Soldiers response to MJ death

[tmma 467]

....... So essentially, hasn't America done this to itself? If we aren't made aware that Sargent Smith has passed away in Iraq, how does the public mourn or celebrate his life?

While I agree that soldiers deserve the utmost respect in life and death for their service, they did sign on the dotted line and it's an unfortunate possibility int he line of work they do.

...what can you do?

My point is that it's obscene that congress held a moment of silence for MJ and sneaked fallen soldiers back under darkness.

Yes, soldiers deserve the utmost respect , they've sacrificed-and originally we were not informed of their death overseas or given the op to mourn, yet MJ virtually abuses himself to death (presumably) and gets a minute silence-like I said before--#######?

PLUS-I do hope you were not indicating that because they volunteered for the military ( signed on the dotted line) that somehow their families and friends should have somehow expected the shabby treatment and repatriation?...No, I am sure you were not suggesting that.

"What can you do?" Well,I don't know about anyone else, but I for one am an advocate both for veterans and AD service people and refuse to BUY into the hype & hypocrisy over MJ or any other inflated, self abusive 'celebrity'.

Seriously, the thought that some people are actually sort of 'ok' with this really does convince me that we ARE in opposite world.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

In Canada when people die in combat we give them a national funeral. It is shown on tv live and we make sure every one knows about it.

My husband told me about a year ago, after Ia sked him why I never heard much about soldiers dying except a quick 1 minute blurb on the news, that during the Vietnam war (or gulf war? can't remember) that they stopped giving individual funerals like that where the soldier's body is flown home and publicized on national tv. I can't remember the reasons why, but I do remember us talking about it. So essentially, hasn't America done this to itself? If we aren't made aware that Sargent Smith has passed away in Iraq, how does the public mourn or celebrate his life?

While I agree that soldiers deserve the utmost respect in life and death for their service, they did sign on the dotted line and it's an unfortunate possibility int he line of work they do.

As far as teachers go, please visit our state of New Jersey and ask any one about teachers. They are the largest union in the state and the way we pay respect to them is through their high salaries tax payers pay for. They are taken care of for life. So, when Mrs. Smith dies of old age at 89 years old, I don't really feel like I'm obliged to pay my respects to her.

Was the MJ thing crazy? Yeah, well, what do you expect out of the media? And, again, I said this before in another thread...MJ wasn't the only one to be treated like this! When Anna Nicole Smith died, she was on the tv 24 hours a day for a good 6 months and she was half the celebrity that MJ was so...what can you do?

They stop getting national attention when the numbers grow so large that it becomes impractical. In seven years there have been 124 Canadian soldiers who have died in Afghanistan. In that same amount of time there have been 470 American deaths in Afghanistan, and over 4300 American deaths in Iraq. In Vietnam there were nearly 60,000 American deaths. At some point, the numbers are just too big, so they start giving a daily recap of the figures and stop spending time on each individual.

It's probably appropriate to pay respect to everyone who makes any kind of contribution during their time on this planet. Even the guy who sweeps up dog poop from the walkway at the park is making a positive impact on people's lives. In the end, there just aren't enough hours in the day to honor everyone.

I think MJ's death got a lot of attention certainly because he was a very popular entertainer, but also because he was black (by race, if not by skin color), and blacks unfortunately have too few heros in America.

[tmma 467]

In Canada when people die in combat we give them a national funeral. It is shown on tv live and we make sure every one knows about it.

My husband told me about a year ago, after Ia sked him why I never heard much about soldiers dying except a quick 1 minute blurb on the news, that during the Vietnam war (or gulf war? can't remember) that they stopped giving individual funerals like that where the soldier's body is flown home and publicized on national tv. I can't remember the reasons why, but I do remember us talking about it. So essentially, hasn't America done this to itself? If we aren't made aware that Sargent Smith has passed away in Iraq, how does the public mourn or celebrate his life?

While I agree that soldiers deserve the utmost respect in life and death for their service, they did sign on the dotted line and it's an unfortunate possibility int he line of work they do.

As far as teachers go, please visit our state of New Jersey and ask any one about teachers. They are the largest union in the state and the way we pay respect to them is through their high salaries tax payers pay for. They are taken care of for life. So, when Mrs. Smith dies of old age at 89 years old, I don't really feel like I'm obliged to pay my respects to her.

