California faces its day of fiscal reckoning

[Heracles 417]

Has anyone ever thought about the billions in revenue lost due to from illegal aliens? Illegal aliens who not only take capital and send it overseas but also utilize a hell of a lot of state / county resources, while pay little for it.

The state has over 35 million people.

The state has some mega rich people

The state has Hollywood

The state has high tax rates

The state the heart of the multi-billion dollar IT industry

Yet the state is bankrupt. How is that even possible?

The government can always spend more money that it collects in revenue, no matter how high the tax rates are.

That is the root of the problem.

You and I can definitely vouch for that. Especially the UK. The problem is see, which ties in to the spending you mention, is the financial cost of illegal aliens.

Considering CA has the most illegal aliens, somebody has to pay in terms of:

• Reduced tax revenue (paid under the table). Very little paid to counties.
• Higher use of public funded services (as they are poor) They use a hospital, they don't pay etc etc
• Money they do earn is not pumped back into economy (as it is still shipped overseas)
• High incarceration rate. Prisoners costs hundreds of thousand of dollars each to maintain.

The question is how many billions is the state alone losing and spending on these guys. I remember seeing that every billion spent in a economy generates close to 10,000 jobs. Therefore every billion send abroad probably reduces that. People can't have their cake and eat it. either they are going to support illegal aliens and suffer the financial consequences. Or they are going to follow most other 1st world countries and say sorry but I cannot help you at this moment and you must leave.

Edited May 24, 2009 by Constellation

[mawilson 2,133]

The governor's cutbacks could include ending the state's main welfare program for the poor, eliminating health coverage for about 1.5 million poor children, halting cash grants for about 77,000 college students, shortening the school year by seven days, laying off thousands of state workers and teachers, slashing money for state parks and releasing thousands of prisoners before their sentences are finished.

Good start.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

The 2/3 majority requirement means that the responsibility for raising taxes falls primarily on the voters in the state, rather than the legislature. California already has the highest income and sales taxes in the nation (sales taxes just raised another 1%), and we still can't pay for the exorbitant public programs that the voters have approved, many of which require MANDATORY spending; i.e., the legislature is powerless to cut spending on them.

We, the voters of California, are responsible for the mess we find ourselves in. Most voters in the state aren't educated enough to make these decisions. I saw a recent poll where a slight majority of those asked didn't know that bonds actually had to be REPAID WITH INTEREST! Many routinely voted for bonds to pay for new programs because "Hey, it's not a new tax, right?". They didn't realize that a bond is a new CREDIT DEBT! If everyone actually read and understood the voter information pamphlet that's mailed out before each election, we wouldn't be in this situation now.

We, the voters, dug this hole for ourselves. I hope the defeat of the ballot measures is a sign that we're finally starting to own up to what we've done to this state, and are willing to finally endure the pain that will be necessary to put things straight again.

Eliminate mandatory spending programs. Give the legislature the authority to CUT spending on ANY program, but keep the authority to INCREASE taxes in the hands of the voters. Require a disclaimer in all advertisements for ballot measures that clearly identifies the fiscal impact of the measure. If it's going to increase taxes, then say so. If it's going to increase debt, then say so.

[Heracles 417]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

While I do agree, you guys are dumb enough as it is, that surely cannot help duuuuuudeeeee.

[mawilson 2,133]

The question is how many billions is the state alone losing and spending on these guys. I remember seeing that every billion spent in a economy generates close to 10,000 jobs. Therefore every billion send abroad probably reduces that. People can't have their cake and eat it. either they are going to support illegal aliens and suffer the financial consequences. Or they are going to follow most other 1st world countries and say sorry but I cannot help you at this moment and you must leave.

I agree with you; however, this problem cannot be fixed in a month or two and California needs to balance its budget NOW.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

You can't be fiscally responsible if you don't want to pay for the things Californians want.

[Heracles 417]

The question is how many billions is the state alone losing and spending on these guys. I remember seeing that every billion spent in a economy generates close to 10,000 jobs. Therefore every billion send abroad probably reduces that. People can't have their cake and eat it. either they are going to support illegal aliens and suffer the financial consequences. Or they are going to follow most other 1st world countries and say sorry but I cannot help you at this moment and you must leave.

I agree with you; however, this problem cannot be fixed in a month or two and California needs to balance its budget NOW.

Cuts is the only way to do it.

