questions about love and commitment relative to K1 process

[eekee 182]

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

It's easy to condemn in hindsight. Certainly if Stalin could project even a couple years, he'd have gone a very different direction. With regards, to the Soviet/German treaty, the USSR had their own problems, and Stalin always knew that it was a short-term fix and that war with Germany was inevitable. Both sides used the pact to buy time. In fact, the only thing Stalin really got wrong was the timeline. He didn't believe Hitler would attack for another year. Had he been right, the war with Germany would have had a much different outcome.

In any case, we most certainly did not save the USSR's аss. The war between Germany and the USSR came at the expense of millions of Russian (and German) lives, and any help we provided came much too late to make a major difference. The Soviet winter helped the Soviets a lot more than we did.

If you want an argument about this, go to Russia and see what happens. But really, nothing makes me roll my eyes more than Americans going WE WON THE WAR FOR EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But then again I've never been patriotic about America, so I can't really relate to these feelings.

Yeah, I really don't understand the need to chest-beat. America's involvement in the European theater certainly turned the tide, there's no doubt about that. I'm proud of our involvment, and I think the world is a better place because of it. But let's also remember that America hesitated for a LONG LONG time before we finally decided it was in our own best interests to get involved.

I agree Ekee, I've never been "patriotic" in the chest-beating "USA USA USA" sense either, and nothing makes me roll my eyes more than seeing others do it. Plenty of brave Europeans and Russians died in the war, and (as Ekee points out) if you want to judge it by body count then nobody suffered more than the Russians. (sadly enough, fewer Russians would have probably died had Stalin not killed off most of his most experienced Generals and other leaders, but that's another discussion.) I think I've mentioned before that in several of the tiny Russian villages I've visited, there were walls dedicated to the fallen from that village. In both cases the number of names on the wall were much greater than the actual population of the village. This was a war that Russia is still recovering from, something the US can't really say.

I can't wait for the day that Americans get over this sense of entitlement and "bad assness" that we cling onto when dealing with the rest of the world. You'll never see me waving a foam "USA #1" finger, or putting a silly ribbon magnet on my car, but I'm a proud American, and I'm proud of many of our accomplishments. I'm also embarrassed at a lot of our conduct on the world stage, and I wish we'd start looking at ourselves more critically. We need to get over ourselves and start thinking of ourselves as world members instead of world leaders.

I'm not sure who is beating their chests about the USA on this thread...but nonetheless, we're all entitled to our "man on the street" narrow viewpoints, personal political bias, limited perspectives...and the need to be seen and heard by others. It's very easy to be armchair critics and a "know it all." That's what the internet is all about. Blogs...

As long as subject relevance is unimportant here, I will state that I am bored with the chest beating against the establishment that's been going on for about 45 odd years without much to show for it. Down with the man. Down with capitalism. Down with corporations. Down with the "pigs." Down with pollution. Down with big cars. Down with men.

Old and boring...

Being anti-USA is about as new as long hair and tattoos. Maybe it was chic and cool to bad mouth the country 40 years ago, but now it's just more bluster and hot air and the same old same old. Join the club.

I don't think that it's about being "anti-USA" at all. It's about using what I know, looking at situations and facts critically, and asking, "Is this what we should have done in this sitiuation?" Which was the top priority in the thought process behind a particular decision: humanity's best interests or America's? I think that thinking critically and being able to criticize America so that it can be a better country in the future is a far more patriotic act than simply accepting that America is always right and waving a flag around.

And currently I actually generally agree with the foreign policy of the US. Like having as little involvement with the Iranian events going on right now is absolutely the right thing to do in my opinion, since if we took a stronger stance or sent support I am sure that the ruling party would construe any action on the US's part into framing the revolutionary activity as American-based and influenced. But it's easy to see how a completely different approach could have been taken if someone else were in control. We might have been preparing troops for the ground at this point.

[visaveteran 1]

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

It's easy to condemn in hindsight. Certainly if Stalin could project even a couple years, he'd have gone a very different direction. With regards, to the Soviet/German treaty, the USSR had their own problems, and Stalin always knew that it was a short-term fix and that war with Germany was inevitable. Both sides used the pact to buy time. In fact, the only thing Stalin really got wrong was the timeline. He didn't believe Hitler would attack for another year. Had he been right, the war with Germany would have had a much different outcome.

