U.S. strikes killed 140 villagers: Afghan probe

[Niels Bohr 72]

Sat May 16, 2009 8:49am EDT By Hamid Shalizi and Peter Graff

KABUL (Reuters) - U.S. air strikes earlier this month killed 140 villagers, an Afghan government investigation concluded on Saturday, putting Kabul starkly at odds with the U.S. military's account.

The official death toll, announced by the Afghan Defense Ministry, makes the bombing the deadliest incident for civilians since U.S. forces began fighting the Taliban in 2001, and is likely to worsen anger over the presence of foreign troops.

A copy of the government's list of the names, ages and father's names of each of the 140 dead was obtained by Reuters earlier this week. It shows that 93 of those killed were children -- the youngest eight days old -- and only 22 were adult males.

"No other news makes me as sad and sorrowful as incidents of civilian casualties during military operations," the Defense Ministry statement quoted President Hamid Karzai as saying.

The Afghan government paid the relatives of victims the equivalent of about $2,000 for those who were killed and $1,000 for 25 others wounded, it said.

U.S. aircraft bombed villages in the Bala Boluk district of Afghanistan's western Farah province on May 3 after U.S. Marines and Afghan security forces became involved in a firefight with Taliban militants. According to villagers, families were cowering in houses when the U.S. aircraft bombed them.

The incident has prompted anger across Afghanistan toward Western troops, and caused Karzai to demand a halt to all air strikes, a plea that Washington has rebuffed.

TWO INVESTIGATIONS

The U.S. military says it believes the death toll was lower than the official Afghan figure, but says it cannot provide a figure of its own because the dead were quickly buried.

It says the Taliban were to blame for deliberately putting villagers in harm's way to create outrage over civilian deaths, and some names in the government's list of victims may be fake. According to the military's version of events, many of the dead may have been fighters, and some civilians may have been killed by militants throwing grenades, rather than by air strikes.

Asked if the dispute over the death toll would cause further difficulties between the troops and their Afghan hosts, U.S. military spokesman Colonel Greg Julian said: "It's something we will discuss."

Julian said two U.S. military investigations were now under way, one ordered by commanders in Afghanistan immediately after the incident and another ordered more recently by U.S. Central Command, responsible for the wars in both Afghanistan and Iraq.

A U.S. general had been sent from outside Afghanistan to head up the second investigation, Julian said. He was not able to say how long either investigation would take to issue findings.

Under new procedures instituted late last year to reduce the anger caused by civilian deaths, the military tries to coordinate its investigations into such incidents with Afghan authorities.

In several smaller cases in recent months the sides have quickly agreed in public about what happened, and U.S. troops have admitted making mistakes and apologized.

But there were immediate signs in the Farah case that Afghan and U.S. officials were not going to agree. A joint U.S.-Afghan statement issued five days after the bombing said only that some civilians were killed, but not how many.

(Writing by Peter Graff, editing by Mark Trevelyan)

[Peikko 1,575]

True. War, especially against insurgents is not an exact science, and any death will be used for propaganda purposes. Sometimes you have to wonder what goes on in the heads of whoever makes the decisions though. Ultimately the region needs to be rebuilt not destroyed unless instability and endless fighting is the goal.

[peejay 327]

Their blood is on Obama's hands.

[Ban Hammer 13,346]

Their blood is on Obama's hands.

threadkiller!

[peejay 327]

Their blood is on Obama's hands.

threadkiller!

I noticed that too.

So where are all the self righteous now that they don't have Bush to slam or hurl accuasations at? Not that I'm a registered Republican, a Bush fan, or a big cheerleader of either wars in Iraq or Afghanistan, but even I can see the double standard going on here.

[Danno 1,228]

Where is Code-Pink and Cindy Sheehan?

Has John Cougar Melloncamp gone back to singing real songs?

These people were like regulars on the news every time someone got their flowers stepped on over there.

Heck Cindy Sheehan had a Reality TV gig going on down in Crawford TX like for weeks wanting to meet with Bush and every time they got the chance the Media asked Bush if he would meet with her.

Now that Barry is in the Whitehouse, it's like all the anti-war Rockstars and news whores can't get.. or don't want airtime.

(shrugs)

[scandal 951]

Where is Code-Pink and Cindy Sheehan?

Has John Cougar Melloncamp gone back to singing real songs?

These people were like regulars on the news every time someone got their flowers stepped on over there.

Heck Cindy Sheehan had a Reality TV gig going on down in Crawford TX like for weeks wanting to meet with Bush and every time they got the chance the Media asked Bush if he would meet with her.