Was the MJ thing crazy? Yeah, well, what do you expect out of the media? And, again, I said this before in another thread...MJ wasn't the only one to be treated like this! When Anna Nicole Smith died, she was on the tv 24 hours a day for a good 6 months and she was half the celebrity that MJ was so...what can you do?

They stop getting national attention when the numbers grow so large that it becomes impractical. In seven years there have been 124 Canadian soldiers who have died in Afghanistan. In that same amount of time there have been 470 American deaths in Afghanistan, and over 4300 American deaths in Iraq. In Vietnam there were nearly 60,000 American deaths. At some point, the numbers are just too big, so they start giving a daily recap of the figures and stop spending time on each individual.

It's probably appropriate to pay respect to everyone who makes any kind of contribution during their time on this planet. Even the guy who sweeps up dog poop from the walkway at the park is making a positive impact on people's lives. In the end, there just aren't enough hours in the day to honor everyone.

I think MJ's death got a lot of attention certainly because he was a very popular entertainer, but also because he was black (by race, if not by skin color), and blacks unfortunately have too few heros in America.

Sticky ground here but we have a racially diverse Military, there are many, many heros of all races.. Sometimes it seems like the people that contribute POSITIVLY are celebrated the least-it's the congressional moment of silence for MJ that boils me....JMO.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

They stop getting national attention when the numbers grow so large that it becomes impractical. In seven years there have been 124 Canadian soldiers who have died in Afghanistan. In that same amount of time there have been 470 American deaths in Afghanistan, and over 4300 American deaths in Iraq. In Vietnam there were nearly 60,000 American deaths. At some point, the numbers are just too big, so they start giving a daily recap of the figures and stop spending time on each individual.

It's probably appropriate to pay respect to everyone who makes any kind of contribution during their time on this planet. Even the guy who sweeps up dog poop from the walkway at the park is making a positive impact on people's lives. In the end, there just aren't enough hours in the day to honor everyone.

I think MJ's death got a lot of attention certainly because he was a very popular entertainer, but also because he was black (by race, if not by skin color), and blacks unfortunately have too few heros in America.

Great post.

[natty bumppo 297]

They stop getting national attention when the numbers grow so large that it becomes impractical. In seven years there have been 124 Canadian soldiers who have died in Afghanistan. In that same amount of time there have been 470 American deaths in Afghanistan, and over 4300 American deaths in Iraq. In Vietnam there were nearly 60,000 American deaths. At some point, the numbers are just too big, so they start giving a daily recap of the figures and stop spending time on each individual.

It's probably appropriate to pay respect to everyone who makes any kind of contribution during their time on this planet. Even the guy who sweeps up dog poop from the walkway at the park is making a positive impact on people's lives. In the end, there just aren't enough hours in the day to honor everyone.

I think MJ's death got a lot of attention certainly because he was a very popular entertainer, but also because he was black (by race, if not by skin color), and blacks unfortunately have too few heros in America.

Great post.

don't black soldiers who lost their lives count ?

[tmma 467]

They stop getting national attention when the numbers grow so large that it becomes impractical. In seven years there have been 124 Canadian soldiers who have died in Afghanistan. In that same amount of time there have been 470 American deaths in Afghanistan, and over 4300 American deaths in Iraq. In Vietnam there were nearly 60,000 American deaths. At some point, the numbers are just too big, so they start giving a daily recap of the figures and stop spending time on each individual.

It's probably appropriate to pay respect to everyone who makes any kind of contribution during their time on this planet. Even the guy who sweeps up dog poop from the walkway at the park is making a positive impact on people's lives. In the end, there just aren't enough hours in the day to honor everyone.

I think MJ's death got a lot of attention certainly because he was a very popular entertainer, but also because he was black (by race, if not by skin color), and blacks unfortunately have too few heros in America.

Great post.

'Great post'...Really? So you think that it's OK for congress to give MJ a moment of silence- and sneak back fallen soldiers ( of ALL races) back under darkness, just because he was black? Because JimVa basically said that's the reason why he is celebrated.....And that's OK with you?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think they have held minutes of silence for the troops. There's only so many times you can do that before it becomes a trite and meaningless gesture - if Congress held a minutes silence for every US soldier that died (saw a headline that two died in Afghanistan today) then noone would get any work done.