In any case, we most certainly did not save the USSR's аss. The war between Germany and the USSR came at the expense of millions of Russian (and German) lives, and any help we provided came much too late to make a major difference. The Soviet winter helped the Soviets a lot more than we did.

If you want an argument about this, go to Russia and see what happens. But really, nothing makes me roll my eyes more than Americans going WE WON THE WAR FOR EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But then again I've never been patriotic about America, so I can't really relate to these feelings.

Yeah, I really don't understand the need to chest-beat. America's involvement in the European theater certainly turned the tide, there's no doubt about that. I'm proud of our involvment, and I think the world is a better place because of it. But let's also remember that America hesitated for a LONG LONG time before we finally decided it was in our own best interests to get involved.

I agree Ekee, I've never been "patriotic" in the chest-beating "USA USA USA" sense either, and nothing makes me roll my eyes more than seeing others do it. Plenty of brave Europeans and Russians died in the war, and (as Ekee points out) if you want to judge it by body count then nobody suffered more than the Russians. (sadly enough, fewer Russians would have probably died had Stalin not killed off most of his most experienced Generals and other leaders, but that's another discussion.) I think I've mentioned before that in several of the tiny Russian villages I've visited, there were walls dedicated to the fallen from that village. In both cases the number of names on the wall were much greater than the actual population of the village. This was a war that Russia is still recovering from, something the US can't really say.

I can't wait for the day that Americans get over this sense of entitlement and "bad assness" that we cling onto when dealing with the rest of the world. You'll never see me waving a foam "USA #1" finger, or putting a silly ribbon magnet on my car, but I'm a proud American, and I'm proud of many of our accomplishments. I'm also embarrassed at a lot of our conduct on the world stage, and I wish we'd start looking at ourselves more critically. We need to get over ourselves and start thinking of ourselves as world members instead of world leaders.

I'm not sure who is beating their chests about the USA on this thread...but nonetheless, we're all entitled to our "man on the street" narrow viewpoints, personal political bias, limited perspectives...and the need to be seen and heard by others. It's very easy to be armchair critics and a "know it all." That's what the internet is all about. Blogs...

As long as subject relevance is unimportant here, I will state that I am bored with the chest beating against the establishment that's been going on for about 45 odd years without much to show for it. Down with the man. Down with capitalism. Down with corporations. Down with the "pigs." Down with pollution. Down with big cars. Down with men.

Old and boring...

Being anti-USA is about as new as long hair and tattoos. Maybe it was chic and cool to bad mouth the country 40 years ago, but now it's just more bluster and hot air and the same old same old. Join the club.

I don't think that it's about being "anti-USA" at all. It's about using what I know, looking at situations and facts critically, and asking, "Is this what we should have done in this sitiuation?" Which was the top priority in the thought process behind a particular decision: humanity's best interests or America's? I think that thinking critically and being able to criticize America so that it can be a better country in the future is a far more patriotic act than simply accepting that America is always right and waving a flag around.

And currently I actually generally agree with the foreign policy of the US. Like having as little involvement with the Iranian events going on right now is absolutely the right thing to do in my opinion, since if we took a stronger stance or sent support I am sure that the ruling party would construe any action on the US's part into framing the revolutionary activity as American-based and influenced. But it's easy to see how a completely different approach could have been taken if someone else were in control. We might have been preparing troops for the ground at this point.

I think most countries have a bad history to face. It's never a pretty picture if you study history. The USA is no exception.

But if this is about about comparing countries...the USA has never had a crazed killer leader like Stalin who killed millions of his own people. As to WWII...the Russians murdered 22,000 Polish prisoners of war and now ban any discussion of that fact today. I don't think the USA killed prisoners of war...certainly not 22,000!

As to the numbers game around WWII...in truth, the USA lost more people relative to the general population than did Russia. And while Russia primarily fought in Europe, the US was fighting in full force in Asia and Europe...an amazing feat. Had we been able to use all our forces in Europe, things would have been far different. We would certainly have reached the end of Hitler's Germany much sooner...and perhaps before Russia entered Berlin...which Eisenhower allowed.

I'll also point out that Russia has treated its war veterans very poorly...and the few remaining WWII vets live difficult impoverished lives. US WWII vets got, and continue to get, very good benefits and care...both for themselves and their families.

Most importantly...we get to vote in our idiot leaders...Russia STILL does not. There is no comparison. No USA leader his ever ordered the slaughter of millions of his own people. With Russia, it's hard to find a leader who has NOT killed many of his own people.

