Withdrawal of Application

[ruby_jade 0]

I know that not sharing my information is a problem for the Embassy. But they have to understand my situation that is I have a lot of money and I did not necessarily go into that with my Fiancée. For obvious reasons. I do not want a gold digger. But I think she already knows. I have to many offices and to many phone numbers for her not to wonder. I did not think that she would understand the financial statements and that did not worry me but I did expect the Embassy to. As far as deductions I did not mean normal deductions like dependents and interest deductions and things. I file a joint return with my real estate company because it is a LLC and I had a lot of vacancies that year and my other companies floated me. But my assets are in the millions and the other companies made plenty of money that year if they bothered to look.

As far as her occupation she was a waitress in a restaurant when I met her and I was looking into the history on the Bataan Death March from WWII. My Great Uncle died on the death march and is buried in Manila. A lot of soldiers from New Mexico died on that march because the New Mexico Nation Guard was there at the start of the war. I have since posted information on Wikipedia.org about the Battling Bastards of Bataan Memorial at Camp O'Donnel. I met her while I was there in a restaurant. I did not expect to get into a relationship but she got me to get on-line with Yahoo which I had not done before and before I knew it we were spending hours and hours each night on-line. If you do not call that a relationship I do not know what is. We spend more time conversing each day then most married people. As far as what she is doing now she is enrolling in College in Tacloban and taking Computer Science.

I think that you are right that once she signed she was screwed. I am contemplating what to do next. I was wondering a little what the rest of you thought. My lawyer wants me to accept the Prostitution charge and ask for a waiver. He says that, that might take 5 years and it still could be denied if they think she hasn't sufficiently reformed herself. We will be getting married this fall between semesters and we are planning to start a family.

I still want to sue the US Govt. in Federal Court in Guam. I am sure we could win but all we could do is sue for them some procedural infraction and then it would be sent back to the Embassy for them to dream up something else. Something that is harder or murkier to fight like my income or moral turpitude or maybe even the age difference. That is why my lawyer does not want me to fight it. But I am absolutely offended that they labeled my fiancée a prostitute.

In the interview they found the Pre-nuptial agreement my lawyer had written for me and it had notes for me for further clarification. It was in the briefcase and I forgot it was there. They used it to attack me and say that I was not a good person with her and she should only trust them. They also did not give the agreement back at the end of the interview.

If she is just after my money isn't that my choice to make not the Embassy's! Or maybe they can decide that not just that a person makes to little to have their petition approved but there will be an upper limit as well?

thats so careless of you, a pre-nup in front of the consul!!!

Edited March 24, 2009 by ruby_jade

[Rocky_nBullwinkle 6]

I know that not sharing my information is a problem for the Embassy. But they have to understand my situation that is I have a lot of money and I did not necessarily go into that with my Fiancée. For obvious reasons. I do not want a gold digger. But I think she already knows. I have to many offices and to many phone numbers for her not to wonder. I did not think that she would understand the financial statements and that did not worry me but I did expect the Embassy to. As far as deductions I did not mean normal deductions like dependents and interest deductions and things. I file a joint return with my real estate company because it is a LLC and I had a lot of vacancies that year and my other companies floated me. But my assets are in the millions and the other companies made plenty of money that year if they bothered to look.

As far as her occupation she was a waitress in a restaurant when I met her and I was looking into the history on the Bataan Death March from WWII. My Great Uncle died on the death march and is buried in Manila. A lot of soldiers from New Mexico died on that march because the New Mexico Nation Guard was there at the start of the war. I have since posted information on Wikipedia.org about the Battling Bastards of Bataan Memorial at Camp O'Donnel. I met her while I was there in a restaurant. I did not expect to get into a relationship but she got me to get on-line with Yahoo which I had not done before and before I knew it we were spending hours and hours each night on-line. If you do not call that a relationship I do not know what is. We spend more time conversing each day then most married people. As far as what she is doing now she is enrolling in College in Tacloban and taking Computer Science.

I think that you are right that once she signed she was screwed. I am contemplating what to do next. I was wondering a little what the rest of you thought. My lawyer wants me to accept the Prostitution charge and ask for a waiver. He says that, that might take 5 years and it still could be denied if they think she hasn't sufficiently reformed herself. We will be getting married this fall between semesters and we are planning to start a family.

I still want to sue the US Govt. in Federal Court in Guam. I am sure we could win but all we could do is sue for them some procedural infraction and then it would be sent back to the Embassy for them to dream up something else. Something that is harder or murkier to fight like my income or moral turpitude or maybe even the age difference. That is why my lawyer does not want me to fight it. But I am absolutely offended that they labeled my fiancée a prostitute.

