'Urine or You're Out'.

[thepizzadude 26]

Its Eric.

Yah I heard

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Eric's posts removed

[ScottThuy 140]

The Urine testing would create a bunch of jobs for Pee collectors...

Edited August 15, 2009 by ScottThuy

[DIARD 1]

I don't know why people think that everyone on welfare is a drug addict. This just isn't the case. Also since all of the welfare reform, you can no longer stay on welfare for years on end. They have a cap on it, I think 5 years but I don't know for certain. I know the daycare subsidy is 5 year cap. Also you must submit for job training or work, even if you have kids.

[GabiandVi 34]

I don't know why people think that everyone on welfare is a drug addict. This just isn't the case. Also since all of the welfare reform, you can no longer stay on welfare for years on end. They have a cap on it, I think 5 years but I don't know for certain. I know the daycare subsidy is 5 year cap. Also you must submit for job training or work, even if you have kids.

I think the 5 year cap on daycare is per child. Depending on your situation, you may not get that long. But then there are subsidies for before and after school care. Subsidies to buy uniforms and school supplies. And there seems to be no cap on food stamps, medicare, and public housing. Welfare, meaning getting a check because you are not working and have never worked, yes, but other subsidies, I don't think so. So if you make below a certain salary, you can get all these subsidies. If you make above a certain salary, you have to pay taxes and can't get any of those subsidies. From my observations, what that means is that those of us who make above a certain salary but are still low on the scale, find it harder to make ends meet than those who fall below the cut off. I'm a teacher and my students who are all on free breakfast free lunch and who speak openly about their other subsidies, sometimes complaining that it's #######, sometimes telling me I'm stupid if I don't get on the subsidies, seem to have more and better stuff than I have. They have ipods and expensive cell phones. They have their hair done on a regular basis. They get tatoos and gold teeth for their birthdays. They wear really expensive shoes and jewelery. Some of them have their own jobs, but not the majority.

Oh, and for a lot of these subsidies, your assets do not come into play. I have a friend whose legally immigrant husband can't work because he has to go through all sorts of hoops to get his medical degree recognized here, so they are living off their savings, which was more than enough to qualify a family of four to meet the immigration requirements. They also qualify for daycare subsidies, children's health insurance, a sort of food stamps for the baby's milk, etc. She has a very low paying job and she thinks they could probably qualify for other assistance as well, but they are only getting those things. Actually, the daycare subsidy for the baby has run out because her husband is not working. They only got six months of it.

I don't think that all or even the majority of welfare recipients is on drugs. But neither is the majority of people who have to take drug tests at their jobs. I wouldn't see anything wrong with requiring a test of welfare reciipients as long as there is nothing wrong with requiring a test of non welfare recipients. However, I don't think it would be effective. There are ways of scamming the system, and those drug addicts on welfare are probably pros at that.

Edited August 15, 2009 by GabiandVi

[ScottThuy 140]

I don't know why people think that everyone on welfare is a drug addict. This just isn't the case. Also since all of the welfare reform, you can no longer stay on welfare for years on end. They have a cap on it, I think 5 years but I don't know for certain. I know the daycare subsidy is 5 year cap. Also you must submit for job training or work, even if you have kids.

I think the 5 year cap on daycare is per child. Depending on your situation, you may not get that long. But then there are subsidies for before and after school care. Subsidies to buy uniforms and school supplies. And there seems to be no cap on food stamps, medicare, and public housing. Welfare, meaning getting a check because you are not working and have never worked, yes, but other subsidies, I don't think so. So if you make below a certain salary, you can get all these subsidies. If you make above a certain salary, you have to pay taxes and can't get any of those subsidies. From my observations, what that means is that those of us who make above a certain salary but are still low on the scale, find it harder to make ends meet than those who fall below the cut off. I'm a teacher and my students who are all on free breakfast free lunch and who speak openly about their other subsidies, sometimes complaining that it's #######, sometimes telling me I'm stupid if I don't get on the subsidies, seem to have more and better stuff than I have. They have ipods and expensive cell phones. They have their hair done on a regular basis. They get tatoos and gold teeth for their birthdays. They wear really expensive shoes and jewelery. Some of them have their own jobs, but not the majority.

Oh, and for a lot of these subsidies, your assets do not come into play. I have a friend whose legally immigrant husband can't work because he has to go through all sorts of hoops to get his medical degree recognized here, so they are living off their savings, which was more than enough to qualify a family of four to meet the immigration requirements. They also qualify for daycare subsidies, children's health insurance, a sort of food stamps for the baby's milk, etc. She has a very low paying job and she thinks they could probably qualify for other assistance as well, but they are only getting those things. Actually, the daycare subsidy for the baby has run out because her husband is not working. They only got six months of it.

I don't think that all or even the majority of welfare recipients is on drugs. But neither is the majority of people who have to take drug tests at their jobs. I wouldn't see anything wrong with requiring a test of welfare reciipients as long as there is nothing wrong with requiring a test of non welfare recipients. However, I don't think it would be effective. There are ways of scamming the system, and those drug addicts on welfare are probably pros at that.

And I just saw a commercial that said if you are on welfare you can get a 'FREE' cell phone through some program... wow... when I was a kid we didnt have cell phones... and now its such a necessity that we need to distribute them to the poor and pay for the service they use... whats wrong with this picture?

[GabiandVi 34]

And I just saw a commercial that said if you are on welfare you can get a 'FREE' cell phone through some program... wow... when I was a kid we didnt have cell phones... and now its such a necessity that we need to distribute them to the poor and pay for the service they use... whats wrong with this picture?

Yes. It's part of the stimulus package, like cash for clunkers. But I'm telling you, it's not necessary. Everyone I know on welfare already has a cell phone. And their children do too.