I happen to love the Russian people...especially the women! I love their endurance, ability to deal with a harsh life, and their love of family. I know first hand that the Russian people are generous and good people who love life. The are accepting people. I have never felt any anti-American energy when I have been there.

But I have not forgotten the ugly 20th century Russian history that still, to this day, impacts the good Russian people in negative ways.

[eekee 182]

The Soviet Union lost 13% of their population. The US lost .32%. Where are you getting your numbers from? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

The USA did a LOT of bad things which are still affecting the world today. We didn't do things to our own people as much, sure--we just spread it to Latin America and Asia.

Edited June 28, 2009 by eekee

[visaveteran 1]

Being anti-USA is about as new as long hair and tattoos. Maybe it was chic and cool to bad mouth the country 40 years ago, but now it's just more bluster and hot air and the same old same old. Join the club.

Criticizing my (our) country is not anti-USA. If anything, it's pro-USA. It's wanting our country to be better than it is. We don't become better by telling the rest of the world how great we are and how many times we've saved their collective аsses, or by acting unilaterally or only in our own best interests. We become better by constantly challenging ourselves and our government to be better. We also become better by acknowledging that our way isn't always the best way, and that we can learn from other countries and other cultures.

If it were up to me, everybody in the US would have to live somewhere outside the US (and I'm not talking about Canada or a Mexican resort town) for 6 months. I know that's not realistic, but damn that sure would change the tone in this country. Might even be worth other countries to foot the bill for such a thing, as it could only benefit them in the long run.

I don't have a problem with critics...I have a problem with intolerance of people who openly show their love and affection for America and act proudly. I don't feel I have to hang my head because I'm American. We generously give to most other countries in some manner, allow millions of foreigners to immigrate here, and have shed much American blood to help other people like those in Bosnia and Kosovo.

I don't mind critics but some balance and speaking about what is good about the USA makes me trust that people are being critics for sincere reasons...and not agendas.

[visaveteran 1]

The Soviet Union lost 13% of their population. The US lost .32%. Where are you getting your numbers from? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

The USA did a LOT of bad things which are still affecting the world today. We didn't do things to our own people as much, sure--we just spread it to Latin America and Asia.

You're right. My WWII data was wrong. Excuse me. I misread the chart.

As to bad things...the magnitude is not comparable. Yes, we were in Asia and South America...and Russia was in Eastern Europe, Cuba, Asia, South America an Africa.

As i said, all countries have bad history.

[eekee 182]

Being anti-USA is about as new as long hair and tattoos. Maybe it was chic and cool to bad mouth the country 40 years ago, but now it's just more bluster and hot air and the same old same old. Join the club.

Criticizing my (our) country is not anti-USA. If anything, it's pro-USA. It's wanting our country to be better than it is. We don't become better by telling the rest of the world how great we are and how many times we've saved their collective аsses, or by acting unilaterally or only in our own best interests. We become better by constantly challenging ourselves and our government to be better. We also become better by acknowledging that our way isn't always the best way, and that we can learn from other countries and other cultures.

If it were up to me, everybody in the US would have to live somewhere outside the US (and I'm not talking about Canada or a Mexican resort town) for 6 months. I know that's not realistic, but damn that sure would change the tone in this country. Might even be worth other countries to foot the bill for such a thing, as it could only benefit them in the long run.

I don't have a problem with critics...I have a problem with intolerance of people who openly show their love and affection for America and act proudly. I don't feel I have to hang my head because I'm American. We generously give to most other countries in some manner, allow millions of foreigners to immigrate here, and have shed much American blood to help other people like those in Bosnia and Kosovo.

I don't mind critics but some balance and speaking about what is good about the USA makes me trust that people are being critics for sincere reasons...and not agendas.

Sometimes we help, sometimes we hinder because our intentions are dishonest and are more about our own national interests, rather than the best interests of those we're supposedly trying to help.

Hating America to be cool went out of style when Bush went back to Texas.

I think there are very few people who are ashamed to be American, and when I come across said people I don't think they're any better than those who blindly proclaim America to be the best and refuse to listen to any opinions to the contrary, or any criticism of America. I have never, for instance, pretended to be Canadian. But blind acceptance and a USA #1 no matter what!!! attitude aren't good either. There is no democracy without dissent.

