holds. It would seem foolish to unnecessarily screw up ones credit worthiness anywhere.

Good Luck

All true but for ont thing. Intentionally running up a credit card and intending to default IS a crime. It is fraud. What are the odds they will pursue him and prosecute him? About -0-.

I guess the thing that would concern me most is a fiance that is capable of such things. People that are capable of such things will do them when they can. He may "get away" with this...this time. Next time it is on YOUR dime. He will not be able to work when he arrives for some time. Your living expense essentially double, maybe more. The house that was empty all day will now be occupied and consuming electricity, gas, etc. Medical insurance costs skyrocket when you become a "family" or even just to add a "spouse". Food costs double, maybe more. There is the AOS fees to pay, not to mention an endless list of other expenses that come with relocating to a new country. I cannot even list them, but they are STILL impacting our budget a year after my wife arrived. I cannot believe the increase in all expenses we have had, and my wife is frugal and made sure all her debts were paid in full before leaving Ukraine. Bottom line...his descretionary spending is about to be curtailed BIG TIME and he clearly likes to spend...especially someone else's money. Be careful.

I agree it is foolish, maybe even morally reprehensible. But it is not a crime. The penalty for defaulting on an unsecured loan is very clearly laid out in the terms and conditions of your credit agreement.

The reason you can pay upwards of 20% interest on credit card is that it is very common for people to default on them. It is also VERY easy to clear yourself of any unsecured financial obligations... its called bankruptcy. The only penalty for bankruptcy is a general unwillingness of banks to lend you any further significant amounts of money.

That being said it is very stupid to burn your financial bridges. BUT it is also very common.

[familyguy 2]

That doesn't stop collectors from trying to go beyond the legal party through lies etc.

A summons to appear in front of a Federal Judge and explain their lies often does the trick however.

[Mike B. 231]

Assuming your fiance is talking about unsecured credit, then he would be fine.

Although theoretically a British bank could pursue him here in the states, there is no chance of them actually doing so. The costs involved for trans-atlantic debt collection are way too high.

You don't need to worry too much about yours or his credit score either. FICO (and other) scores in the U.S. are indexed by your social security number. Regardless of how good (or bad) your credit score was when you came to the U.S., you effectively start out with 0 credit.

Reneging on a loan is not a crime in the U.S. or UK, so you don't have to worry about any "moral turpitude".

Having said that... You never know what the future holds. It would seem foolish to unnecessarily screw up ones credit worthiness anywhere.

Good Luck

All true but for ont thing. Intentionally running up a credit card and intending to default IS a crime. It is fraud. What are the odds they will pursue him and prosecute him? About -0-.

I guess the thing that would concern me most is a fiance that is capable of such things. People that are capable of such things will do them when they can. He may "get away" with this...this time. Next time it is on YOUR dime. He will not be able to work when he arrives for some time. Your living expense essentially double, maybe more. The house that was empty all day will now be occupied and consuming electricity, gas, etc. Medical insurance costs skyrocket when you become a "family" or even just to add a "spouse". Food costs double, maybe more. There is the AOS fees to pay, not to mention an endless list of other expenses that come with relocating to a new country. I cannot even list them, but they are STILL impacting our budget a year after my wife arrived. I cannot believe the increase in all expenses we have had, and my wife is frugal and made sure all her debts were paid in full before leaving Ukraine. Bottom line...his descretionary spending is about to be curtailed BIG TIME and he clearly likes to spend...especially someone else's money. Be careful.

I agree it is foolish, maybe even morally reprehensible. But it is not a crime. The penalty for defaulting on an unsecured loan is very clearly laid out in the terms and conditions of your credit agreement.

The reason you can pay upwards of 20% interest on credit card is that it is very common for people to default on them. It is also VERY easy to clear yourself of any unsecured financial obligations... its called bankruptcy. The only penalty for bankruptcy is a general unwillingness of banks to lend you any further significant amounts of money.

That being said it is very stupid to burn your financial bridges. BUT it is also very common.

It is common for people to default on their debt, and those people are not criminals. While I don't know one way or another, I wouldn't be surprised if taking on debt with the specific intention of never paying it back was considered fraud in the UK, though I guess that's not what we are dealing with here.