Facts About Marriage Brokers

[one...two...tree 2,762]

For anyone who's disputing that such abuses exists...

Trafficking

Police uncovered a Taiwanese trafficking ring and arrested Lee Min Long, as he left for Taiwan with a suitcase packed with pictures and personal documents of 400 Vietnamese women. According to the police, from 1993 to 1998, Long traveled 23 times to Vietnam to organize a network selling Vietnamese women to Taiwan. Through local accomplices working at karaoke bars, restaurants and hotels, Long found young girls, generally from the countryside, and lured them with the prospect of marriage to a wealthy Taiwanese businessman. ("Women trade to Taiwan cracked down," HURINet - The Human Rights Information Network, 15 July 1998)

A Taiwanese man, Chen Chin En, 48, was arrested and charged with the procurement of Thai women for prostitution in Taiwan. A Thai man complained to police in July 1998, that his wife had been told by Chen she would work as a housewife in Taiwan, promising her a salary of Baht 15,000 per month. His wife had to register for a marriage certificate with another Taiwanese man in Thailand to apply for a visa. When she arrived in Taiwan she was taken to a brothel in Kaosung and forced into prostitution. Police said more than 500 Thai women had been lured into prostitution in Taiwan under the same method used by the gang. ("Taiwanese ‘procurer’ held," The Nation, 29 July 1998)

In 1991, Taiwanese women were being sold in Japan, often to the Yakuza, at $2,400 to $18,000 each. (CATW - Asia Pacific, Trafficking in Women and Prostitution in the Asia Pacific)

Mail Order Brides

There are more than 400 women in Tungkang who have come as "brides." Filipinas top the list, followed by Indonesians. Those from Vietnam and Thailand are also increasing. One Tungkang man paid NT$300,000 (US$10,909) for a Filipina wife. Of that figure, only NT$9,000 (US$327.27) went to his in-laws as required by tradition, while the remainder was pocketed by marriage brokers in both the Philippines and Taiwan. (Yeh Sheng-yi, a Tungkang police officer responsible for foreign affairs, Sofia Wu, "Foreign Brides Bring Exotic Flavor to Taiwan Fishing Town," CNA, 10 April 1997)

http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/taiw.htm

[Chuckles 0]

Please....

These rings ARE illegal and have ALWAYS been illegal !!! How does IMBRA stop this at all?

Perhaps I am not following your logic, please explain.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Please....

These rings ARE illegal and have ALWAYS been illegal !!! How does IMBRA stop this at all?

Perhaps I am not following your logic, please explain.

Someone in another thread disputed that "Mail-Order Bride" agencies exist. Although agencie's unethical activities vary in range greatly, it has in essence been one of the driving forces behind IMBRA. These agencies that are overseas are out of U.S. jurisdiction and for years have escaped any accountability from the U.S.. They have long been able to use our immigration process to get foreign women over here unethically. Now with IMBRA, the scrutiny will be more focused on the petitioner, who will now be more selective as to what kind of agency they use. That makes logical sense to me.

[BlueSurf 0]

"How does IMBRA stop this at all?"

I share your frustration, Chuckles.

This is totally off the point, yet this is the type of stuff that gets IMBRA supporters passionate about "the cause". There is a point where Americans have got to stop trying to save the world, and start trusting that good will ultimately prevail if we show respect for others and their right to make their own choices in life.

The asian culture about marriage and family has nothing IMO to do with marriage in the US of A.

[desert_fox 32]

The law was never designed to stop these kinds of abuses. It was designed to prevent foreign fiancess from becoming victims of abusers that have a history of domestic violence, registered sex offenders, stalkers, etc. from preying on innocent foreign women with their sick behavior.

[chocolaterie 0]

The law was never designed to stop these kinds of abuses. It was designed to prevent foreign fiancess from becoming victims of abusers that have a history of domestic violence, registered sex offenders, stalkers, etc. from preying on innocent foreign women with their sick behavior.

StevenJinky, off topic but cool bender avatar!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

"How does IMBRA stop this at all?"

I share your frustration, Chuckles.

This is totally off the point, yet this is the type of stuff that gets IMBRA supporters passionate about "the cause". There is a point where Americans have got to stop trying to save the world, and start trusting that good will ultimately prevail if we show respect for others and their right to make their own choices in life.

The asian culture about marriage and family has nothing IMO to do with marriage in the US of A.

Because it scrutinizes the nature of the relationship if the petitioner uses a marriage broker. If immigration finds out you paid $10,000 for your fiancee, you think they might be a little less inclined to grant the visa? I believe the law was purposely designed not to outright restrict those kinds of arranged marriages, but it gives immigration the opportunity to more thoroughly screen applicants.

I never heard of IMBRA before joining VJ, and I have been frustrated with the delays as much as anyone else here. I hate that we have to go through this, but in the long run I believe it will benefit those who are honest and sincere about marrying a foreigner.