[visaveteran 1]

Being anti-USA is about as new as long hair and tattoos. Maybe it was chic and cool to bad mouth the country 40 years ago, but now it's just more bluster and hot air and the same old same old. Join the club.

Criticizing my (our) country is not anti-USA. If anything, it's pro-USA. It's wanting our country to be better than it is. We don't become better by telling the rest of the world how great we are and how many times we've saved their collective аsses, or by acting unilaterally or only in our own best interests. We become better by constantly challenging ourselves and our government to be better. We also become better by acknowledging that our way isn't always the best way, and that we can learn from other countries and other cultures.

If it were up to me, everybody in the US would have to live somewhere outside the US (and I'm not talking about Canada or a Mexican resort town) for 6 months. I know that's not realistic, but damn that sure would change the tone in this country. Might even be worth other countries to foot the bill for such a thing, as it could only benefit them in the long run.

I don't have a problem with critics...I have a problem with intolerance of people who openly show their love and affection for America and act proudly. I don't feel I have to hang my head because I'm American. We generously give to most other countries in some manner, allow millions of foreigners to immigrate here, and have shed much American blood to help other people like those in Bosnia and Kosovo.

I don't mind critics but some balance and speaking about what is good about the USA makes me trust that people are being critics for sincere reasons...and not agendas.

Sometimes we help, sometimes we hinder because our intentions are dishonest and are more about our own national interests, rather than the best interests of those we're supposedly trying to help.

Hating America to be cool went out of style when Bush went back to Texas.

I think there are very few people who are ashamed to be American, and when I come across said people I don't think they're any better than those who blindly proclaim America to be the best and refuse to listen to any opinions to the contrary, or any criticism of America. I have never, for instance, pretended to be Canadian. But blind acceptance and a USA #1 no matter what!!! attitude aren't good either. There is no democracy without dissent.

Yes, America allows open dissent so we have democracy. We have a free press and people are allowed to march and show public criticism. Russia and Iran and China do not. They kill dissenters. The suppress dissent harshly.

[visaveteran 1]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

[clueless_in_usa 8]

Yes, America allows open dissent so we have democracy. We have a free press and people are allowed to march and show public criticism. Russia and Iran and China do not. They kill dissenters. The suppress dissent harshly.

Hugo Chavez and his friends do the same in Venezuela, and nobody around the world cries foul. Mugabe is the same in Zimbabwe. Many Americans do not understand how privileged they are.

[mox 298]

Yes, America allows open dissent so we have democracy. We have a free press and people are allowed to march and show public criticism. Russia and Iran and China do not. They kill dissenters. The suppress dissent harshly.

I think you'd have to agree though that dissent and public criticism in Russia is a lot more tolerated than it was before the breakup. Democracy doesn't often happen quickly, and when it does (Iraq, Afghanistan, Russia), it's often an absolute mess. The important thing is engagement.

And not to keep beating the dead horse that crops up now and again, but as long as the PATRIOT Act is in effect, our democracy is more of a sham that Iran's. When the President of a country can disappear you indefinitely, without charge or access to an attorney, it's not a Democracy, it's the world's most well-armed banana repulic.

[Neonred 3,609]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

But I figure most of those "depleted" males from WWII would have been dead now anyway if they hadn't died in the war.

[visaveteran 1]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

But I figure most of those "depleted" males from WWII would have been dead now anyway if they hadn't died in the war.

It's pretty simple math. No grandfathers...no fathers. No fathers...no sons. No sons...no husbands.

Russia has been killing off its finest men since the revolution, when the poor, illiterate Bolshevik peasants killed off most of the intelligentsia and artists. Then Lenin had his turn killing people. Then Stalin really took killing to new heights. Then Hitler took his shot at eliminating more Russians...mostly men. In recent history, the Mujahideen had their turn and killed many Russian men in the 1980s.

So, there are now around 10 women to every man in Russia. It's about math.

[Neonred 3,609]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

But I figure most of those "depleted" males from WWII would have been dead now anyway if they hadn't died in the war.

It's pretty simple math. No grandfathers...no fathers. No fathers...no sons. No sons...no husbands.

Russia has been killing off its finest men since the revolution, when the poor, illiterate Bolshevik peasants killed off most of the intelligentsia and artists. Then Lenin had his turn killing people. Then Stalin really took killing to new heights. Then Hitler took his shot at eliminating more Russians...mostly men. In recent history, the Mujahideen had their turn and killed many Russian men in the 1980s.