Now that Barry is in the Whitehouse, it's like all the anti-war Rockstars and news whores can't get.. or don't want airtime.

(shrugs)

Check a map.

Iraq. Afghanistan. Two wars. Two situations.

They were protesting the war in Iraq. The posted article refers to the war in Afghanistan.

It's perfectly ok to kill civilians provided they are in the politically-correct combatant country.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

they did it to Cambodia killing many

Finish that thought. I am curious.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Their blood is on Obama's hands.

threadkiller!

I noticed that too.

So where are all the self righteous now that they don't have Bush to slam or hurl accuasations at? Not that I'm a registered Republican, a Bush fan, or a big cheerleader of either wars in Iraq or Afghanistan, but even I can see the double standard going on here.

The silence is deafening.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

they did it to Cambodia killing many

Finish that thought. I am curious.

He's talking about the carpet bombing under Nixon during the Vietnam war. Killed a few hundred thousand and led more or less directly to the Khmer Rouge taking control of the country (and the infamous genocides).

As to "double standards" - what garbage.

1) Bush started the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama I believe actually said that he would have gone to war with Afghanistan were he in office at the time. So likely things would not have been that different.

2) Outside of the US (and certainly in Europe) the US military's "collateral" damage has been a perennial subject for criticism of successive administrations. It has nothing to do with being a "blind" Obama supporter.

Criticism of the US in this regard goes back to WW2 - regardless of who is in the office of President.

3) Do I support this? Not at all.

[Niels Bohr 72]

Not many people are aware of the secret bombing in Cambodia. You need to dig through for that information. Heck, the Cambodian people weren't even aware that the US were going to bomb Cambodia (neutral country). That is because the prime minister of Cambodia LON NOL kept it secret.

Lon Nol backed by the US staged a coup-d-etat against the KING, exiling the KING. And, he let the US bombed Cambodia. LON NOL used to gain more power for himself.

Guess what? The US demands that the current Cambodian Gov't pays for the US services during the Vietnam War. However, the Cambodian Gov't refuses because it was under LON NOL greedy gov't which was backed by the US.

When it comes to WAR, the US will not care who dies. But, the survivors will start their own hate groups and begin a new regime to revenge the US. I'm not surprise if there will be even more terrorists from the middle-east towards the US.

[mawilson 2,133]

KABUL (Reuters) - U.S. air strikes earlier this month killed 140 villagers, an Afghan government investigation concluded on Saturday, putting Kabul starkly at odds with the U.S. military's account.

The Russians killed over a million villagers. Five million fled to Pakistan and Iran, another two million were displaced within the country.

Somehow, 140 doesn't sound like a big deal.

[peejay 327]

Not many people are aware of the secret bombing in Cambodia.

Maybe not many here on VJ because most are too young to remember.

There was not only bombing in Cambodia, but in Laos as well. The Vietnamese communists used both countries as safe havens and to transport arms, troops, and supplies through them into South Vietnam. The US military not only bombed Cambodia, but led a brief incursion of ground troops into Cambodia in pursuit of Vietnamese communist insurgents.

I'm old enough to remember, but was too young for the draft. Luckily I got to skip that mess. Some guys I knew just a little older than me got drafted.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Not many people are aware of the secret bombing in Cambodia. You need to dig through for that information. Heck, the Cambodian people weren't even aware that the US were going to bomb Cambodia (neutral country). That is because the prime minister of Cambodia LON NOL kept it secret.

Lon Nol backed by the US staged a coup-d-etat against the KING, exiling the KING. And, he let the US bombed Cambodia. LON NOL used to gain more power for himself.

Guess what? The US demands that the current Cambodian Gov't pays for the US services during the Vietnam War. However, the Cambodian Gov't refuses because it was under LON NOL greedy gov't which was backed by the US.

When it comes to WAR, the US will not care who dies. But, the survivors will start their own hate groups and begin a new regime to revenge the US. I'm not surprise if there will be even more terrorists from the middle-east towards the US.

There is a lot more to the story. King Norodom Sihanouk was flirting with the Communists long before the US became involved in Indochina. The battle for power between two princes had more to do with the end result than anything the US did. The rise of the Khmer Rouge was inevitable.

http://www.edwebproject.org/sideshow/history/index.html

[Niels Bohr 72]

Nope. He wasn't flirting. He was negotiating with China and the Soviet not to have war in Cambodia. LON NOL twisted his travels to China and the Soviet by claiming he is an ally with the communists.

The US wanted to take control of the HO CHI MINH trail that extends into Cambodia so they can have the upper hand on the battle. So, they supported LON NOL.

Edited May 17, 2009 by Niels Bohr