In the interview they found the Pre-nuptial agreement my lawyer had written for me and it had notes for me for further clarification. It was in the briefcase and I forgot it was there. They used it to attack me and say that I was not a good person with her and she should only trust them. They also did not give the agreement back at the end of the interview.

If she is just after my money isn't that my choice to make not the Embassy's! Or maybe they can decide that not just that a person makes to little to have their petition approved but there will be an upper limit as well?

This shows you are a first class sleaze, and I think she got off lucky. What kind of life would she have had with you anyways? Definitely not being treated as a wife, but as a possession.

Edited March 24, 2009 by Rocky_nBullwinkle

[maritoni 3]

You failed to provide heaps of evidences,But i believe that your fiancee was treated with less courtesy...

The interviewing Visa Officer has a notorious reputation for this, and of course the law keep them very insulated from any recourse. The Visa Officers clearly have way too much power and control over two peoples lives..

And it is the USCs dollars paying this Visa officers salary? Give me a break. These Visa Officers are in a position as to represent the citizens of the USA, ambassadors..soo sad indeed!

I think the Visa Officers need to be held more accountable to their decisions. I think there needs to be a way to appeal their decisions and for the petitioners to be able to attend the interviews side by side with their fiancee's. And especially important, I think that all interviews should be video taped for further use in the appeal process if it happens that the applicant is denied or is requested to provide further evidence. Video tapes of applicants that pass can be deleted as they would be of no further use. But the applicants that are denied should be able to have access to this video to prove they were treated poorly and use as evidence in the appeal process. And this appeal process needs to stay in the country and not kicked back to the USCIS for to begin the process all over again..

[angel7407 33]

Yes.. she lacked confidence that is her nature. Is that to say that only confident people should be let into the US. She is not a dummy and I would not want to change anything about her.

She was prepared with everything she needed to be prepared for and they should not have put her through what she was put through for a misunderstanding. We should have been given a chance to clear up the misunderstanding but what they did was go on a witch hunt instead. I think that we addressed most all of the concerns as she said that they really did not ask any more questions about my financial statements and did not even want to see the 600 page book of Yahoo correspondence. They mostly fixated about her past boyfriends all three of them. But they did not go into our relationship much. I am not sure why. They did ask much about her previous relationships and mine as well. Maybe they thought I was a prostitute.

If you look at the Statute: INS 212(a)(2)(d) applicants are inadmissible if they engage in prostitution and if you look at the definition of prostitution it is defined by they the State Dept. which is how it must be judged as in Kepilino vs. Alberto Gonzales circa. 2006. It is defined by statute by the US State Dept. in 22 C.F.R. 40.24(B) as... Prostitution defined: The Term "prostitution" means engaging in promiscuous sexual intercourse for hire. A finding that an alien has "engaged" in prostitution must be based on elements of continuity and regularity indicating a pattern of behavior or deliberate course of conduct entered into primarily for financial gain or for other considerations of material value as distinguished from the commission of casual or isolated acts.

Does her first boyfriend which she lived with for a year constitute the pattern of continuity and regularity. Or is it the two other guys she had one night stands with before she met me constitute she was only interested in foreigners and that upset the Filipino interviewer. Or maybe it was that I gave her all my left over peso's as I left the Philippines that constituted a clear pattern of behavior and I wonder how they classify the money I sent her over the last year. I am not sure but it certainly is unfair!!!

Unfortunately a number of the statutes are on purpose vague and can be used to the discretion of the investigators and if he is having a bad hair day you are screwed. The prostitution charge is very specific and she clearly did not meet it so I am very confident that I can fight it and win but it will take years and I am worried about retaliation on the part of the Embassy or USCIS and then they might get into one of those vague areas.

It is very true that they will dig up on past relationships on both the petitioner and the fiancee. Actually, I was already married to my husband which is why we filed for a K-3, but the questions of the CO was focused on my past relationships...hahaha! My husband was never married when we met (he was 40 that time which is 2 years ago) but I have 3 children from 2 men. And yes, I had a foreigner ex-BF whom I did not meet in person yet but sponsored me for a tourist visa application (of course, I was denied!). The application for that tourist visa was on their database (I did not know it!) and it was the first question of the lady CO to me... I was caught unaware! But confidently I have answered her the right way and I explained to her truthfully what happened to that past relationship. Second thing is he gave the names of the fathers of my children and had me explain each relationship and what went wrong, why we did not marry, etc...etc... It was tough, whew!!! Then she let me explain how I met my husband, what made me decide to marry him (and not to add that my husband married me immediately the first time he came to the Philippines, our first meeting also after 4 months of chatting!) What I did was just answer and explained everything confidently. When you are not confident in answering and explaining to them, I think a problem will arise. The fact that my husband had a very, very low income for 2007 (he's into real estate and had only $7,000 income for 2007) scared me to death because I know it can affect the petition, but so far when the CO saw it, she did not question anything about it since my husband sent a letter for them explaining his income. I believe that it is case to case basis on how the CO deals with every interviewee. For me, the best shot is, be confident in answering them all their questions. That is, if the fiancee knows everything about the petitioner. I hope and pray that the case will be resolved immediately. God bless on your endeavor!

