Bad news for the AWB supporters

[Peikko 1,575]

Well, we don't know yet, but it's heading in that direction. From civilization to chaos via the AR-15, groovy, baby!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Public safety is the primary concern. The potential lethal power of someone using an assault rifle on a crowd could cause more deaths than a hand grenade.

But Steven, any weapon could be used for an assault or a crime. The VT shooter showed just how devastating and assaultive 2 pistols could be.

Only those who obey the law to begin with will obey any new law. Therefore, the law is generally only applicable to those who follow it. So the question begs; who is really benefitting from this legislation?

A ban on manufacturing will make it more difficult for someone to obtain them. From what I understand, because of the current laws against, or for strict ownership of fully automatic weapons, the weapons manufacturers came up with legal semi-auto versions. Limiting the number of rounds is a significant part of the ban proposal.

Look, nobody is going to advocate that we allow citizens to build their own nuclear bombs because of not only potential threat to others, but the chance that the bomb could get into the wrong hands. Where do we draw the line of legality over protecting citizens from such potential dangers? I look at it as - what is the purpose of owning such firearms and what is the potential harm they could do to others in the wrong hands.

I don't necessarily think a ban will make them more difficult to obtain. The difficulty would be absorber by the supplier and transfered to the customer via higher price.

I think this issue is more than just the AWB. It is one small erosion of the right to gun ownership. You've said it yourself, that it follows the same logic as a previous ban. Therefore there will only be more restrictions in the years to come, and I just think it's not the best path to take.

I don't know why people own semi-automatic rifles. Perhaps hunting, sport shooting. I honestly don't know, as I don't own one. My wife banned me from purchasing one. She's the warden around here.

I don't want you to think that I'm for all out violence and total armament; because I'm not. I just think that banning something, while noble in theory, isn't the best way to achieve a desired reduction of something. That's mainly because I don't see centralized coercion or force as a catalyst for change.

The thing is, Matt, the gun lobby always uses that argument - that any regulation is part of some conspiracy to take away all guns...it's a straw man. I use the extreme example of someone building or possessing a nuclear bomb. There are certain weapons that we generally accept should be restricted or outlawed, based on the safety of our citizens. So I understand arguing over which weapons should be banned, as to whether such a ban is over-reaching vs. our individual rights. I have yet to see anyone advocating the right to own a nuclear bomb based on the Second Amendment. So what I see missing is any middle ground coming from the gun lobby on gun regulation. Meanwhile, I haven't seen any convincing argument as to ordinary citizens need a weapon with 30 round clips.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Well, we don't know yet, but it's heading in that direction. From civilization to chaos via the AR-15, groovy, baby!

Savages have destroyed civilizations from day 1. Then they form civilizations of their own and in turn get destroyed by new savages. The savages win every time, until they stop being savages themselves.

[Ban Hammer 13,469]

Well that's it then, re instate the draft, for both men and women, because that is the only way to ensure combat training for every man and woman in the country.

How ridiculous can this get? Luckily, I have never met any of you crazy nutters in real life, but if I did, I would be very, very scared of you, because what you believe is not normal.

I don't think much of your training by the way Shooter. You mentioned that your sons are in Iraq collecting human trophies. Looks like you have reared a bunch of savages.

just maybe, it's you that's not normal.

Well, we don't know yet, but it's heading in that direction. From civilization to chaos via the AR-15, groovy, baby!

oh yeah, that pesky ar-15. such a lethal firearm it is! why the 12 gauge shotgun pales in comparison!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Well that's it then, re instate the draft, for both men and women, because that is the only way to ensure combat training for every man and woman in the country.

How ridiculous can this get? Luckily, I have never met any of you crazy nutters in real life, but if I did, I would be very, very scared of you, because what you believe is not normal.

I don't think much of your training by the way Shooter. You mentioned that your sons are in Iraq collecting human trophies. Looks like you have reared a bunch of savages.

just maybe, it's you that's not normal.

Just maybe, 'normal' is subjective.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Society would be much safer if we all wore plastic explosive vests connected to a dead man's trigger.

Surely the same arguments that applied during the Cold War could apply here... Peace through mutual destruction.