[brnidokiegurl 0]

on the phones i saw that to, you can get a house phone for like a dollar ninety nine or something if you were on a list of things already qualified for. Used to be poor meant poor now the poor have the large tvs, cable, computers many things. There are those that do really need the help, then there are those that have learned to (use) the help. NO not everyone on welfare does drugs.

I will prob get killed for this statement BUT have you ever wondered how some of these women with these kids, getting assistancee of whatever kind, food, daycare, rent etc can still afford to take a trip overseas to meet and go thru this immigration process?

[LaL 418]

There is no way to tell (yet) if the majority of welfare recipients are on drugs. My guess is it's negligible and has more cost associated with it than savings when people are booted off assistance for positives (assuming they are booted and not run through some rehab). So let's say for example this program is instituted.

Someone will need to pay additionally for:

* collection fees (ya know - the clinic who collects the sample)

* lab fees (the lab who processes the sample)

* MRO fees (the doctor who reads the results)

* the company who runs the drug free program (the consortium who manages the program)

* transportation for many of the disabled individuals who have no other means to get to a clinic

* mailing out the literature regarding the program including the call for randoms.

When I was in this business (Drug Free Workplace for DOT and other safety sensitive jobs), I would get the bills for the collections. The collection, lab and MRO fees alone were average 150 per collection and this was 10 years ago. I have no idea what kind of fees were charged to the companies, nor have any idea what transportation costs can run.

IMHO it's just a whole lot of hooting and hollering and patting one's selves on the back. Furthermore many welfare programs are not just your taxes being used to feed and house others. Often it is their OWN money put into the social security system and are drawing from that. And what about the elderly on SSI? One would have to be seriously demented to give a thumbs up for a 80 year old to have to go through such a thing. Fecking humanity, I tell ya.

[thepizzadude 26]

I don't know why people think that everyone on welfare is a drug addict. This just isn't the case. Also since all of the welfare reform, you can no longer stay on welfare for years on end. They have a cap on it, I think 5 years but I don't know for certain. I know the daycare subsidy is 5 year cap. Also you must submit for job training or work, even if you have kids.

I don't know why people say "I don't know why people think that everyone on welfare is a drug addict." ESPECIALLY when nobody has said that.

[100% Al Ahly Fan 53]

As for social welfare programs; many do require drug testing.

Unfortunately not in Minnesota. I think the Urine or You're Out is a great idea. Wouldn't mind my tax dollars being spend to support this.

[GabiandVi 34]

There is no way to tell (yet) if the majority of welfare recipients are on drugs. My guess is it's negligible and has more cost associated with it than savings when people are booted off assistance for positives (assuming they are booted and not run through some rehab). So let's say for example this program is instituted.

Someone will need to pay additionally for:

* collection fees (ya know - the clinic who collects the sample)

* lab fees (the lab who processes the sample)

* MRO fees (the doctor who reads the results)

* the company who runs the drug free program (the consortium who manages the program)

* transportation for many of the disabled individuals who have no other means to get to a clinic

* mailing out the literature regarding the program including the call for randoms.

When I was in this business (Drug Free Workplace for DOT and other safety sensitive jobs), I would get the bills for the collections. The collection, lab and MRO fees alone were average 150 per collection and this was 10 years ago. I have no idea what kind of fees were charged to the companies, nor have any idea what transportation costs can run.

IMHO it's just a whole lot of hooting and hollering and patting one's selves on the back. Furthermore many welfare programs are not just your taxes being used to feed and house others. Often it is their OWN money put into the social security system and are drawing from that. And what about the elderly on SSI? One would have to be seriously demented to give a thumbs up for a 80 year old to have to go through such a thing. Fecking humanity, I tell ya.

First, I just want to say that SS is not the same as welfare, so when someone suggests testing welfare recipients, they are not necessarily including SS recipients. Also, in many, many cases, the recipients of welfare have never contributed. But, I totally agree with you about the costs of testing. It would not save money in the end. It might make people feel better about the recipients, which might be for the good of the recipients, but if we are considering the bottom line, then it's not worth it.

[Marzy 1]

Yeah, they should get tested every Mondays.

I'm sure some of them does not deserved help.

[Marzy 1]

I'm a Libertarian, so naturally I'd have a problem with this. I am against any drug testing of any kind. What you do at your home is your business, and yours alone. If it interferes with your job performance, then you deserve to be fired for merit.

I agree with you. Unless the job is related to public safety or is inherently dangerous drug tests are a violation of my privacy. But, if I have to take one then those that benefit from my taxes should also take one.

On a side note, the test for pot is a totally unfair one. It does not say if you are high at the moment or if you took a toke a week ago at a party. That one should be banned altogether.

Agreed on the job testing. However, some workplaces specifically tell you they are drug free and that you will be subjected to test sporadically or whatnot. If you are against this, it is your choice not to take the job.

As for social welfare programs; many do require drug testing.

Not every Mondays drug testing.

[LaL 418]

First, I just want to say that SS is not the same as welfare, so when someone suggests testing welfare recipients, they are not necessarily including SS recipients. Also, in many, many cases, the recipients of welfare have never contributed. But, I totally agree with you about the costs of testing. It would not save money in the end. It might make people feel better about the recipients, which might be for the good of the recipients, but if we are considering the bottom line, then it's not worth it.

SSI *is* a type of welfare, but ok. Then SSDI - does that qualify in your opinion as those who should be tested? Also are you saying (per the bolded) that many many recipients do not pay taxes either? Because they do go hand in hand.

ETA: I doubt recipients care enough about what others think about them to feel good about random drug testing.

Edited August 16, 2009 by LaL