[DEDixon 39]

Unfortunately, Bill, you are still blaming USEM when you should be blaming yourself.

So Bill, can you explain those deduction and the gross income to us? If an employer pays someone 50,000 and when filing he has 12,000 in deductions, he still made 50,000 Bill. All deductions do is lower your taxable income Bill.

[JoenKate 0]

I still doubt highly that they just pulled prostitution out of thin air like that. I think closer inspection of her NBI would answer that. He kept vital info from her I am sure she could have done the same with him.

[MercyandBill 0]

thats so careless of you, a pre-nup in front of the consul!!!

I was intending to go in with her but when we got to the guard and there was a big line she was the only one that he would let go through, I was surprised and I gave her the briefcase. But maybe it is her fault as well because she just gave him the whole thing to dig through. oh well, or maybe it is their fault for being so sleezey.

[MercyandBill 0]

This shows you are a first class sleaze, and I think she got off lucky. What kind of life would she have had with you anyways? Definitely not being treated as a wife, but as a possession.

Actually one of my Lawyers threatened to quit if I got married again I wonder what that makes him? I then explained that I still wanted to have a family and kids as I have not been blessed so far in life and I also do not believe in having kids without being married so he gave in.

[MercyandBill 0]

You failed to provide heaps of evidences,But i believe that your fiancee was treated with less courtesy...

The interviewing Visa Officer has a notorious reputation for this, and of course the law keep them very insulated from any recourse. The Visa Officers clearly have way too much power and control over two peoples lives..

And it is the USCs dollars paying this Visa officers salary? Give me a break. These Visa Officers are in a position as to represent the citizens of the USA, ambassadors..soo sad indeed!

I think the Visa Officers need to be held more accountable to their decisions. I think there needs to be a way to appeal their decisions and for the petitioners to be able to attend the interviews side by side with their fiancee's. And especially important, I think that all interviews should be video taped for further use in the appeal process if it happens that the applicant is denied or is requested to provide further evidence. Video tapes of applicants that pass can be deleted as they would be of no further use. But the applicants that are denied should be able to have access to this video to prove they were treated poorly and use as evidence in the appeal process. And this appeal process needs to stay in the country and not kicked back to the USCIS for to begin the process all over again..

Yes I think that this is the root of the problem that there is not good oversight and that the investigator can pretty much do as he pleases and most of them are Filipinos that are promised US citizenship if they do a good job after some amount of years and this leads to over zealousness. He also lied to Mercy about a whole lot of things and it is just not right. If you were able to pull up the first document that I made reference to;

http://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/leg...tconviction.pdf

Mr. Keith Hunsecker gives guidelines on how the interview should proceed and from what Mercy told me it went nothing like it was supposed to but when the investigator typed it up it vary well may be according to procedure. Who is to say there is no oversight.

[JoenKate 0]

Yes I think that this is the root of the problem that there is not good oversight and that the investigator can pretty much do as he pleases and most of them are Filipinos that are promised US citizenship if they do a good job after some amount of years and this leads to over zealousness. He also lied to Mercy about a whole lot of things and it is just not right. If you were able to pull up the first document that I made reference to;

uhhhh the pre-screeners are usually Filipino the CO's are American.

your statement is not accurate.

[RonnieKris 26]

After reading this thread, I'm still confused as to why the petition was denied... was it something the pinay did wrong or something the yank did wrong?

If she was forced to sign a form to withdraw the petition, surely she was told the reason, right? What was the reason?

[Craneman 2]

"What was the reason they picked her among 100s of others? NBI record?. They don't just do a eanie, meani, minie, moe!

Sure don't sound right! "

ok sounds fair let me elaborate:

Mercy went for her first interview on Jan. 14th. the American lady interviewer asked her about my income, I own many businesses with many employees. My financial statements are 37 pages and the pre-screener pulled only my 1040 out of all the papers and gave them to her and she said that I did not have enough income and how come these income tax forms were only 2007. It went down hill from there.

