2 year old kid smoking in China

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Evidently.

[Danno 1,228]

kids drink beer in china freely, even at the age of 2-3. nothing funnier than watching my 2 year old nephew and the beagle we had in louyang, both drunk, wrestling over an olympic doll on the floor in the middle of a big family dinner. kids don't generally like cigarettes, but Peter the dog does.

I am sure you had to laugh so as not to offend your hosts and you realize of course that this was totally inappropriate behaviour that you would never condone?

offend my hosts? i was the host. who do you think got the dog drunk? the kid was already half gone by the time the in laws arrived for dinner. like father - like son. a genuinely likeable family. not uptight, in the least.

Careful now shooter, you know the typical thinking: a kids drinks beer one time "you" are a despicable person... feed a kid until he is fat as a pig... "no problem".

[Peikko 1,575]

kids drink beer in china freely, even at the age of 2-3. nothing funnier than watching my 2 year old nephew and the beagle we had in louyang, both drunk, wrestling over an olympic doll on the floor in the middle of a big family dinner. kids don't generally like cigarettes, but Peter the dog does.

I am sure you had to laugh so as not to offend your hosts and you realize of course that this was totally inappropriate behaviour that you would never condone?

offend my hosts? i was the host. who do you think got the dog drunk? the kid was already half gone by the time the in laws arrived for dinner. like father - like son. a genuinely likeable family. not uptight, in the least.

You see nothing wrong with getting a two year old drunk? Not one thing? Not even a small smidgen of a problem with it?

Danno, there is no comparative to be made. Someone who doesn't get their child drunk isn't necessarily going to feed them incorrectly. Really, lessons in logic should be made compulsory.

Edited February 12, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Getting a kid drink is pretty irresonsible parenting

[justashooter 430]

You see nothing wrong with getting a two year old drunk? Not one thing? Not even a small smidgen of a problem with it?

Danno, there is no comparative to be made. Someone who doesn't get their child drunk isn't necessarily going to feed them incorrectly. Really, lessons in logic should be made compulsory.

each country has it's own cultural mores and laws. we must all comply with the cultural standard, or disregard at our own risk. in china, children are often seen in bars, and often seen drinking alcohol. these children are chinese, so not subject to western moral standards.

there are a lot of things i do in china that i cannot do in America. These activities are related to college girls in hot tubs 4 at a time, driving illegal and unpapered motor vehicles, traffic violations, alcohol, brawling, cooking in the kitchens of 5 star restaraunts, keeping a dog in a 4 star hotel, and etc.

in china, i have guanxi (connections).

there are a lot of things that i do in America that i cannot do in china. these activities are related to firearms, explosives, political activism, free speech, challenging my government, and etc.

in America, i have rights.

[Peikko 1,575]

So, your moral compass is relative to where you happen to be?

Sorry, but to me that is just ridiculous. It may not be a good thing to spout your morals from the roof tops, but within your own family circle you can't behave in a responsible way? How weak you are.

I can't see how 'getting a 2 year old drunk' counts as a cool thing to do, even if it is 'legal'.

[justashooter 430]

So, your moral compass is relative to where you happen to be?

Sorry, but to me that is just ridiculous. It may not be a good thing to spout your morals from the roof tops, but within your own family circle you can't behave in a responsible way? How weak you are.

I can't see how 'getting a 2 year old drunk' counts as a cool thing to do, even if it is 'legal'.

my moral compass is surely different from yours, but that does not make it inherently "weak", just different. to the contrary, refusal to accept alternate societal standards could be characterised as "weak". never having lived in a truely foreign culture, you would not understand the concept.

any good psychiatrist can tell you that a person who needs those around them to conform to a specific standard in order to enhance the individual's image of himself is the weakest of all. perfect example? fundamentalist christian churches, which require scads of dogmatic conformity. another example? police persons, who force others around them to "behave" so as to validate their rather fragile control over their own inadequately developed persona.

in any case, a stable persona (not weak) does not require a moral compass. he does what is right for everyone in balance, all of the time. he looks to the past, the present, and the future, all in a moment, and chooses the wisest path, with the least negative and the most positive consequence for all.