As well as mandatory residency checks for anyone utilizing tax payer funded services. Now's not the time for any liberal agenda to be giving money away to people who are not even residents, let alone citizens, of the country.

Edited May 24, 2009 by Constellation

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

You can't be fiscally responsible if you don't want to pay for the things Californians want.

But, I don't want everything I am paying for.

[Peikko 1,575]

The 2/3 majority requirement means that the responsibility for raising taxes falls primarily on the voters in the state, rather than the legislature. California already has the highest income and sales taxes in the nation (sales taxes just raised another 1%), and we still can't pay for the exorbitant public programs that the voters have approved, many of which require MANDATORY spending; i.e., the legislature is powerless to cut spending on them.

We, the voters of California, are responsible for the mess we find ourselves in. Most voters in the state aren't educated enough to make these decisions. I saw a recent poll where a slight majority of those asked didn't know that bonds actually had to be REPAID WITH INTEREST! Many routinely voted for bonds to pay for new programs because "Hey, it's not a new tax, right?". They didn't realize that a bond is a new CREDIT DEBT! If everyone actually read and understood the voter information pamphlet that's mailed out before each election, we wouldn't be in this situation now.

We, the voters, dug this hole for ourselves. I hope the defeat of the ballot measures is a sign that we're finally starting to own up to what we've done to this state, and are willing to finally endure the pain that will be necessary to put things straight again.

Eliminate mandatory spending programs. Give the legislature the authority to CUT spending on ANY program, but keep the authority to INCREASE taxes in the hands of the voters. Require a disclaimer in all advertisements for ballot measures that clearly identifies the fiscal impact of the measure. If it's going to increase taxes, then say so. If it's going to increase debt, then say so.

I always thought the idea was to elect politicians on the basis that they put forward a series of proposals to achieve various ends. Once elected these proposals are translated into measures that are debated amongst the entire legislative house and voted on. In this way, ridiculous proposals that can't be properly funded would/should be weeded out and amended to proposals that can, or an alternate proposal voted in. I guess letting the people vote on each and every proposal is deemed democratic. What a stupid way to run anything, let alone the worlds 8th (or whatever it is) largest economy

Edited May 24, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[Peikko 1,575]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

You can't be fiscally responsible if you don't want to pay for the things Californians want.

But, I don't want everything I am paying for.

A state can't be run tailor made to pay for each individual's wants and needs. You are meant to win some and lose some, dependant on which politician is elected and on what platform. No system works perfectly, but to imagine everyone is going to be happy all the time is silly.

Edited May 24, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

You can't be fiscally responsible if you don't want to pay for the things Californians want.

But, I don't want everything I am paying for.

Such is life....and being responsible.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I understand the Republicans want to believe they are acting fiscally conservative, but they are acting fiscally irresponsible. The deficit has to be paid and the ugly truth means taxes.

To me it means reduced spending, not higher taxes.

They can start by releasing prisoners that shouldn't be in prison (e.g. marijuana smokers).

The majority of Californias do want to legalize marijuana. I think that would be the best thing the state could do. Legalize it and tax it.

Damn Democrats want to tax everything!

You can't be fiscally responsible if you don't want to pay for the things Californians want.

But, I don't want everything I am paying for.

A state can't be run tailor made to pay for each individual's wants and needs. You are meant to win some and lose some, dependant on which politician is elected and on what platform. No system works perfectly, but to imagine everyone is going to be happy all the time is silly.

I agree, and that is why California is in the mess that it is. Check out the back of the 540, and with all those checkoffs, you can see exactly how loony our legislature really is. Federal, state, county, and local, should only provide those services that they are best able to manage at that level. Private industry, including charities, should be left to do what they are best able to do.

[Peikko 1,575]

Maybe so - but the point is, there is a mess currently and if you simply say, no tax increases just cut spending, the whole state infrastructure will collapse. The poor will be left to fend for themselves (leaving charities to take care of the poor, just look at India to see how well that works), the schools will be cut and cut and cut until they can't function, in fact, every single state run entity could be closed today and there would still be a need to find more funds and the state would be a mess. Is that what you envisage?

[Peikko 1,575]

I live here too and pay state taxes and believe me, I don't want to have to pay for years of overspending and abuse as well as the state run entities that are essential if you wish to live in a society as apposed to living like Wild West Pioneers. I am however prepared to do that without whinging about it IF the politicians are prepared to put forward plans that will allow for the responsible programs to be continued and improved so that we can all live in a functioning society.