The fact that my 1040 does not show a lot of income for 2007 is because I had a lot of deductions for that year. I had just recently put up two new commercial buildings and had a lot of deductions. Looking at the 1040 alone is not a good representation of my income or wealth and as for the 2007 income tax it was only Jan. 14th. "give me a break!" I do not know when she does her taxes. They need better employees in these Embassys.

She was unhappy that we had only one picture of us together, how come I had not come back to visit her again, why had I not given her a engagement ring yet, she asked about my previous marriages and Mercy was not very forceful in her answers and I had not told her much about them, the lady was probably having a bad hair day and sent it to the Fraud Unit. She was also probably upset about our age difference. Who knows.

I did not go into to much detail of my previous relationships and marriages with Mercy as it is not usually a good idea to go into these to soon in a relationship and besides it is not very romantic. If she had asked I would not have lied to her but I certainly wasn't going to volunteer the information to early and if the Embassy wanted to know anything about them they should ask me not her! That is also true for my income if the have questions about it they should ask me not her! I do not completely understand my financial statements myself that is what I have accounts for, to explain it to me.

This goes to show that it is important to document as much as possible including going way overboard on the documentation to avoid being sent to the Fraud Unit and that still cannot protect you from an incompetent case worker that cannot read a Financial Statement.

I went to Visa Journey and did some reading and found out that going to an second interview was was the same as being sent to Fraud Unit and I got really scared and immediately flew out for the second interview. There was a big misunderstanding and I was going to clear it up. I arrived a week early and I met the parents, saw where she grew up, took lots of pictures, gave her the engagement ring that I had bought months before, took pictures of that. I wanted to make sure I had all the objections were covered. I had my CPA's and Accountants work overtime to get my 2008 financials done early to bring them to the interview also. I printed out 600 pages of Yahoo txt's of us txt'ing every night in 8pt. and brought that also. This time I had overkill.

As I sat with the US Lawyer on the bench outside the interrogation unit he said that they do not like it when the petitioner shows up, that they are not looking for me to answer the problems they have with the petition. That means that they will have to look that much harder to find something to deny for.

I was surprised that they would not let me go into the interview when we got there so I gave mercy the large bag with all the documentation in it and told her if they had any questions about my financial situation or about my previous relationships that I was just outside and they could come and get me. She repeatedly told them that I was outside and they should ask me and they kept harassing her about the other relationships and finally he said to her that she was under investigation not me "whatever that means" and he was not going to come out and get me. That is probably because he knew that I would not stand for his nonsense and I would have stood up to him. He never did come out and get me but I was there all day!!!

This whole thing sounds fishy to me.

[Craneman 2]

At my fiance's interview, I was present, she was asked about my previous marriages, she knew the answers.

She was asked about my children, she knew the answers.

She was asked what I gave her for Christmas, she knew.

She was aksed how and where we met, she knew the answer.

She was asked the town and state I live in, she knew the answer.

She was asked the name of the company I worked for and how long I worked for them, she knew the answer, she even told them my bosses name.

She was asked how we comunicated, that is when I answered in Portuguses, since the entire interview had been in Portuguese, I joined the conversation at that point.

30 seconds later interview over, approved.

A real relationship is easy to prove, takes no effort at all.

[Rocky_nBullwinkle 6]

This shows you are a first class sleaze, and I think she got off lucky. What kind of life would she have had with you anyways? Definitely not being treated as a wife, but as a possession.

Actually one of my Lawyers threatened to quit if I got married again I wonder what that makes him? I then explained that I still wanted to have a family and kids as I have not been blessed so far in life and I also do not believe in having kids without being married so he gave in.

A lawyer with a conscious, no doubt.

[angela920 0]

she might not be telling you all about her as what you have previously stated you didn't really tell her about your past relationships coz she didn't ask. What about you? did you ask her about her previous life? How much do you really know? This kind of situation is very rare and most of the time happens for a reason. When i went to have my interview at the embassy... nothing like this happen or at least not that I am aware of. And what's up with the pre-nup? when you marry somebody you don't need any agreements otherwise it would sound like a business proposal that needs contract.

I don't know you or her to judge but this sounds very very unlikely to me. She might not be the most smartest girl in the world but i understand if shes being maltreated then it's not pleasant. I have a relative who is a Visayan native and when she got interviewed by the CO she was given an interpreter. (but that also sounds fishy to me. lol dont know if shes telling me the truth... coz why would you marry somebody who can't even speak your language?) How's her english? I think you know communication is VERY important in a relationship. If neither of you don't have a good grasp of each others language usually its doomed. But in most cases, the Pinays are the ones fluent in English.

You can't marry somebody who you can't even communicate well. Might as well hire an interpreter for life.