[Peikko 1,575]

So, your moral compass is relative to where you happen to be?

Sorry, but to me that is just ridiculous. It may not be a good thing to spout your morals from the roof tops, but within your own family circle you can't behave in a responsible way? How weak you are.

I can't see how 'getting a 2 year old drunk' counts as a cool thing to do, even if it is 'legal'.

my moral compass is surely different from yours, but that does not make it inherently "weak", just different. to the contrary, refusal to accept alternate societal standards could be characterised as "weak". never having lived in a truely foreign culture, you would not understand the concept.

any good psychiatrist can tell you that a person who needs those around them to conform to a specific standard in order to enhance the individual's image of himself is the weakest of all. perfect example? fundamentalist christian churches, which require scads of dogmatic conformity. another example? police persons, who force others around them to "behave" so as to validate their rather fragile control over their own inadequately developed persona.

in any case, a stable persona (not weak) does not require a moral compass. he does what is right for everyone in balance, all of the time. he looks to the past, the present, and the future, all in a moment, and chooses the wisest path, with the least negative and the most positive consequence for all.

You know this how?

You really are being crass. There is a moral standard on a way to treat very young children that has nothing to do with the particular environment that one finds oneself in. It takes strength to choose to tell ones relatives that in fact, it's not funny to get a 2 year old drunk but could be seriously harmful, but it's very easy to just 'go with the flow'.

Indeed worse, because you instigated the whole event. Yet, you continue to defend this indefensible position.

[justashooter 430]

[

in any case, a stable persona (not weak) does not require a moral compass. he does what is right for everyone in balance, all of the time. he looks to the past, the present, and the future, all in a moment, and chooses the wisest path, with the least negative and the most positive consequence for all.

You know this how?

You really are being crass. There is a moral standard on a way to treat very young children that has nothing to do with the particular environment that one finds oneself in. It takes strength to choose to tell ones relatives that in fact, it's not funny to get a 2 year old drunk but could be seriously harmful, but it's very easy to just 'go with the flow'.

Indeed worse, because you instigated the whole event. Yet, you continue to defend this indefensible position.

You know this how?

you are avoiding the cultural issue, perhaps because you cannot dispute it. you are overlaying your own simple moral standard on a complex culture of 1.5 billion people that are different from you (who is being crass, now?).

some cultures feed young children fried scorpions (south chinese ethnic minority). you prolly wouldn't agree with that, either, but they've been doing it for centuries. denying a child part of the cultural norm isolates the child, never a good thing.

[Peikko 1,575]

[

in any case, a stable persona (not weak) does not require a moral compass. he does what is right for everyone in balance, all of the time. he looks to the past, the present, and the future, all in a moment, and chooses the wisest path, with the least negative and the most positive consequence for all.

You know this how?

You really are being crass. There is a moral standard on a way to treat very young children that has nothing to do with the particular environment that one finds oneself in. It takes strength to choose to tell ones relatives that in fact, it's not funny to get a 2 year old drunk but could be seriously harmful, but it's very easy to just 'go with the flow'.

Indeed worse, because you instigated the whole event. Yet, you continue to defend this indefensible position.

You know this how?

you are avoiding the cultural issue, perhaps because you cannot dispute it. you are overlaying your own simple moral standard on a complex culture of 1.5 billion people that are different from you (who is being crass, now?).

some cultures feed young children fried scorpions (south chinese ethnic minority). you prolly wouldn't agree with that, either, but they've been doing it for centuries. denying a child part of the cultural norm isolates the child, never a good thing.

Because you said so, earlier in the thread.

I have no problem with fried scorpions or any other unusual foods as long as they are not a known health risk. That is what is crass, getting a young child drunk is a HEALTH ISSUE. You said drunk, not "allowed to have a sip of alcohol". Can you not see the difference?

[Peikko 1,575]

kids drink beer in china freely, even at the age of 2-3. nothing funnier than watching my 2 year old nephew and the beagle we had in louyang, both drunk, wrestling over an olympic doll on the floor in the middle of a big family dinner. kids don't generally like cigarettes, but Peter the dog does.

