U.N. 'Climate Change' Plan Would Likely Shift Trillions to Form New World Economy

[dalegg 143]

I've got a question.

So California estimated sales tax revenue from gasoline purchases at $2.67 billion in fiscal 2008-09, while the state excise tax was projected at $2.9 billion. $5.66 billion in revenues total- just for the state. Then you've got tax on home and business energy consumption i.e. your electric bill.

Now lets say that everyone in California goes green. Cuts their electric bills in half. Get hybrid cars and use half the gasoline. Now we have half the revenue from these sources we had before.

Honestly, I'm not sure what in the budget gets to be reduced simply because we are driving more ecologically friendly cars, so to me this is going to mean even bigger hits to the budget than we have now. So the State's revenue has to be made up because we went green. How do we make that up? Higher taxes at the pump? And heaven forbid people stop smoking and drinking!

But Dale, haven't taxes always been this way? When Bush signed into a law, a tax credit for small business owners who purchased large SUV's, did that not have an effect on market trends? Using taxes or tax credits to encourage energy saving alternatives is a sound approach that has proven to work. As far as making up for lost revenue, I imagine there is cost savings side to it as well...just as there is when you have less people smoking.

I'm talking about the opposite though. Raising taxes to offset energy savings. With smoking I can see a correlation- Taxes on cigarettes going toward healthcare costs, so if people smoked less we would need less healthcare and thus expenses would drop. With the energy taxes I'm lost. I actually can not imagine where the cost savings for the state is at.

I'm not entirely sure either, but on the flip side of it though - using tax incentives to modify consumer behavior - I believe it is a sound approach. If tax revenue is not replaced another way and there are no cost savings, then California will have to figure out another way. I know I keep beating this drum, but until we change the 2/3 requirement to raise taxes, CA is going to continuously run into budget deficits.

I will hunt you down if that ever happens! I think the simple answer is that they will just raise the existing taxes. There wouldn't be a hardship. My electric bill is half of what it was a year ago because of changes in my personal habits. You could double my taxes and my bill would be i think $6 higher a month- putting the total taxes back to what they were before, but my overall bill is still $30 a month lower than it was.

The same is going to be for gasoline, but raising taxes like that on gasoline is going to keep the costs per gallon close to what they are now. Its not necassarily going to cause hardship but its going to really tick people off when they are forced to buy fuel efficient cars and they aren't saving any money at the pump because of higher taxes.

Edited March 29, 2009 by dalegg

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I've got a question.

So California estimated sales tax revenue from gasoline purchases at $2.67 billion in fiscal 2008-09, while the state excise tax was projected at $2.9 billion. $5.66 billion in revenues total- just for the state. Then you've got tax on home and business energy consumption i.e. your electric bill.

Now lets say that everyone in California goes green. Cuts their electric bills in half. Get hybrid cars and use half the gasoline. Now we have half the revenue from these sources we had before.

Honestly, I'm not sure what in the budget gets to be reduced simply because we are driving more ecologically friendly cars, so to me this is going to mean even bigger hits to the budget than we have now. So the State's revenue has to be made up because we went green. How do we make that up? Higher taxes at the pump? And heaven forbid people stop smoking and drinking!

But Dale, haven't taxes always been this way? When Bush signed into a law, a tax credit for small business owners who purchased large SUV's, did that not have an effect on market trends? Using taxes or tax credits to encourage energy saving alternatives is a sound approach that has proven to work. As far as making up for lost revenue, I imagine there is cost savings side to it as well...just as there is when you have less people smoking.

I'm talking about the opposite though. Raising taxes to offset energy savings. With smoking I can see a correlation- Taxes on cigarettes going toward healthcare costs, so if people smoked less we would need less healthcare and thus expenses would drop. With the energy taxes I'm lost. I actually can not imagine where the cost savings for the state is at.

I'm not entirely sure either, but on the flip side of it though - using tax incentives to modify consumer behavior - I believe it is a sound approach. If tax revenue is not replaced another way and there are no cost savings, then California will have to figure out another way. I know I keep beating this drum, but until we change the 2/3 requirement to raise taxes, CA is going to continuously run into budget deficits.

I will hunt you down if that ever happens! I think the simple answer is that they will just raise the existing taxes. There wouldn't be a hardship. My electric bill is half of what it was a year ago because of changes in my personal habits. You could double my taxes and my bill would be i think $6 higher a month- putting the total taxes back to what they were before, but my overall bill is still $30 a month lower than it was.

The same is going to be for gasoline, but raising taxes like that on gasoline is going to keep the costs per gallon close to what they are now. Its not necassarily going to cause hardship but its going to really tick people off when they are forced to buy fuel efficient cars and they aren't saving any money at the pump because of higher taxes.

We'll see on Wednesday, when salestax goes up one percent or more, depending where you live in California. April Fool's Day, the tax will be 9.25% in Santa Rosa.

[dalegg 143]

We'll see on Wednesday, when salestax goes up one percent or more, depending where you live in California. April Fool's Day, the tax will be 9.25% in Santa Rosa.

At least I know one place I am not visiting soon.

[mawilson 2,133]

Now lets say that everyone in California goes green. Cuts their electric bills in half. Get hybrid cars and use half the gasoline. Now we have half the revenue from these sources we had before.

They are already talking about mileage taxation.