New L.A. gun control law proposed

[pedroh 21]

her point is that, not because a big majority of gangs are black and/or hispanic, doesn't give anyone the right to treat blacks and hispanic differently

pedro, you might be a great guy, a wonderful father, a terrific husband, a law abiding taxpayer, and a contributing part of society, but you have to admit that some hispanics are out of control, and are not living within the societal norm. you will also remind me that some blacks are out of control, and outside the societal norm, and that some whites are, as well. trouble is, the ratio is something like 18.5 to 14.5 to 1, H/B/W.

when you look at it this way, you see why we have gotten a little frustrated with the situation. your assistance as a role model and stabilising influence in your own quarter is greatly appreciated, but

you have to admit that law enforcement efforts should be directed towards the area of perceived difficulty. if one guy is 18 times as likely to be trouble as the other, who gets searched first?

Police efforts generally focus on "reasonable suspicion" - like being caught with the gun in your hand, or loading stolen property into the back of your car.

Being black or hispanic isn't "reasonable suspicion".

Or being of "color" in a white neighborhood? You mean the same as being white in a non-white neighborhood means you are looking for drugs or prostitutes?

It does? Who knew!

no, we not only sell drugs, we have tv's too! interested in a 50" plasma?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

What about hispanics and blacks who want to enjoy their right to live free of harm, violence or persecution?

You are right. What about them? Why should they be a victim of crime while Caucasians like yourself living in peaceful neighborhoods play PC games? Sit anonymously behind forums and question and criticize anyone who is trying to do something. As you have done so before suggesting police go out and target minorities.

At the end of the day, low socioeconomic Latinos and Blacks are being killed by Latinos and blacks. That is the reality. So we either target the offenders and the actual perpetrators of the crime or we do nothing in the name of civil rights and being PC.

You have to adjust your demographics to show things other than race here, for instance, urban, suburban, or rural. Even in less populated county like mine, the problems with gangs tend to be associated with the more people per square mile.

[SMOKE 1,426]

interested in a 50" plasma?

yes i am. i was going to pick one up tonight at bestbuy....unless you can beat their price. Samsung $899?

[slim 1,525]

which is sad because some gun control in urban areas is absolutely necessary.

Why? Because it's going to make the criminals that use them think twice before they break the law?

No convicted felon should be allowed to own or carry a gun anywhere in the United States. You would think that is common sense.

No convicted felon is allowed to own or carry a gun, that's already illegal. What they're proposing is those convicted of other crimes not be allowed to own or carry a gun, and that's where you run into a problem. Say for instance you got into a scuffle at a bar while you were in college. You came out of it with a misdemeanor assault charge, paid a $300 fine plus court costs and then served six months probation. Not really a big deal, right? Well, now you're 35, have a house and three kids, and now you're not allowed to keep a gun at home anymore. That's a problem.

The next problem is that same guy who is now 35 with the wife and kids and already has a gun at home is instantly a felon unless he complies with the city ordinance. Why should he have to do that just because he was involved in a drunken scuffle back in college?

Isn't that the first thing the communists do when they take over? Disarm the people ?

And let's not forget the Indians, Africans, Jews, and any other group targeted by genocide.

Oh, so 'ignorance of the law is no defense' on applies to anyone who is not a gun owner? Good to know

Ignorance of the law isn't a good defense in any case. However, when a local ordinance is passed and instantly renders someone a felon who previously was in compliance with Federal law, that's no good either. It's not right that you have a Constitutionally protected Right to possess something, anything, and then the local government decides that it doesn't like your Rights anymore and is going to take them away without grandfathering in your Right to keep possession.

44% of gang members are Hispanic. The most of any race. Also saw in another study but forgot where it was that only 6% of Latinos have bachelors degrees. So not only are you guys uneducated you are also quite likely to gang bang and commit crime. Way to add value to society. You enter illegally, steal jobs, commit crime yet have the nerve to say you are socially just like everybody else and are just being picked on. Give me a break.

What these stats show is that we need to take guns away from Blacks and Latinos.

Well..... I hate to break it to you, buddy, but the majority of all crimes committed in the U.S. are still done by good ol' cornbread-fed white males. Crackers are still tops when it comes to crime! You can argue demographics and percentages all day long, but when it comes to volume, you just can't beat whitey!

So.... should we disarm white America first?

What the stats show is that guns should be taken out of the hands of Hispanics in this country. The represent nearly half of the gang members in this country.

See above, whitey is still tops when it comes to crime. Sure, maybe his darker-skinned brothers are "representin'" more, and are more gang-affiliated, but whites still commit more crimes than any other ethnicity or race.

Shouldn't we start the disarmament process with the pale faces?

The stats you presented show a demographic breakdown of gang ethnicity. They do not show that guns should be taken out of anyone's hands. That's a statement of opinion on your part - completely unconnected to that statistics you presented.

Exactly! Why we would disarm anyone based on race or ethnicity is simply ludacris.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

No convicted felon is allowed to own or carry a gun, that's already illegal. What they're proposing is those convicted of other crimes not be allowed to own or carry a gun, and that's where you run into a problem. Say for instance you got into a scuffle at a bar while you were in college. You came out of it with a misdemeanor assault charge, paid a $300 fine plus court costs and then served six months probation. Not really a big deal, right? Well, now you're 35, have a house and three kids, and now you're not allowed to keep a gun at home anymore. That's a problem.