I am sure you had to laugh so as not to offend your hosts and you realize of course that this was totally inappropriate behaviour that you would never condone?

offend my hosts? i was the host. who do you think got the dog drunk? the kid was already half gone by the time the in laws arrived for dinner. like father - like son. a genuinely likeable family. not uptight, in the least.

I didn't need to look in my crystal ball.

Next thing we know, you'll be telling us about the opium parties...

Edited February 12, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[justashooter 430]

opium is not used in central china. mj is available, but not commonly seen. penalties for trafficking in narcotics are severe.

drunkenness is part of the culture of central china, just like smoking. families do not let members become intoxicated to the point of immediate health risk. staff in restaraunts/hotels/KTV do not let this occur, either. people in china take care of drunks. you don't have people dying of alcohol intoxication in china, like you do at american and european universities. by the time chinese kids go to school, they already know what alcohol is.

you are projecting your own weakness, my friend.

[chri'stina 190]

kids drink beer in china freely, even at the age of 2-3. nothing funnier than watching my 2 year old nephew and the beagle we had in louyang, both drunk, wrestling over an olympic doll on the floor in the middle of a big family dinner. kids don't generally like cigarettes, but Peter the dog does.

I am sure you had to laugh so as not to offend your hosts and you realize of course that this was totally inappropriate behaviour that you would never condone?

offend my hosts? i was the host. who do you think got the dog drunk? the kid was already half gone by the time the in laws arrived for dinner. like father - like son. a genuinely likeable family. not uptight, in the least.

Wow, that's horrible getting or letting a child get drunk.

kids drink beer in china freely, even at the age of 2-3. nothing funnier than watching my 2 year old nephew and the beagle we had in louyang, both drunk, wrestling over an olympic doll on the floor in the middle of a big family dinner. kids don't generally like cigarettes, but Peter the dog does.

I am sure you had to laugh so as not to offend your hosts and you realize of course that this was totally inappropriate behaviour that you would never condone?

offend my hosts? i was the host. who do you think got the dog drunk? the kid was already half gone by the time the in laws arrived for dinner. like father - like son. a genuinely likeable family. not uptight, in the least.

Careful now shooter, you know the typical thinking: a kids drinks beer one time "you" are a despicable person... feed a kid until he is fat as a pig... "no problem".

Drinks beer ONE time? One time=drunk? I don't think so. You think parents feed their kids to make them fat? But we all know what will happen if you let a toddler drink a lot. Are you both that nuts? I don't care if that's crossing the TOS to say that. You are either both pulling our legs to rile people up or you are both crazy.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I guess it goes to show that you can't argue morality with someone who is fundamentally amoral.

[Peikko 1,575]

opium is not used in central china. mj is available, but not commonly seen. penalties for trafficking in narcotics are severe.

drunkenness is part of the culture of central china, just like smoking. families do not let members become intoxicated to the point of immediate health risk. staff in restaraunts/hotels/KTV do not let this occur, either. people in china take care of drunks. you don't have people dying of alcohol intoxication in china, like you do at american and european universities. by the time chinese kids go to school, they already know what alcohol is.

you are projecting your own weakness, my friend.

Yeah, sure, was I being facetious re opium? Sure, I was. However, your cavalier attitude to the effects of alcohol on a 2 year old tells its own story. A 2 year old body is not able to deal with toxicity from alcohol - there is no 'safe' level unless we are talking medicinal proportions which will not get you drunk.

You probably thought it was funny to talk about your 'drunk' nephew. Perhaps he wasn't really drunk, I don't know, I wasn't there, but boasting about it like he was? Hmm, very odd. However, watching you move the goal posts to make yourself seem like a responsible adult is hilarious.

Had you been talking about a 12 year old, I would not be having this 'conversation', well unless we are really talking about drunk rather than experiencing mild effects of alcohol. Terrible really and no kid of mine will be getting drunk in my presence before they attain adulthood, and even then it's not something I would encourage.

Edited February 12, 2009 by Madame Cleo