[BlueSurf 0]

"It was designed to prevent foreign fiancess from becoming victims of abusers..."

Desert Fox, please be accurate!! The law was not designed to prevent anything IMO. It is a law that is designed to give fiance's information about the petitioner - that's all. The law itself does not prevent a thing.

There are people who hope that the effect of the law will reduce abuse. That is a hoped for byproduct of the new law. At this point it is anyone's guess if it will indeed have such an "effect", or if it will also have the effect of distorting things to the degree a good and otherwise viable relationship is soured at its birth.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The law was never designed to stop these kinds of abuses. It was designed to prevent foreign fiancess from becoming victims of abusers that have a history of domestic violence, registered sex offenders, stalkers, etc. from preying on innocent foreign women with their sick behavior.

StevenJinky, off topic but cool bender avatar!

hehehe...thanks! I'm a Phoenix native, BTW! Born in Mesa and live there until '96 when I moved out to Cali for my career.

[Chuckles 0]

The organizations you describe ARE NOT brokers. They are illegal organizations akin to the mob.

They will operate EXACTLY the same with or without the IMBRA law. IMBRA is targeted at businesses that operate with the law.

OF COURSE these crimes happen. I have NEVER seen anyone dispute that they do. Please show me where this is disputed ?? The fact is however that IMBRA doesn't address this problem at its source, which is what you describe.

Please let me know what I have missed.

[Imbra2005 0]

"It was designed to prevent foreign fiancess from becoming victims of abusers..."

Desert Fox, please be accurate!! The law was not designed to prevent anything IMO. It is a law that is designed to give fiance's information about the petitioner - that's all. The law itself does not prevent a thing.

There are people who hope that the effect of the law will reduce abuse. That is a hoped for byproduct of the new law. At this point it is anyone's guess if it will indeed have such an "effect", or if it will also have the effect of distorting things to the degree a good and otherwise viable relationship is soured at its birth.

I think you might be confusing the purpose of the law with the mechanism by which it attempts to achieve that goal. There is no question but that the law's purpose is to reduce the potential for abuse in these relationships. The mechanism by which it attempts to achieve this goal is to "level the playing field" between the USC and foreign woman by providing her with additional information, both about the USC petitioner and her rights under U.S. law if her relationship becomes abusive.

[Chuckles 0]

I just got to say something.

Just because someone is not happy with the IMBRA law does not mean they are pro-rape and/or pro-abuse. I wish the legislation actually had a chance to effect these things. The police check at time of the K1 is fine, and I really hope it helps someone, but there is more to the law that just makes me go... hummmmmmmmmm.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The organizations you describe ARE NOT brokers. They are illegal organizations akin to the mob.

They will operate EXACTLY the same with or without the IMBRA law. IMBRA is targeted at businesses that operate with the law.

OF COURSE these crimes happen. I have NEVER seen anyone dispute that they do. Please show me where this is disputed ?? The fact is however that IMBRA doesn't address this problem at its source, which is what you describe.

Please let me know what I have missed.

Do a Google search on "Mail-Order Brides". See how many agencies you'll get. Or type "Russian Brides". When did MOB agencies become illegal? I'm asking that because I honestly don't know but apparantly there are plenty of them up and running - and plenty of American men paying for their services.

I'm just stating my opinion here based on the new question the updated I-129F. It appears that immigration wants to know if the petitioner did in fact pay an agency and if so, they require additional information as to the nature of the relationship. Maybe I'm not communicating this well, but I can see how that kind of pressure applied to the petitioners will affect future petitioners if there is a trend after IMBRA of more K-1 Visa's being denied. That in turn is going to effect the whole marriage broker industry which will either fight a legal battle with IMBRA or adjust their business practices to lesson the chances of their customers being denied visa's. Am I making any sense?

[Chuckles 0]

The organizations you describe ARE NOT brokers. They are illegal organizations akin to the mob.

They will operate EXACTLY the same with or without the IMBRA law. IMBRA is targeted at businesses that operate with the law.

OF COURSE these crimes happen. I have NEVER seen anyone dispute that they do. Please show me where this is disputed ?? The fact is however that IMBRA doesn't address this problem at its source, which is what you describe.

Please let me know what I have missed.

Do a Google search on "Mail-Order Brides". See how many agencies you'll get. Or type "Russian Brides". When did MOB agencies become illegal? I'm asking that because I honestly don't know but apparantly there are plenty of them up and running - and plenty of American men paying for their services.

I'm just stating my opinion here based on the new question the updated I-129F. It appears that immigration wants to know if the petitioner did in fact pay an agency and if so, they require additional information as to the nature of the relationship. Maybe I'm not communicating this well, but I can see how that kind of pressure applied to the petitioners will affect future petitioners if there is a trend after IMBRA of more K-1 Visa's being denied. That in turn is going to effect the whole marriage broker industry which will either fight a legal battle with IMBRA or adjust their business practices to lesson the chances of their customers being denied visa's. Am I making any sense?