The next problem is that same guy who is now 35 with the wife and kids and already has a gun at home is instantly a felon unless he complies with the city ordinance. Why should he have to do that just because he was involved in a drunken scuffle back in college?

I think it only mentioned a 10 year (not a lifetime) ban.

[Heracles 417]

crime is not only committed by gangs...

criminals should be targeted regardless of what colour their skin is

The statistics suggest otherwise but I am not going to go into that on a Friday evening.

Where you guys fail miserably is to accept that the two so-called 'minorities' in the United States of America represent a large portion of criminals, when averaged. What that means is that if you listed population vs those convicted and then broke that down into race (not skin color which you guys are fixated with) Black Americans are Latino Americans (excluding illegals) would be on top of the list. We have been through this before. I have also heard the range of historical based excuses as well as been the recipient of a range of personal insults for suggesting so. That does not change the reality or the stats though.

People are fixated on the two minorities being apparently victimized. Even though apart from a few isolated cases there is no evidence suggesting these assumptions are correct. Certain people clearly cannot see passed that. So nothing is ever done. If guns were taken out of the hands of both major 'minorities' in the United States, the crime rate would fall.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

When did I say that? I am quite happy to have some gun legislation that can usefully be used - for example the suggestion in the OP that if you commit certain crimes you lose your right to gun ownership. What I am not happy about is using dodgy rationale to target ethnic groups for 'special treatment' all in the name of public safety. I don't want to live in a totalitarian state.

Correction. Target the majority of gang bangers. Why should Koreans or Japanese be targeted when they have done no wrong?

I don't want anyone 'targeted' except when they give just cause for the police to act. When you understand that being a gang member is a very small subset of people living in the US then you might understand why it's unacceptable to simply use someone's ethnicity as a basis of an assumption that they are up to no good when out and about on public streets.

As for this suggestion that based on a larger % of latinos and blacks being gang members suddenly no latinos and blacks should be gun owners, that's about as bigoted as you can get, mate.

Not true. Some neighborhoods are virtually ruled by gangs.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

crime is not only committed by gangs...

criminals should be targeted regardless of what colour their skin is

The statistics suggest otherwise but I am not going to go into that on a Friday evening.

Where you guys fail miserably is to accept that the two so-called 'minorities' in the United States of America represent a large portion of criminals, when averaged. What that means is that if you listed population vs those convicted and then broke that down into race (not skin color which you guys are fixated with) Black Americans are Latino Americans (excluding illegals) would be on top of the list. We have been through this before. I have also heard the range of historical based excuses as well as been the recipient of a range of personal insults for suggesting so. That does not change the reality or the stats though.

I didn't deny it!

People are fixated on the two minorities being apparently victimized. Even though apart from a few isolated cases there is no evidence suggesting these assumptions are correct. Certain people clearly cannot see passed that. So nothing is ever done. If guns were taken out of the hands of both major 'minorities' in the United States, the crime rate would fall.

Call it a hunch - but I don't think the gangs use legally obtained, registered in-their-own-name firearms to commit their crimes.

[Marilyn. 340]

crime is not only committed by gangs...

criminals should be targeted regardless of what colour their skin is

The statistics suggest otherwise but I am not going to go into that on a Friday evening.

Where you guys fail miserably is to accept that the two so-called 'minorities' in the United States of America represent a large portion of criminals, when averaged. What that means is that if you listed population vs those convicted and then broke that down into race (not skin color which you guys are fixated with) Black Americans are Latino Americans (excluding illegals) would be on top of the list. We have been through this before. I have also heard the range of historical based excuses as well as been the recipient of a range of personal insults for suggesting so. That does not change the reality or the stats though.

People are fixated on the two minorities being apparently victimized. Even though apart from a few isolated cases there is no evidence suggesting these assumptions are correct. Certain people clearly cannot see passed that. So nothing is ever done. If guns were taken out of the hands of both major 'minorities' in the United States, the crime rate would fall.

uh what statistics?.. I am pretty sure gangs are not the only people committing crimes

guns should be taken out of criminals hands...

it seems to me you are saying if you are black or Hispanic you shouldn't be allowed to have a gun

[Ban Hammer 13,355]

Or being of "color" in a white neighborhood? You mean the same as being white in a non-white neighborhood means you are looking for drugs or prostitutes?

saw that one a few times on cops.

[Heracles 417]

Well..... I hate to break it to you, buddy, but the majority of all crimes committed in the U.S. are still done by good ol' cornbread-fed white males. Crackers are still tops when it comes to crime! You can argue demographics and percentages all day long, but when it comes to volume, you just can't beat whitey!

So.... should we disarm white America first

Exactly! Why we would disarm anyone based on race or ethnicity is simply ludacris.

Or is some idiot going to suggest that the system is racist hence the incarceration rate.

Edited February 13, 2009 by Aficionado

[tmma 467]

.......simply ludacris.

This is simply Ludacris

Slim, Sorry I couldn't resist.....I stole this from someone at Expats who posted it after someone else spelled it like you did.....

[Marilyn. 340]

well maybe a lot of the white people who commit crimes just don't get caught because people think only black or Hispanic people commit crimes

[SMOKE 1,426]

Or is some idiot going to suggest that the system is racist hence the incarceration rate.

now how am i suppose to be a smartazz when you beat me to it?