Olbermann and Hannity are both fvcking nuts

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

No, that's not my point. What I'm wondering is why people are labouring under the assumption that the fear of being "tortured" somehow prevents terrorism.

What? I've never heard that torture was a deterrent for terrorists. I certainly never made that point.

Nobody knows of other wars where POW treatment were a big issue?

I know it's not in your talking points folks but you'd think someone, anyone would find a historical parallel especially if this is such an all-consuming issue. If it happened before 2001 it just isn't relevant.

BY seems to be making that argument, I believe.

BTW there are no historical parallels to this. The so-called "global war on terror" was very much a first: A nebulous, ill-defined series of unilateral military adventures with no clear military (or other) goal - worthy of something from a George Orwell novel.

Traditional wars between nations have specific goals and a means to achieving them. A nebulous war on ideology suggests war without end.

Edited April 24, 2009 by Private Pike

[Peikko 1,575]

This is almost as spurious as that stupid article that the reason someone 'raped' a woman was in order to get goaled in a UK glory hole. Honestly, do people really believe anything so stupid?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

This is almost as spurious as that stupid article that the reason someone 'raped' a woman was in order to get goaled in a UK glory hole. Honestly, do people really believe anything so stupid?

Shut up you anti American poopyhead moron

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Again - that wasn't my point.

Fear of torture is not much of a deterrent factor, I agree; at the same time, announcing to the world

that "America does not torture" only emboldens the enemy.

How?

Because now they know if they get caught they get to go to a cushy American prison with color TV, a gym, balanced nutritious meals and climate control. At least adding the possibility of having their balls ripped out by the jaws of a pitbull balanced that smoewhat. As it stands now, without torture, an American prison is the next best thing to jannat and it's 72 virgins.

Well the way you word it, having a career in terrorism sure sounds tempting.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Again - that wasn't my point.

Fear of torture is not much of a deterrent factor, I agree; at the same time, announcing to the world

that "America does not torture" only emboldens the enemy.

I honestly doubt it. If you're taking up arms against foreign "invaders" you have to have already rationalised in some way or other - the very real likelihood of death.

[mawilson 2,133]

Assuming these terrorists have ideological beliefs, there is every reason to believe they would hold onto any and all information that they possess and accept the torture as a method of martyrdom to the cause.

There are ways to make them talk.... if Jack Bauer is to be believed, the bad guys always break.

Staging the mock execution of the terrorist's children to make him talk is one of my favorites.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I suspect 24 is a pretty shitty guide to real life.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Again - that wasn't my point.

Fear of torture is not much of a deterrent factor, I agree; at the same time, announcing to the world

that "America does not torture" only emboldens the enemy.

How?

Because now they know if they get caught they get to go to a cushy American prison with color TV, a gym, balanced nutritious meals and climate control. At least adding the possibility of having their balls ripped out by the jaws of a pitbull balanced that smoewhat. As it stands now, without torture, an American prison is the next best thing to jannat and it's 72 virgins.

Well the way you word it, having a career in terrorism sure sounds tempting.

I always knew you had it in you. That Hare Krishna stuff never fooled me!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Again - that wasn't my point.

Fear of torture is not much of a deterrent factor, I agree; at the same time, announcing to the world

that "America does not torture" only emboldens the enemy.

How?

Because now they know if they get caught they get to go to a cushy American prison with color TV, a gym, balanced nutritious meals and climate control. At least adding the possibility of having their balls ripped out by the jaws of a pitbull balanced that smoewhat. As it stands now, without torture, an American prison is the next best thing to jannat and it's 72 virgins.

Well the way you word it, having a career in terrorism sure sounds tempting.

I always knew you had it in you. That Hare Krishna stuff never fooled me!

What about health insurance and a pension plan?

[mawilson 2,133]

Traditional wars between nations have specific goals and a means to achieving them. A nebulous war on ideology suggests war without end.

Asymmetric warfare cannot be won by conventional means... or at least it's never been done before.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Traditional wars between nations have specific goals and a means to achieving them. A nebulous war on ideology suggests war without end.

Asymmetric warfare cannot be won by conventional means... or at least it's never been done before.

Asymmetric warfare was traditionally small-scale.

[mawilson 2,133]

What about health insurance and a pension plan?

Health insurance - yes. Pension plan - no.

[alienlovechild 75]

BTW there are no historical parallels to this. The so-called "global war on terror" was very much a first: A nebulous, ill-defined series of unilateral military adventures with no clear military (or other) goal - worthy of something from a George Orwell novel.

Exact parallels . . .hmmm. . .but could go back to the Boer War for concentration camps and treatment of irregulars. The treatment of POWs was a big deal in the Korean War and one the reasons the war continued over the returning of Chinese and N. Koreans who didn't want to go back home.

Traditional wars between nations have specific goals and a means to achieving them. A nebulous war on ideology suggests war without end.

So Vietnam is now considered a textbook example of warfare now but I'm assuming you don't want to label that one as traditional? War on ideology without end? We heard that during the Cold War but it did indeed end just as radical Islam has waxed and waned. The radical Muslims are rolling in their own dung in some of the poorest nations on earth but violent people can't be easily ignored when they get their hands on oil and weapons.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

What about health insurance and a pension plan?

Health insurance - yes. Pension plan - no.

So we could torture you into becoming religious?

[mawilson 2,133]

What about health insurance and a pension plan?

Health insurance - yes. Pension plan - no.

So we could torture you into becoming religious?

Religion would be torture enough for me.