Public option is dead. It's official.

[_Simpson_ 250]

Its a lot simpler than you're making out - since we have no way of telling who is lazy or dishonest and who isn't we operate on the basis that there is a genuine, honest need.

I disagree, especially with what were addressing here, health care reform. If we want to come up with a solution that will be excepted and worthwhile we need to factor in human nature, good and bad. To come up with a reform bill that assumes all people are honest and genuine is a huge mistake.

How... exactly... would you do that?

Bring responsibility into the equation and keep health care out of the govs. hands, theres a lack of it there if you havent noticed. Put in regulations in that will keep prices down and lechers away.

Do you really believe we should address this issue as all are genuine and honest?

[My Name Is Nobody 3]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

OMG What are you saying? If the goverment passes a healtcare bill it wont be a part of it

Let me guess you recieved the talking points of its now insurance reform instead of healthcare

[LaL 418]

Its a lot simpler than you're making out - since we have no way of telling who is lazy or dishonest and who isn't we operate on the basis that there is a genuine, honest need.

I disagree, especially with what were addressing here, health care reform. If we want to come up with a solution that will be excepted and worthwhile we need to factor in human nature, good and bad. To come up with a reform bill that assumes all people are honest and genuine is a huge mistake.

How... exactly... would you do that?

Bring responsibility into the equation and keep health care out of the govs. hands, theres a lack of it there if you havent noticed. Put in regulations in that will keep prices down and lechers away.

Do you really believe we should address this issue as all are genuine and honest?

Are you suggesting people in countries where there is national health care, that they are a bunch of irresponsible moochers?

Edited August 17, 2009 by LaL

[SMOKE 1,426]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

none call for it. any that contain a public option will put it on the fast track towards socialized heathcare...private companies can NOT compete with government w/o being subsidized.

[_Simpson_ 250]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

The incentive there will be for employers to use government health care instead of forking it out themselves. I think as a incentive employers will go towards giving higher wages.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

House vote on single payer will be historic first, doctors' group says

Hailing last week’s pledge by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi to hold a floor debate and vote on single-payer health reform this fall, a group of 16,000 physicians is launching an intensified campaign to educate lawmakers about the urgency of a “Medicare-for-All” solution to the nation’s health care crisis.

Leaders of Physicians for a National Health Program (PNHP) say their campaign includes a stepped-up program of visits by doctors to House members in their home districts during the August recess.

Last Friday’s commitment by Pelosi (D-Calif.) to Rep. Anthony Weiner (D-N.Y.) to put his single-payer amendment to H.R. 3200, the House leadership’s health reform bill, to an up-or-down vote before the full House has set the stage for first-ever floor vote of its kind. The House debate on the amendment could begin as early as September.

“Single payer has gone from being ‘off the table’ to ‘on the floor,’” said Dr. Quentin Young, national coordinator of PNHP. “This dramatic turn of events is a striking indicator of our success. It shows the House leadership recognizes the strong public support - including among doctors - for removing the wasteful insurance company middlemen from our health system and redirecting the resultant savings into care.”

Weiner’s amendment would delete most of the language in the House bill and instead substitute language from H.R. 676, the single-payer bill introduced by Reps. John Conyers Jr. (D-Mich.) and Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio).

The Weiner amendment, unlike the House leadership’s bill, assures universal, comprehensive, and high-quality coverage, free choice of doctor and hospital, and no co-pays or deductibles through a publicly financed system similar to Medicare. Young said that because of massive savings on private insurance overhead and paperwork, the amendment would entail no increase in U.S. health spending, in contrast to the House bill’s $1 trillion price tag over 10 years.

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/august/house...e_on_single.php

“By recapturing the administrative waste associated with our present multi-payer, for-profit private insurance system, estimated to be $400 billion annually, a single-payer program would have more than enough resources to cover everyone who lacks insurance now and to upgrade everyone else’s coverage,” he said.

“A single-payer system would also possess strong cost-control tools like bulk purchasing of drugs, negotiation of fees and global hospital budgeting, controls that are notably absent in the House bill,” he said.

Young says many union, civic and faith-based groups will be watching how lawmakers vote with an eye to the 2010 election cycle. “Lawmakers now have a golden opportunity to stand up for the best interests of their constituents, to rebuff the private, for-profit health insurance industry, and to assure the health of our nation,” he said.