Sneaking the bodies of dead servicemen back into the US was something that was started during the Bush administration as was banning the publication of the photos of flag draped coffins (because it was thought that it would further polarise public opinion on an already controversial policy).

I have no problem with Congress doing a moment of silence for MJ if they deem it appropriate (though these things always seem like pandering to trite populism at the end of the day), and it doesn't mean that the troops are somehow being neglected.

[tmma 467]

I think they have held minutes of silence for the troops. There's only so many times you can do that before it becomes a trite and meaningless gesture - if Congress held a minutes silence for every US soldier that died (saw a headline that two died in Afghanistan today) then noone would get any work done.

Sneaking the bodies of dead servicemen back into the US was something that was started during the Bush administration as was banning the publication of the photos of flag draped coffins (because it was thought that it would further polarise public opinion on an already controversial policy).

I have no problem with Congress doing a moment of silence for MJ if they deem it appropriate (though these things always seem like pandering to trite populism at the end of the day), and it doesn't mean that the troops are somehow being neglected.

I know the sneaking back was a Bush policy-a shameful one at that (IMO). I am glad that has now changed.

I guess if you and everyone else is 'OK' with a moment of silence for a national hero like MJ, then it's all OK.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I don't think he was a national hero, but clearly there was a public outpouring of sentiment about his death - no doubt some of that fueled artificially by the media.

As I say, I don't think its that big of an issue. It isn't the first time a dead celebrity has been glorified like this (hell everyone in the UK had to sit through that whole Princess Diana performance).

[tmma 467]

I don't think he was a national hero, but clearly there was a public outpouring of sentiment about his death - no doubt some of that fueled artificially by the media.

As I say, I don't think its that big of an issue. It isn't the first time a dead celebrity has been glorified like this (hell everyone in the UK had to sit through that whole Princess Diana performance).

The whole Princess Diana thing was way OTT. I agree. I am not sure that will ever end.

It's just ( and maybe I am wrong) but I thought congressional moments of silence was reserved for National Heros who have sacrificed in some way. To me, it seems to cheapen it somewhat when we bestow this on an inflated pop king, who was under suspicion for pedophilia, abused drugs...etc etc.....but like I said the majority rules and if everyone else is OK with it all then....

Edited July 14, 2009 by tmma

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its populism - there's nothing much more to it than that. There's no reason to suppose that Congress is somehow immune to that.

[Mark&Steph 0]

Well, the man did donate millions to charity and raised millions for African famine relief with the We Are The World song. I'm sure to people who benefited from any of that see him as a lot more than just an entertainer. I do think it's a tad silly that they had a moment of silence for him but oh well. At least we have Veteran's day for remembering the soldiers. It's not like they're going to make a Michael Jackson day. At least, let's hope not.

[Ban Hammer 13,336]

Well, the man did donate millions to charity and raised millions for African famine relief with the We Are The World song. I'm sure to people who benefited from any of that see him as a lot more than just an entertainer. I do think it's a tad silly that they had a moment of silence for him but oh well. At least we have Veteran's day for remembering the soldiers. It's not like they're going to make a Michael Jackson day. At least, let's hope not.

when they do, are we supposed to fly a pair of boy's pants at half mast?

[natty bumppo 297]

Well, the man did donate millions to charity and raised millions for African famine relief with the We Are The World song. I'm sure to people who benefited from any of that see him as a lot more than just an entertainer. I do think it's a tad silly that they had a moment of silence for him but oh well. At least we have Veteran's day for remembering the soldiers. It's not like they're going to make a Michael Jackson day. At least, let's hope not.

when they do, are we supposed to fly a pair of boy's pants at half mast?

just don't salute that .....

Edited July 14, 2009 by Natty Bumppo

[Mark&Steph 0]

Well, the man did donate millions to charity and raised millions for African famine relief with the We Are The World song. I'm sure to people who benefited from any of that see him as a lot more than just an entertainer. I do think it's a tad silly that they had a moment of silence for him but oh well. At least we have Veteran's day for remembering the soldiers. It's not like they're going to make a Michael Jackson day. At least, let's hope not.

when they do, are we supposed to fly a pair of boy's pants at half mast?

just don't salute that .....

So very wrong..