Mail Order brides... how does that work? I see lots of sites that operate EXACTLY like the Yahoo personals, is that what you refer to as 'mail order bride' sites?

Ok, I googled it. Nowhere can I pay a fee to have a wife delivered. Sorry. For that I need to go underground and contact organized crime that deals in human trafficing.

I understand your opinion now, but I still think you miss the mark. There are plenty of checks along the way when applying for the K1 petition. The added police check is great, at the time of the petition. The rest is a bunch of ####### that makes no sense in the real world, IMO.

And oh... Organized crime i.e. the MOB has been illegal for a long time ... not sure what you were thinking there.

Edited June 18, 2006 by Chuckles

[Imbra2005 0]

Mail Order brides... how does that work? I see lots of sites that operate EXACTLY like the Yahoo personals, is that what you refer to as 'mail order bride' sites?

Ok, I googled it. Nowhere can I pay a fee to have a wife delivered. Sorry. For that I need to go underground and contact organized crime that deals in human trafficing.

I understand your opinion now, but I still think you miss the mark. There are plenty of checks along the way when applying for the K1 petition. The added police check is great, at the time of the petition. The rest is a bunch of ####### that makes no sense in the real world, IMO.

And oh... Organized crime i.e. the MOB has been illegal for a long time ... not sure what you were thinking there.

Chuckles,

I think what "mail order bride" sites mean are those sites that market the foreign woman as a commodity that is being "sold" to the USC male. Obviously you will not find sites openly trafficking in humans (at least I hope not). But the websites do advertise their "products" this way (I posted this on a different thread so sorry for the rerun if you've seen them already)

"Total cost for services: $10,500.00 U.S. A beautiful woman to sleep with at night, kiss in the morning, and love all day long, for so little - less than an economy car." www.armcandyinternational.com

"Welcome to Intimate Submissives®™, where Western Men can find sexy submissive Asian women … selected for their loyalty and zero tolerance for divorce… who want a man to serve and to please. . . .” (www.submissives.net) “Our registered trademark is: It’s Good to be the King!” (www.submissives.net/order.htm)

“Most Asian ladies fill out an application saying what they want. … If a guy went shopping he is going to buy what interest him, not what interest you. … The ladies who use words like below, improve their chances of meeting someone: ‘If I meet a man who loves me, I'm going to love him forever. I hope to meet a family man that I can be a good wife for. I want to meet a man who is responsible and I'll be there for him for better or worse.’ ” (www.filipinalady.biz/asian-ladies-advise-for-ladies.htm)

“Women from Asia are gentle. They don't bust your chops, when you are home a little late, or forget an anniversary.” (http://www.heart-of-asia.com/gen/whyasia.html)

“In Russia, she doesn’t have a choice to stay home to take care of her husband, house, and children – for her, it is a dream. The Russian woman’s attitude about herself is feminine. She expects to be treated as a lady, she is the weaker gender and knows it. The Russian woman has not been exposed to the world of rampant feminism that asserts its rights in America.” (www.chanceforlove.com)

“These women have a different outlook on life and marriage. They are less materialistic than their American counterparts and are more family oriented. As wives, they desire to build a loving home, follow their husband's lead, and stick with the marriage, even when times get tough and things stop being ‘fun.’” (http://www.encount.com/ladies/)

“[Russian women] are much more patient and can tolerate things that Western women will never be able to bear. … Another important difference is that Russian women (and Russians in general) have very low self-esteem. While Western women think that they are goddesses and able to cope with anything on their own, a Russian woman will rarely leave a bad (really BAD) husband because of the fear that she won't find another one. For many years the state and men have been oppressing them, and they don't think much about themselves.” (http://www.womenrussia.com/faq.htm#husbands)

“Have you been twice married to modern women who were too involved in their careers and your bank accounts? Think about a kind Russian girl!” (personals.agava.ru/)

“. . . you will want your Latin wife to keep that beautiful body for many years to come. They will be eating more fatty foods here then [sic] in their country. Look around at all these fat American women, they will look at your beautiful wife with scorn, don’t let it happen to your wife, she is your greatest investment. . . .

Americanized – This is the worst thing that can happen to your sweet, innocent Latin wife. She becomes like the women you are trying to get away from. She can become Americanized through her friends or her work. It only takes one lesbian or feminist to plant the seeds in her head, our society can do the rest. Get to know her friends and co-workers. Never let here [sic] go out at night with her friends alone to dance or to a party.” (http://www.latina-women-girls-brides-wives-ladies.com/id41.html)

Some of the websites actually have "satisfaction guarantees" -- if you don't like your first mail order bride, just send her back to her country before the 90 day K-1 visa expires and we'll hook you up with another at no extra charge. I'm not making this stuff up....

Edited June 18, 2006 by Imbra2005