[Peikko 1,575]

No, I am not abnormal Charles. You might live in cartoon land where bad guys roam the streets looking for ways to play out their evil plots, where everyone needs to know how to react in combat situations but I do not.

I have no problem with gun owners who are responsible, but the loony tunes, man, they are scary, and I am normal and right to be scared of them.

Society would be much safer if we all wore plastic explosive vests connected to a dead man's trigger.

Surely the same arguments that applied during the Cold War could apply here... Peace through mutual destruction.

Well, that wouldn't work because you would die too. That's not how it goes in 'hero' land. The hero always wins, because he is properly armed and trained, and know exactly how he would react faced with mortal danger. You know, the real men?

I used to be married to a guy like that actually, who saw shadows around every corner. What a blast that was

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

No, I am not abnormal Charles. You might live in cartoon land where bad guys roam the streets looking for ways to play out their evil plots, where everyone needs to know how to react in combat situations but I do not.

I have no problem with gun owners who are responsible, but the loony tunes, man, they are scary, and I am normal and right to be scared of them.

Society would be much safer if we all wore plastic explosive vests connected to a dead man's trigger.

Surely the same arguments that applied during the Cold War could apply here... Peace through mutual destruction.

Well, that wouldn't work because you would die too. That's not how it goes in 'hero' land. The hero always wins, because he is properly armed and trained, and know exactly how he would react faced with mortal danger. You know, the real men?

Some people in this county inhabit a subculture where acting like that is normal. I am glad I don't live in that space, I am saddened by the fact that it even exists. But it does exist and to them it's normal. To them, we're not.

[Peikko 1,575]

No, I am not abnormal Charles. You might live in cartoon land where bad guys roam the streets looking for ways to play out their evil plots, where everyone needs to know how to react in combat situations but I do not.

I have no problem with gun owners who are responsible, but the loony tunes, man, they are scary, and I am normal and right to be scared of them.

Society would be much safer if we all wore plastic explosive vests connected to a dead man's trigger.

Surely the same arguments that applied during the Cold War could apply here... Peace through mutual destruction.

Well, that wouldn't work because you would die too. That's not how it goes in 'hero' land. The hero always wins, because he is properly armed and trained, and know exactly how he would react faced with mortal danger. You know, the real men?

Some people in this county inhabit a subculture where acting like that is normal. I am glad I don't live in that space, I am saddened by the fact that it even exists. But it does exist and to them it's normal. To them, we're not.

Yes, they think they are normal I totally agree, which rather makes them more, as apposed to less 'dangerous', but according to my mathematical model, they are not

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I have a Venn diagram where the universe=normal people and I just can't decide where they go. I suspect they don't belong at all.

[Peikko 1,575]

Where's Almaty? He's the only responsible gun owner on here, well that I know of

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

No, I am not abnormal Charles. You might live in cartoon land where bad guys roam the streets looking for ways to play out their evil plots, where everyone needs to know how to react in combat situations but I do not.

I have no problem with gun owners who are responsible, but the loony tunes, man, they are scary, and I am normal and right to be scared of them.

Society would be much safer if we all wore plastic explosive vests connected to a dead man's trigger.

Surely the same arguments that applied during the Cold War could apply here... Peace through mutual destruction.

Well, that wouldn't work because you would die too. That's not how it goes in 'hero' land. The hero always wins, because he is properly armed and trained, and know exactly how he would react faced with mortal danger. You know, the real men?

Real Men.

[Peikko 1,575]

I have a Venn diagram where the universe=normal people and I just can't decide where they go. I suspect they don't belong at all.

The stupid thing is, despite the position they are trying to take on this, I don't think Charles and Natty are abnormal either - obtuse, probably but not abnormal

Real Men.

These belong in my 'Yo Ladies!' thread

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

I have a Venn diagram where the universe=normal people and I just can't decide where they go. I suspect they don't belong at all.

The stupid thing is, despite the position they are trying to take on this, I don't think Charles and Natty are abnormal either - obtuse, probably but not abnormal

I've been called obtuse before.

[Ban Hammer 13,469]

Where's Almaty? He's the only responsible gun owner on here, well that I know of

maybe you can define what you think is a responsible gun owner.