So, there are now around 10 women to every man in Russia. It's about math.

#######? Where do you get this stuff? You must be REALLY bad at math! Current demographics for Russia are not that much different than for the US, especially the 15-64 age group. BOTH countries have slightly more women than men, but nothing like what you are thinking. You need to do a little research.

Oh, and remember, no fathers...no daughters!

[visaveteran 1]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

But I figure most of those "depleted" males from WWII would have been dead now anyway if they hadn't died in the war.

It's pretty simple math. No grandfathers...no fathers. No fathers...no sons. No sons...no husbands.

Russia has been killing off its finest men since the revolution, when the poor, illiterate Bolshevik peasants killed off most of the intelligentsia and artists. Then Lenin had his turn killing people. Then Stalin really took killing to new heights. Then Hitler took his shot at eliminating more Russians...mostly men. In recent history, the Mujahideen had their turn and killed many Russian men in the 1980s.

So, there are now around 10 women to every man in Russia. It's about math.

#######? Where do you get this stuff? You must be REALLY bad at math! Current demographics for Russia are not that much different than for the US, especially the 15-64 age group. BOTH countries have slightly more women than men, but nothing like what you are thinking. You need to do a little research.

Oh, and remember, no fathers...no daughters!

I quote:

"Russia has one of the lowest men to women ratio in the world: according to the latest Russian census, there are 10 million more women than men. At the same time Russian culture requires from a woman to be married, in order to acquire a respectable social status. Because of the demographics and the cultural notion, Russian women are driven to seek partners elsewhere, if they have failed to find them in a 'normal' way."

[visaveteran 1]

[Curious as to where the 40% figure comes from.

It was the inverse of the 60% number I mentioned at the start of my post. Again it has been a long time since I read whatever I read and that number could be off a bit. What I was suggesting is that if 60 % of the K-1's get married then 40 % must either go back or get lost illigally. If people took more time to be sure of what they wanted that number could be reduced which would help to speed the system for everyone else.

Guns, we have already talked about that so much. Anyone have a good recepie for Russian Black Bread? How about WW2. Anyone notice Russians don't even know we were involved?

It's understandable to me why Russians don't really care about America's World War II participation, considering the immense casualties and suffering the Soviets endured during the Great Patriotic War.

Total of American deaths: 418,500. Total of Soviet Union deaths: 23,100,000

Ironically, it is because of WWII and perhaps the long Afghanistan war, that so reduced the number of Russian men available for marriage, that created the huge number of Russian women in need of men. We USA men are the lucky recipients of this sad situation.

The Soviet Union had a pact with Hitler before fighting them...so let's remember that. And they did not come in the war willingly...they were attacked and forced to fight. I think they remember us...we saved their #### by the "lend lease" program that gave them many trucks and weapons to fight back. We (the USA) never got a penny for all the material we gave them.

I don't know, but I never saw myself as competing with Afghan and WWII war vets for their women.

No, you're competing with the severely depleted Russian male population.

But I figure most of those "depleted" males from WWII would have been dead now anyway if they hadn't died in the war.

It's pretty simple math. No grandfathers...no fathers. No fathers...no sons. No sons...no husbands.

Russia has been killing off its finest men since the revolution, when the poor, illiterate Bolshevik peasants killed off most of the intelligentsia and artists. Then Lenin had his turn killing people. Then Stalin really took killing to new heights. Then Hitler took his shot at eliminating more Russians...mostly men. In recent history, the Mujahideen had their turn and killed many Russian men in the 1980s.

So, there are now around 10 women to every man in Russia. It's about math.

#######? Where do you get this stuff? You must be REALLY bad at math! Current demographics for Russia are not that much different than for the US, especially the 15-64 age group. BOTH countries have slightly more women than men, but nothing like what you are thinking. You need to do a little research.

Oh, and remember, no fathers...no daughters!

I quote:

"Russia has one of the lowest men to women ratio in the world: according to the latest Russian census, there are 10 million more women than men. At the same time Russian culture requires from a woman to be married, in order to acquire a respectable social status. Because of the demographics and the cultural notion, Russian women are driven to seek partners elsewhere, if they have failed to find them in a 'normal' way."

Yes, no fathers, no daughters...right. That's why so many single Russian women partner up with married Russian men to have children. It's typical for Russian men to have lovers and shire children with them. One Russian man can father children from 3 or 4 women during his life time.