He continued: “Many members of Congress - including Speaker Pelosi - have told constituents that they personally support a single-payer, Medicare-for-all approach, but claim they can’t vote for it because it’s not politically feasible. Yet polls that show they would have the public’s support for such a stand. Now we’ll be watching to see whether their votes match their words.”

Single-payer bills have been introduced in Congress repeatedly over the past 60 years - starting with the Wagner-Murray-Dingell bill in the 1940s, and including the Kennedy-Griffiths bill of the 1970s and the Wellstone, McDermott and Russo bills of the 1990s - but none has ever reached the floor of the House or Senate.

Single payer addresses health insurance and advocates nationalizing it. Health insurance and health care are not one and the same. Hence, my question is still unanswered:

Which provision of which bill calls for socialized health care - i.e. makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

The incentive there will be for employers to use government health care instead of forking it out themselves. I think as a incentive employers will go towards giving higher wages.

What health care is government to provide according to any of the bills under consideration?

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Socialized means the government pays for it. Nationalized means the government owns it.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Socialized means the government pays for it. Nationalized means the government owns it.

Then healthcare is already socialized in large part today. After all, they are already subsidizing the premiums we pay.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

OMG What are you saying? If the goverment passes a healtcare bill it wont be a part of it

Let me guess you recieved the talking points of its now insurance reform instead of healthcare.

Are you saying that health care and health insurance are one and the same? Do you go to Aetna or Cigna for treatment? Most people go to a doctor or a hospital for that.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I just dont think socialized medicare health care(with this reform bill the way it is that is the direction it will go) is the way to go about it

Which reform bill calls for socialized health care? What portion of which bill proposes to socialize medical services? Which provision of which bill makes doctors, hospitals and other medical service providers part of the government?

OMG What are you saying? If the goverment passes a healtcare bill it wont be a part of it

Let me guess you recieved the talking points of its now insurance reform instead of healthcare.

Are you saying that health care and health insurance are one and the same? Do you go to Aetna or Cigna for treatment? Most people go to a doctor or a hospital for that.

I let my actuarial guy cut me open yesterday, it didn't go too well.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Socialized means the government pays for it. Nationalized means the government owns it.

Then healthcare is already socialized in large part today. After all, they are already subsidizing the premiums we pay.

It's true! And the government deficits already reflects that cost.

[_Simpson_ 250]

Its a lot simpler than you're making out - since we have no way of telling who is lazy or dishonest and who isn't we operate on the basis that there is a genuine, honest need.

I disagree, especially with what were addressing here, health care reform. If we want to come up with a solution that will be excepted and worthwhile we need to factor in human nature, good and bad. To come up with a reform bill that assumes all people are honest and genuine is a huge mistake.

How... exactly... would you do that?

Bring responsibility into the equation and keep health care out of the govs. hands, theres a lack of it there if you havent noticed. Put in regulations in that will keep prices down and lechers away.

Do you really believe we should address this issue as all are genuine and honest?

Are you suggesting people in countries where there is national health care, that they are a bunch of irresponsible moochers?

There are a fair amount of them in these countries and to say that there isnt is ridiculous. I am not saying that they are the majority what I am saying is that you got to take into consideration the dishonest and honest and not assume everybody is genuine and honest(which I am sure these countries took into consideration).

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I am not saying that they are the majority what I am saying is that you got to take into consideration the dishonest and honest and not assume everybody is genuine and honest(which I am sure these countries took into consideration).

That sentence gave me a headache.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its a lot simpler than you're making out - since we have no way of telling who is lazy or dishonest and who isn't we operate on the basis that there is a genuine, honest need.

I disagree, especially with what were addressing here, health care reform. If we want to come up with a solution that will be excepted and worthwhile we need to factor in human nature, good and bad. To come up with a reform bill that assumes all people are honest and genuine is a huge mistake.

How... exactly... would you do that?

Bring responsibility into the equation and keep health care out of the govs. hands, theres a lack of it there if you havent noticed. Put in regulations in that will keep prices down and lechers away.

Do you really believe we should address this issue as all are genuine and honest?

How?

[Peikko 1,575]

You give everyone an 'genuine and honest' test prior to treatment.